How much do Doctors and Lawyers get paid?

Akali

Junior Member
Jul 15, 2013
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I want to become either a doctor or lawyer. I am not going have my choice influenced by money, but just as a fact I want to know how much each of these professions is paid.
 

Zeze

Lifer
Mar 4, 2011
11,210
1,080
126
This is such a general question.

A general physician (first time doc after all schooling + residency) makes $80-150k. But it's nothing when you're swimming in debt and have been in school for many many years. When you go for specialty (which is another 5-10 yrs), that's when you make big money.

Whoohoo, guessed it perfectly.


Same for lawyers. It's an oversaturated market. Only the top 1% of class will work for big firms and make bank. The other 99% of the class will become mediocre lawyers or ambulance chasers.

I know plenty of people that make good money just with bachelor's degree + climbing corp ladder vs all that time you spent in law/medical school.
 
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jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
This is such a general question.

A general physician (first time doc after all schooling + residency) makes $80-150k. But it's nothing when you're swimming in debt and have been in school for many many years. When you go for specialty (which is another 5-10 yrs), that's when you make big money.

Whoohoo, guessed it perfectly.


Same for lawyers. It's an oversaturated market. Only the top 1% of class will work for big firms and make bank. The other 99% of the class will become mediocre lawyers or ambulance chasers.

I know plenty of people that make good money just with bachelor's degree + climbing corp ladder vs all that time you spent in law/medical school.

In America, a general physician (General Practitioner) is someone that didn't finish residency, and quit after completing the first year. specialists are 2 - ?5? years of residency after the first (internship) year, depending on the field of specialization. Salaries are all over the place depending on what you practice and if you're teaching and doing research.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,716
417
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tbqhwy.com
This is such a general question.

A general physician (first time doc after all schooling + residency) makes $80-150k. But it's nothing when you're swimming in debt and have been in school for many many years. When you go for specialty (which is another 5-10 yrs), that's when you make big money.

Whoohoo, guessed it perfectly.


Same for lawyers. It's an oversaturated market. Only the top 1% of class will work for big firms and make bank. The other 99% of the class will become mediocre lawyers or ambulance chasers.

I know plenty of people that make good money just with bachelor's degree + climbing corp ladder vs all that time you spent in law/medical school.


while thats correct not all specialtys are 5+ years
normally its this
College 4 years
Med School 4 years
Resedencey 3-5 years - paid
fellowship - 1-x years depending - paid

I think when my bro in law finished med school he had something like 250k in student loans to pay back
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
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There's far more students graduating Law school than there are positions for working lawyers. And only the top few percent {...and mostly from top schools} make real bank after graduation.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/06/law_school_is_a_sham/


http://ideas.time.com/2013/03/11/just-how-bad-off-are-law-school-graduates/
 
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Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
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Find something else to do. Seriously. I don't know about law, but health care? You are going to hate what it's becoming.
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
Find something else to do. Seriously. I don't know about law, but health care? You are going to hate what it's becoming.

Yes and no. If the current doctors didn't poison the well by telling the med students and residents about the glory days, they new doctors wouldn't know no better.

Healthcare is still a very stable and consistent career. Though, if you don't truly love helping people, you may have a difficult time with residency as you're training in a county hospital and working inane hours to help people that have made horrible life choices. All while making peanuts.
 

nephilim2k

Member
Apr 5, 2013
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In the UK, a GP in NHS makes a minimum of £78k before any bonuses from meeting targets. A hospital Dr (non-specialist) will make around £85k. When you hit specialist level (depending on specialism) you will make anywhere between £100k-£150k.

If you become a lawyer over here, you will make (if you're lucky) £40k, and if you become a QC/Barrister, that jumps to around £70k. If you get to be a judge, you'll make around £90k
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
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docs had little to do with it. HMOs fucked over everyone

There are some good HMOs. It's the changing state of medicare that's started most of the current gripes by doctors. The insurance companies (including HMOs and PPOs) followed suit. There isn't much point in finding a cause to point a finger at these days, it's a new reality for doctors that they'll make less for procedures.
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,411
10
0
There's far more students graduating Law school than there are positions for working lawyers. And only the top few percent {...and mostly from top schools} make real bank after graduation.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/06/law_school_is_a_sham/


http://ideas.time.com/2013/03/11/just-how-bad-off-are-law-school-graduates/

Law field already imploded. Way too many people thought they would get rich and now there is gazzilion lawyers with no jobs.

Clients also tightened up their belts and it's no longer a wild west.....now you have thousands of kids that thought they would be rich not able to get jobs at all.

Within next 5 years I believe same thing will happen to Doctors as it's the field that's being overflooded right now.....and we all know healthcare is way overdue for some major changes.
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
1,778
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As with all industries, what you get paid depends on how many hours a week you work, whether you're male or female, where you live, and how good of a negotiator you are.

Doctors around here typically make $150k-200k for general practicioners. Some more, some less....but $165k is a good average. That's typically working 4 days a week in the office and occasionally rounding in hospitals on weekends. You can expect some offices to be busier than others depending on if it's a specialty office, walkin clinic, or outpatient facility doing procedures/followup appointments.

As for lawyers, I like to break that into 2 different groups. Either you work for a firm or you can be a corporate lawyer and work for a company/entity. Some of those positions get lumped in with HR. If you work for a firm, you may get paid more...you may get paid less. Depends on if you're a partner, how much business you do, and whether or not you are willing to work 60-90hrs a week. Lawyers typically bill for time collecting data and organizing it to be presented in court. That means, most of the time spent is not in a court room...it's doing research. I've known lawyers to make $80k out of school and get promoted to $120-150k, but it seems to be much more difficult for women in this industry....ie comparable worth and glass ceilings can be an issue.

Corporate lawyers sometimes pay a flat rate plus a bonus...whatever they can afford. That can be good or bad. I know a corporate lawyer making over 6 figures with an annual bonus that's 50% of thier salary.

If you're in bigger cities, with bigger cases....you can make a lot more money if you're good and willing to put in the hours. The biggest misconception is that those jobs are easy money. Most of them work you like dogs and require more school, on the job training, and compounded knowledge than most people are willing to learn. Having said that, there are many terrible doctors and lawyers out there. Docs that don't adjust medication or take time to do things right and lawyers that bill blindly or at a set rate despite what they actually put into a case.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,754
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In America, a general physician (General Practitioner) is someone that didn't finish residency, and quit after completing the first year. specialists are 2 - ?5? years of residency after the first (internship) year, depending on the field of specialization. Salaries are all over the place depending on what you practice and if you're teaching and doing research.
Not necessarily. The terms family physician and general practitioner have significant overlap in their meanings in North America, but some of them have completed a family medicine residency while others have not.

Furthermore, that one year of post med-school training you mention didn't have to be part of a residency. It was quite common for people to do a rotating internship, and then go into general practice after that. These rotating internship programs were completely independent of specific longer residency programs.
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
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while thats correct not all specialtys are 5+ years
normally its this
College 4 years
Med School 4 years
Resedencey 3-5 years - paid
fellowship - 1-x years depending - paid

I think when my bro in law finished med school he had something like 250k in student loans to pay back
Residency is paid, but most don't pay a typical salary. A friend of mine was making around $45k a year 5 years ago in his residency in Tennessee. That was working 40 hours a week, but free drug rep lunches padded that pay a little. When in debt, every little bit helps. I think he was most disappointed because after he completed his residency in TN, they wouldn't sign off on his medical license because he went to school out of the country and they didn't recognize the school he attended.....yet they allowed him to practice here as a resident. He moved back to California as a result of it.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,716
417
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tbqhwy.com
Residency is paid, but most don't pay a typical salary. A friend of mine was making around $45k a year 5 years ago in his residency in Tennessee. That was working 40 hours a week, but free drug rep lunches padded that pay a little. When in debt, every little bit helps. I think he was most disappointed because after he completed his residency in TN, they wouldn't sign off on his medical license because he went to school out of the country and they didn't recognize the school he attended.....yet they allowed him to practice here as a resident. He moved back to California as a result of it.

yea i think my bro in law was getting mid to high 50s in boston when in his resedency. kinda shitty TN did that, however ive heard of similar things before
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
Not necessarily. The terms family physician and general practitioner have significant overlap in their meanings in North America, but some of them have completed a family medicine residency while others have not.

Furthermore, that one year of post med-school training you mention didn't have to be part of a residency. It was quite common for people to do a rotating internship, and then go into general practice after that. These rotating internship programs were completely independent of specific longer residency programs.

Second point: you're right. I was over-simplifying.

First point: Those terms are improperly confused to the common American. That was the primary reason why my wife was so hesitant to choose Family Medicine as her specialty. There are also internists who choose to practice primary care. I'm sure the public would also lump in together with general practitioners.

In the end, she decided she was being silly. If she wanted to impress people, she could have gone into surgery (which she hated.) Instead, she chose a field she loves (family medicine) despite the perception it's not a prestigious as other specialties.
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
81
Residency is paid, but most don't pay a typical salary. A friend of mine was making around $45k a year 5 years ago in his residency in Tennessee. That was working 40 hours a week, but free drug rep lunches padded that pay a little. When in debt, every little bit helps. I think he was most disappointed because after he completed his residency in TN, they wouldn't sign off on his medical license because he went to school out of the country and they didn't recognize the school he attended.....yet they allowed him to practice here as a resident. He moved back to California as a result of it.

?!?!??!?!?!40 hours a week?!?!?!?!?!? man, that is a chill residency. My wife averages 70 - 80 hour weeks. And then there's the time at home to finish up paperwork.
 

Cappuccino

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2013
4,027
726
126
Simples. Go to a prestigiususysis Uni and get a 1st. You wont earn the max if you achieve a 2.2.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
166
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www.slatebrookfarm.com
Law field already imploded. Way too many people thought they would get rich and now there is gazzilion lawyers with no jobs.

Within next 5 years I believe same thing will happen to Doctors as it's the field that's being overflooded right now.....and we all know healthcare is way overdue for some major changes.

Uhhh, source for your prediction? I've always been under the impression that the number of doctors is fairly tightly controlled by the AMA by controlling how many students are allowed into med school.
 

jaedaliu

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2005
2,670
1
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Uhhh, source for your prediction? I've always been under the impression that the number of doctors is fairly tightly controlled by the AMA by controlling how many students are allowed into med school.

I think tighter control is on the number of residency spots available. I think there are more graduates each year than there are residency spots. I may be wrong. There are international residents that may be displacing some US candidates. Regardless, there are med school graduates that don't get placed into residency.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
Canadian doctors make on average $307,000 per year. Not bad for social health. No wonder my taxes are ludicrously high. Jobs are guaranteed too. Doctors are always in demand as long as you're willing to move to the middle of nowhere.

Of course the hours you work is insane, med school costs a fortune, and it takes forever to get certified. That's why practising medicine is a calling.

Of course the only qualification for being a lawyers is being a greasy scumbag. Hours are shorter too.
 
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