How is this idea worth $30 million?

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Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
So now I really think the 30 mil was nothing but a smoke screen to generate a false market. If it really happened I think he would have accepted.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
Who knew there was such a demand for band aids????? We all need to quit our jobs and go sell band-aids now.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
1. the $30M never existed
2. this kid and/or his handlers are bonkers


It's like the ppl who get on Shark Tank just for the publicity and have no desire to make a deal. You can see the Sharks get real pissed when they get that feeling.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,656
687
126
Someone stupid. A small percentage of that would pay for a top flight education anywhere, and he'd still have plenty of bread left to be able to do whatever he's passionate about. I'm assuming that would include something other than building vending machines.

It would be unfortunate if he's holding out for a higher offer that could never materialize.

This. The kid was a fool and got some bad advice. He would've been set for life and had enough spare cash laying around to seed any other business ideas he had. Of course, I still can't believe this idea is worth that much, patents or not - it seems like a very pedestrian concept.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
I can't knock the game. Look at what candy crush got paid. Almost 6 billion. BILLION.
 

thesmokingman

Platinum Member
May 6, 2010
2,307
231
106
I can't knock the game. Look at what candy crush got paid. Almost 6 billion. BILLION.


They're buying a franchise that is real. I'd preface that by saying it's Activision, facepalm.


But this idea... it doesn't even sound legit if they can't afford to pay a minimum wage worker to sell for six hours.

"We noticed that it would cost too much to pay people minimum wage to sit at tournaments for six hours," he said. Then the vending machine idea struck.
 

SOFTengCOMPelec

Platinum Member
May 9, 2013
2,417
75
91
But it's a very limited marketplace - once you've sold them to Six Flags you won't be selling to those locations again. So very growth in the Six Flags marketplace. So of that $500,000 gross revenue, how much is profit? 50%? The cost of manufacturing a machine like that is surely pretty high, especially the initial run.

A general rule is that a company like this is worth 5x EBITDA, which is basically net income. This formula doesn't work until the company is better established of course, but let's assume that net income would need to be $6M in a year or two. That's NET income, even if the machines plus other overhead (wages, sales cost, etc.) "only" cost $1K per unit and they are sold for $5K, the gross revenue would need to be $7.5M, or 1,500 units - per year. So a sale of 100 units to Six Flags is a great start, but they have to have at least one of those big sales per month. And that 5x EBITDA rule assumes flat or steady growth....like I said, once you sell to the big targets, you can't easily sell to them again. Plus my theoretical profit margin of 80% is EXTREMELY optimistic, it's more likely closer to 20% than 80%.

Furthermore, what's the market for this device? Amusement park chains like Six Flags are a great market because a single sale is many units. Retail establishments (Walmart, grocery stores, drug stores, etc.) are not a market because they already sell that merchandise inside. Baseball parks, as mentioned, are another good market but there aren't that many with a central location - they are usually owned by municipalities so making 100 individual municipal sales will be much more expensive than one Six Flags sale. IMO the primary market would be somewhere like Six Flags where the customer would rather fill their gift shops with trinkets than first aid equipment and would rather sell it (increasing profits) than give it out for free. There is much less incentive for municipalities (and state parks, federal parks, etc.) to purchase them because they would be a cost center not an increased profit center.

I think you are basically saying that the business was OVERVALUED or even, wasn't even worth buying.

I tend to agree. Evaluating businesses, is a very complicated thing, full of huge pitfalls.

It's a bit like estimating how much a valuable artwork will sell for at auction ?

$100,000 usually.
$10,000 on a bad day.
$1,000,000 if rich bidders fight over it.

On the face of it, $30,000,000 does seem TOO MUCH.

If later posts, saying they now want $50,000,000 are correct. Then I think they have got greedy and/or want too much.

On some of the business TV shows. One somewhat often sees entrants, wildly overvalue their rather marginal business ideas. Refusing to accept, very generous offers.
tl;dr
Highly overvalue their business ideas, and refuse to listen to the reality of it.
 
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Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
I have a great idea for a vending machine that sells household cleaning products. Never know when you might wake up at 3AM and want to clean the shower and toilet. And find that you're totally out of Scrubbing Bubbles and Bowl Cleaner.

These people gravitate toward each other. Those who come up with worthless ideas, and those who pay millions of dollars for those ideas.
 

Imp

Lifer
Feb 8, 2000
18,829
184
106
I have a great idea for a vending machine that sells household cleaning products. Never know when you might wake up at 3AM and want to clean the shower and toilet. And find that you're totally out of Scrubbing Bubbles and Bowl Cleaner.

These people gravitate toward each other. Those who come up with worthless ideas, and those who pay millions of dollars for those ideas.

I saw we replace all vending machines with those stuffed animal claw machines. If you suck, you'll spend your entire salary to get one bottle of coke. Darwin FTW... The fittest will know how to claw hand.
 

elitejp

Golden Member
Jan 2, 2010
1,080
20
81
I just don't accept that he was actually offered 30mil check in hand. There are too many places where you can already buy small med items and only a very few places where a vending machine makes sense. But how you get a patent because you decide to put an aspirin in a vending machine rather than a coke is beyond me.
 

Mandres

Senior member
Jun 8, 2011
944
58
91
I don't believe he has a patent, at least not one that will stand up to a challenge.

Sent from my HUAWEI Y536A1 using Tapatalk
 

Hugo Drax

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2011
5,647
47
91
He made a poor decision.

At his age 30 million in SPY and reinvesting dividends, he would be better off in 10 years.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
What the fuck? I'm pretty sure I could buy an OTR vending machine and stock it with this stuff right? I mean the Japanese have taken vending to the next level already.
 

Sho'Nuff

Diamond Member
Jul 12, 2007
6,211
121
106
Well he has a patent so you can't just develop your own.

Not sure this is true. I've found articles from 2015 saying that the kid received a patent, but I can't find any patents in his name or in the name of his company in the USPTO database. I suspect that he applied for a patent in late 2015 but hasn't actually received one yet. That would explain why there is no record of it in any patent database (because patent applications do not become publicly available until 18 months after their earliest filing date).

As to the 30M valuation - he should have taken the initial offer because there is no data to support that valuation as his company currently stands.
 
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