How many of you are OS holdouts / luddites? Still clinging to your favorite OS?

[HeXen]

^Those are marketed for business types, usually comes with Xeon CPu's too. W7 is used because it's a more familiar and professionalized interface for employees and more business software is largely compatible or support offered with older OS's than new ones.

I don't think any OEM offers to sell to business's using an OS that many in the professional fields are not as familiar with and lack way less support for business software. My wife's work still uses XP because that's the only OS that their software supports. They flat out don't make that kind of software for any other OS version.

 

[Zaap]

^Those are marketed for business types, usually comes with Xeon CPu's too. W7 is used because it's a more familiar and professionalized interface for employees and more business software is largely compatible or support offered with older OS's than new ones.

Intel's brief on Workstation vs desktop:

From Computer Aided Design (CAD) to number-crunching to video editing, compared to a desktop PC an entry-level workstation will provide intelligent performance for many applications. Still, not everyone needs a workstation. A typical office worker running standard office applications such as word processing, e-mail, and presentation software will get all the performance needed from a standard business PC.

However, designers, engineers, financial analysts, and researchers running more demanding applications – rendering complex graphics, digital content creation, and financial analysis and computations – can expect to be more productive, creative, and satisfied using a workstation. Even office “power users” will most likely find that an entry-level workstation is a smart investment that enables new capabilities that can help increase productivity, improve reliability, and limit downtime.

So these are not for 'business users' as in office workerbees. They're for professionals that have very demanding, mission critical workloads where high output/no downtime is key.

Applications signed/optimized for workstation class computers are things like Photoshop, Maya, AutoCAD, Solidwords, 3DMax, AVID, etc.

I just find it telling that Windows 7 x64 is by far, still the go-to OS.

Personally, I don't mind Windows 10 (though I know several people that have had nothing but a nightmare with it) but it's a little dishonest not to realize Windows 7 still very much holds its own.

If it were just a case of holding out with an older OS, all MS OS's being equal, then Windows 8 would be the holdout. But Windows 8 was an unmitigated steaming POS. So much so, I think it left 8.1 in the lurch because 8.1 isn't bad.

 

[SimMike2]

As long as Windows Media Center works, I'll stick with Window 7.

 

[mv2devnull]

So these are not for 'business users' as in office workerbees. They're for professionals that have very demanding, mission critical workloads where high output/no downtime is key.

Its even more amazing than that. The "desktop" models are so minimally constructed, that
A) extension cards, like discrete GPU, do not fit in
B) PSU in them is not enough for the extra load
C) cooling is insufficient
In fact, the desktop models contain disclaimer that they are not meant for 24/7 100% loads. Desktops suffice for office workers.

For "compute/CAD" use you are directed to the "workstation" models, with at least triple price. (And those are skimpy too by our enthusiast standards.)


The OEMs are usually a bit sluggish to introduce new variants/models. That have working concepts (do not break what works) and want to clear their old stock. Even if the OEM does have new hardware models shortly, the middle men have old stock to sell. (Business/government is not likely to buy directly from the factory outlet.) In other words, the W7 lingering in the "workstation series" has probably other reasons that the merits of the available OS's.

 

[Zaap]

^ sorry that doesn't make much sense.

There are entry-level workstations for 'power user' office types (what I quoted from Intel said as much) and there are high end models that cost $10k and upward.

None of this has a thing to do with 'old inventory' or any the rest of that. Windows 7 is still the preferred OS for most workstation computers. Pick any make, any price/quality level and see for yourself.


As I said, its because when getting work done is critical, not playing games or web-surfing, many professionals want what works, and what's tried and true.

I also leaned long ago its silly to compare a workstation class computer to what say a gaming enthusiast would consider a high end system. They are completely different things. The workstation computer won't come close to the highest frame rates in whatever demanding video game vs a high end gaming rig ... but that's not what anyone is using it for.

Of course no one is doing CAD or SFX shots on a low end workstation. But the best gaming rig that handles the latest game best will fall on its ass compared to the workstation being used to do high end rendering and *error free* number crunching tasks with no crashes, no glitches, no downtime to speak of.

Different machines are better for different tasks.

Eventually no doubt windows 10 may dominate the workstation market as well, it just thus far doesn't offer anything over 7 that matters a hill of beans to many professional users workflow.

 

[HeXen]

Intel's brief on Workstation vs desktop:




So these are not for 'business users' as in office workerbees. They're for professionals that have very demanding, mission critical workloads where high output/no downtime is key.

Applications signed/optimized for workstation class computers are things like Photoshop, Maya, AutoCAD, Solidwords, 3DMax, AVID, etc.

I just find it telling that Windows 7 x64 is by far, still the go-to OS.

Personally, I don't mind Windows 10 (though I know several people that have had nothing but a nightmare with it) but it's a little dishonest not to realize Windows 7 still very much holds its own.

If it were just a case of holding out with an older OS, all MS OS's being equal, then Windows 8 would be the holdout. But Windows 8 was an unmitigated steaming POS. So much so, I think it left 8.1 in the lurch because 8.1 isn't bad.

I said business types meaning professional level applications. The Windows 7 is used because it is recommended for professional software support reasons. A lot of professional level software is not Windows 8/10 supported officially from the developer. Dell markets these desktops for that market, that's why they have Xeon CPU's..etc and include W7.
The business market is not just a single marketing segment anymore, it's divided to cope with the range of needs.

Anyway, this is not a gaming computer, nor is it from grandma, it fills a particular niche in the market place and that is why it has W7 which is my point.
If XP was still supported by MS, trust me, Dell would fill that market too for which they did up until that point. Dell also makes or did make Linux computers too.

 

[jkauff]

I was surprised by an announcement that the place I work, a very conservative and paranoid Federal agency, is upgrading to Win 10 at the end of the year. They're on 7 now. It caught my attention, I must admit.

I gave Win 10 a chance, but went back to 8.1. More stable, all the drivers are mature, and it doesn't call home all the time with who knows what information about me.

I'm tempted to grab the free version by the end of the month in the hope that the Anniversary build is better. Has anyone heard if the Anniversary edition will also allow you to roll back to Win 8.1? If not, I may just stay put.

 

[HeXen]

I was surprised by an announcement that the place I work, a very conservative and paranoid Federal agency, is upgrading to Win 10 at the end of the year. They're on 7 now. It caught my attention, I must admit.

I gave Win 10 a chance, but went back to 8.1. More stable, all the drivers are mature, and it doesn't call home all the time with who knows what information about me.

I'm tempted to grab the free version by the end of the month in the hope that the Anniversary build is better. Has anyone heard if the Anniversary edition will also allow you to roll back to Win 8.1? If not, I may just stay put.

W10 is way, way better now than it was upon release. But that goes for any OS, I remember when I first got W8, it was impossible for months.
Also, you can disable all of the telemetry, there are simple portable apps that will disable every form of it but you may want some such as location..etc.
I use the pay version of NTlite because with it I can see every component within windows and completely remove it permantely if I want.

I presume you don't use FB, Google or anything else like that because those use more sensitive data than Windows.

 

[thewhat]

Also, you can disable all of the telemetry

Not officially. That is, Microsoft doesn't provide a way to do that in Windows 10.
Some third party apps might be able to disable it, but who knows what they really do. I don't think any serious company/agency would want to use them.

 

[jkauff]

I presume you don't use FB, Google or anything else like that because those use more sensitive data than Windows.

I've always assumed that anything I do on the web is potentially out there for someone to access and use. If I ever need to do something secret, I know how to do that.

It's much creepier to me that my OS is tracking everything (perhaps) I do on my computer and sending it back to Microsoft. Not only is it Orwellian, it's none of Microsoft's business what programs I run or what I do with them.

 

[WelshBloke]

It's much creepier to me that my OS is tracking everything (perhaps) I do on my computer and sending it back to Microsoft. Not only is it Orwellian, it's none of Microsoft's business what programs I run or what I do with them.

Yep. This is nothing like Facebook. I chose what I put on Facebook, they don't get to rifle through my hard drive as they see fit.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

I see no reason to upgrade at this time. Like 7-64 for gaming, writing (Word 2013) and general surfing, e-mail. That's not to say I will NEVER get Win 10...just see no reason to get it now. Also do not like having no control over upgrades. Win 7 works fine for me..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

 

[HeXen]

Not officially. That is, Microsoft doesn't provide a way to do that in Windows 10.
Some third party apps might be able to disable it, but who knows what they really do. I don't think any serious company/agency would want to use them.

You're right but any serious agency/company would use a custom build of Linux/BSD or other with a fully encrypted hard drive along with some serious protocols that all employees must adhere to, however the latter is always the weak spot and this where it dips into their pocket book so they decide based on that.
Any company that chooses Windows is doing it most likely for the official support, employee level of comfort/knowledge and cost of long term maintenance and IT level of training.

But my comment on disabling telemetry was geared towards personal use. If you're interested to see what individual components Windows has in it, you can load it up in NTlite. Outside of that, the good comfort zone for the paranoid types would likely be a Linux distro

I've always assumed that anything I do on the web is potentially out there for someone to access and use. If I ever need to do something secret, I know how to do that.

It's much creepier to me that my OS is tracking everything (perhaps) I do on my computer and sending it back to Microsoft. Not only is it Orwellian, it's none of Microsoft's business what programs I run or what I do with them.

You should be more creeped out about your ISP provider. They can and keep records for everything that goes in/out of your computer. Fact is, if we want internet access, a variety of companies are obtaining data, not just MS. Simply read your license agreements and if they cross it then sue them. I mean seriously what else can anyone really do? I do notice thought that it doesn't matter what I use to access the internet, no men in black have knocked on my door, I still get spam in my emails, I still get solicitors on all my phones and it appears nothing is different either way I go. If I never got online ever, my life would likely be the same but more boring perhaps.

I see no reason to upgrade at this time. Like 7-64 for gaming, writing (Word 2013) and general surfing, e-mail. That's not to say I will NEVER get Win 10...just see no reason to get it now. Also do not like having no control over upgrades. Win 7 works fine for me..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

Unless you want DX 12. Plus W10 gaming performance is good. I only use Windows for my gaming rig and my gaming rig is strictly set to boot to Steam and does nothing else so I go for whichever has the best performance and gaming compatibility. Unfortunately SteamOS is crap, worse performance, worse library and doesn't even support VR atm.
My Macbook Pro does everything else.

 

[nemesismk2]

my copy of windows xp pro just updated with Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool - July 2016 (KB890830)

does anyone know how long microsoft will keep doing the Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool each month?

 

[bruceb]

I don't care if they continue to do the Malicious Software Removal Tool or Windows Defender ... on my computers I run Avast Free Antivirus along with SpybotSD and SpywareBlaster to immunize against bad sites. I also have MalwareBytes just in case it is needed to get rid of something (not running real time, but there if a scan is needed)

 

[nemesismk2]

i don't go online much with windows xp (only if i have to) and i have paid anti virus with firewall and paid MalwareBytes

 

[C1]

In today's news:

France orders Microsoft to stop collecting excessive data from users
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/france-says-orders-microsoft-stop-164646596.html

 

[Dude111]

I heard that....I wonder if they will ?

 

[nemesismk2]

i very much doubt that they will listen to anyone just like google

 

[Anomaly1964]

I'm sticking with Windows 7 for now...

 

[nerp]

MY MCE rig I mentioned earlier in this thread is now running Windows 10 and MCE is gone. It installed beautifully and is much faster than on 7. Using it as a second machine for various tasks. It's happy with its new life. I no longer run a machine running Windows 7. I do, however, still have my trusty Windows Home Server v1 machine running, which is really just Server 2003 with a WHS control panel and the legendary drive extender storage system. I might need to update my sig but it currently has 2x2TB, 1x 1.5TB, 2x1TB, 1x800GB, 1x640GB and 3x500GB drives all churning away. The 2TB drives are new, the 1.5 is 3 years old, the TB drives are 2 years old, the 640 is 6 years old and so are the 500GB ones. I think the oldest is 7, not sure. All kicking ass and taking names according to Crystal Disk. Will keep this box going for a long time.

 

[balloonshark]

I upgraded my main two machines this week and then immediately "downgraded" back to Windows 8.1. I also imaged before and after the upgrade so I can switch if need be but I doubt that will happen.

 

[Jeff7]

For context, my dad still uses Office 97. It does everything he needs it to do.
He does at least have Win7.
He does not take well to UI changes.
It looks like Win7 security updates will be available until 2020, so I'm in no rush to do an update there.


Mom's PC: Moving to Win10 seems to have disabled all Internet connectivity, so Teamviewer's out of the question. I'll try to troubleshoot it by phone if possible, or else just do a rollback to Win7. It's not a brand-spankin'-new machine, but it's not what I'd call "old" either, so that was a bit of a surprise to me that the network is out of commission.


Me: Work PC is Win10. Main PC is Win10. Tablet is Win10.
The tablet's given me the most headaches. The biggest one is that Flicks no longer work with a finger, and instead require the stylus. That was really handy: Swipe left/right for Back/Forward in any application. It made for very easy navigation in videos, and of course the obvious use of simple-to-use back/forward functionality. It also meant very little risk of losing the stylus.

There are some nice changes. Having any program set to Always-on-top would mess with Alt+Tab's sorting. That seems to have been fixed. The ribbon in Explorer is actually nicely set up and very usable. Keyboard shortcuts there have been retained and work well. File transfers can be paused.
It's different and comes with a bit of a learning curve, but it feels like it's a net improvement.

It was also a reasonably trouble-free upgrade process, which I'm sure was no small task on Microsoft's part.

 

[Dude111]

For context, my dad still uses Office 97

Excellent,this is g00d to hear Jeff

 

[denis280]

Windows 10 is not that bad.But i am still using 7 because of windows media player and Games,and also the look of it,and maybe from now till 2020 windows will come out with something else:biggrin: