How obsolete are optical discs? Do you still use them?

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,481
10,140
126
I suppose I should put in a poll or two, but I'm too tired to think about doing that right now.

Just curious:
1) does your PC contain an optical drive?
2) do you burn media with it?
 

rchunter

Senior member
Feb 26, 2015
933
72
91
I have a bluray burner in my pc. Mostly used for ripping blurays. Haven't burned a disk in many months.
 

readymix

Senior member
Jan 3, 2007
357
1
81
I use them (Blu-ray) mainly for system images of the pristine variety. otherwise, the occasional windows iso or system utilities bootable when I don't have a spare usb. pictures that could be deleted but are saved and a disk from time to time to supplement the microSD in my cars head unit.

Not installed so I have to go fetch from the pc warehouse in the basement. It's a pioneer/Vantec job with esata.
 

chubbyfatazn

Golden Member
Oct 14, 2006
1,617
35
91
Yep. It's disconnected inside though - didn't wanna just put it in some box and forget about it.

Last time I burned was... iono 2010? Burned a copy of Windows for installation on a laptop without an ODD. I think I bought it in 2007 or 2008.
 

bigboxes

Lifer
Apr 6, 2002
39,215
12,037
146
Yeah, I was thinking of starting this same thread a few weeks ago. In the past, I used to back up all my stuff to optical discs. Made the switch to DVD-Rs when they came out. Had some nice burners back in the day. Later, when I went to recover some data off of those discs I found many could no longer be read. Also, there was file name limitations. With HDDs I just copy over to another HDD.

I used to burn music CDs. Now, everything is digital. I just copy them to my phone and I link to my Alpine receiver via Bluetooth. Can't be much simpler than that and it sounds great!

I used to burn movies to DVD. Whether it was duping someone else's disc or converting a torrent using software to DVD. I thought I would eventually go to Blu-Ray. Never happened. I went all digital. I copy to a removable flash drive and plug in to the Panny and watch hi-def rips without the hassle of loading up the Blu-Ray player. I have exactly ONE Blu-Ray disc. I have shelves of DVDs that I simply don't play any more. I copied all of them to my file server. My next computer project will be to build a bad ass HTPC to play back any type of file and for gaming. Blu-Rays will become fairly obsolete, but I'm still not sure if I will ever get a Blu-Ray burner. The jury is still out.

On my previous build, I started experimenting Windows installs with a bootable ISO on a flash drive when I had to work on clients PCs without optical drives. Guess what I used with my new build? That's right. I went without an optical drive. I feel kinda nekkid. A high-end build without cramming as much hardware as possible in the case. I still may spring for the upgraded sound card, but as of now I'm just using on-board (music volume is definitely lower).

So, no use of optical discs for music, video, data storage nor Windows installations. That pretty much seals it for me. Can't say that I don't put the occasional disc in the living room Blu-Ray player, but I see an end to optical discs.
 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,481
10,140
126
I use them (Blu-ray) mainly for system images of the pristine variety.

That's a pretty good idea. Are there imaging tools, that themselves run off of a bootable USB flash drive or disc, that can write to a USB or SATA optical drive to save the image to? Or is one better off, using a flash drive to boot the imaging tool, and imaging to a portable external HDD, and then taking that external HDD to a "main" PC with a BD-R drive, and burning the image file(s) to optical disc for longer-term storage?

I had someone ask me why I didn't make an image of a freshly-reformatted PC after I format it for a customer, so I could easily restore it. I didn't want to have to buy a fresh new portable external HDD for each customer, just to store their fresh OS image on, so now that I purchased some BD-R drives recently, burning a BD-R backup image of the fresh install is a lot more feasible.
 

Charlie98

Diamond Member
Nov 6, 2011
6,292
62
91
I used to burn music CDs. Now, everything is digital.

I used to be a big mix-master making CDs for when I was an over-the-road driver, both music and audio books sourced from cassettes... now everything I have is digital... music, movies, audio books... all ripped to the PC. I even own a pretty high-dollar Pioneer CD burner/duplicator (music) that I used the crap out of... that is languishing in the closet somewhere.

All of my PCs have OD drives in them, I had them when I built them, so I installed them... but I could certainly pull the one out of my GAME rig, but I actually use the others... the HTPC is obvious (rented DVDs, it's not a BD,) but I still use the DVD/BD drive in the Desktop to rip media and transcode.

I've burnt a few CDs, mostly rescue disks and such, but not so much any more. When these PCs are rebuilt, I'll most likely pull the OD drives and go to external, particularly because I will be going mITX cube.
 

Charlie98

Diamond Member
Nov 6, 2011
6,292
62
91
...so now that I purchased some BD-R drives recently, burning a BD-R backup image of the fresh install is a lot more feasible.

How long do you expect that image to remain stable? I've seen a lot of stuff on the unreliability of OD storage over time. I guess a reasonable shelf-life for something like that would be 3-5yrs, certainly the target PC would be turned over by then. Just guessing...
 

A I

Senior member
May 20, 2004
491
2
81
I rip movies that we buy on a weekly to bi-weekly basis. So yep, I still have optical drives and I use them
 

ArisVer

Golden Member
Mar 6, 2011
1,345
32
91
I have one in my old computer and a USB external one (used to be my notebook DVD). This year my DVD backups were 3 DVDs.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,119
10,403
136
I bought another 100 DVD spindle a few weeks ago. Apparently I used 24 in 2013 and 8 in 2014.

I also have an almost-requirement preference to buy music in CD format then I rip it to mp3 myself. I like having the physical media to play in CD players when that is occasionally required.
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
I have one in my main desktop PC. I think I burn a CD with it maybe once or twice a month.

For all of the other PCs in my home I have an external USB optical drive. I don't think I've used it in more than a year.
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
You're likely to use them at an increasing slower rate. Like floppy discs some years ago, you'll probably end up discovering a stack of 60 of them at the back of a shelf covered in dust and cobwebs about ten year from now.
 

Deders

Platinum Member
Oct 14, 2012
2,401
1
91
I still find a DVD player essential, but mostly comes in handy for other people rather than my own personal use. I've found that hard drives are cheaper in the long run for storage nowadays.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,481
10,140
126
You're likely to use them at an increasing slower rate. Like floppy discs some years ago, you'll probably end up discovering a stack of 60 of them at the back of a shelf covered in dust and cobwebs about ten year from now.

It was so easy to go through 100 of them a month, when Verizon had .bin N.G.
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
Last optical media I used on my home PCs was in 2006. Even at the work place, optical media havent been used for ages. I think we phased them out around 2008 there.

The only place I use it is the Wii U.
 
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Tsavo

Platinum Member
Sep 29, 2009
2,645
37
91
I have two optical drives in my box. One's nearsighted, and the other one is farsighted.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,119
10,403
136
You're likely to use them at an increasing slower rate. Like floppy discs some years ago, you'll probably end up discovering a stack of 60 of them at the back of a shelf covered in dust and cobwebs about ten year from now.

Considering my current primary use for them (secondary backup for downloaded files), I think that's quite unlikely, and the figures for my previous years' usage is very erratic because it largely depends on the amount I downloaded. I also sometimes use them for burning ISOs or giving data to customers when limited for time (ie. I don't want to wait for files to be transferred on-site), so not all of the discs I've used have been logged in the same way.

While I'm sure that new flash drives and/or HDDs will at some point be cheaper than a 100 pindle of DVD+Rs, IMO it's good not to have all my data and backups vulnerable in the same way. Also, it's much easier to keep a catalogue of small storage devices. Physical storage is easier as well, and possibly more efficient unless I changed entirely over to external portable HDDs (currently I use a docking bay and old internal HDDs); the DVDs are stored in sleeved CD/DVD wallets.
 
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Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
Considering my current primary use for them (secondary backup for downloaded files)

"Secondary" backup? So a backup for your primary backup?

While I'm sure that new flash drives and/or HDDs will at some point be cheaper than a 100 pindle of DVD+Rs

We're pretty much there already. A 100 spindle of DVD-Rs cost about $20. That's 4.38 GiB each, or 438 GiB total and $0.0457 per GB. A 3TB drive nets about 2770 GiB. At $100 each that's $0.0361 per GB.

And even cheaper when you think that your entire 100 disc spindle can be replaced by a single retired 500GB disk drive.

IMO it's good not to have all my data and backups vulnerable in the same way.

I don't see having two hard drive backups as "vulnerable in the same way". It's not like both will be rendered useless if one is lost in a fire or flood while the other is in your safe deposit box on the other side of town.

Also, it's much easier to keep a catalogue of small storage devices.

It's easier to catalog 100 discs than it is to catalog a single disc?

Physical storage is easier as well, and possibly more efficient unless I changed entirely over to external portable HDDs (currently I use a docking bay and old internal HDDs); the DVDs are stored in sleeved CD/DVD wallets.

Sorry. One HDD is much easier to store than 100 DVDs. Smaller, too.
 

BFG10K

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
22,709
2,990
126
I play Blurays, rip music CDs and occasionally buy games on physical media. I also rip older games' media to back it up.

I generally don't burn optical media though, unless there's some corner case. For portable backups I prefer my 1TB Passport, or even flash drives for non-critical temporary backups.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,119
10,403
136
"Secondary" backup? So a backup for your primary backup?

That and a backup for data that I don't regard as being that important. Also for burning ISOs or being able to drop off data with customers in scenarios where waiting for a transfer to complete isn't convenient.

We're pretty much there already. A 100 spindle of DVD-Rs cost about $20. That's 4.38 GiB each, or 438 GiB total and $0.0457 per GB. A 3TB drive nets about 2770 GiB. At $100 each that's $0.0361 per GB.
Considering that I still need to buy DVD recordables for the other usage scenarios I described, it's not a case or 'either or'. Furthermore, if I was going to buy a new HDD for backups, it would be a portable drive for size and ease of storage which comes in at £65 for 2TB, versus £20 (100 DVD spindle). My income makes a purchasing decision involving £20 a lot easier than one of £65 or more, especially when talking about backups for (most of the time) less important data.

And even cheaper when you think that your entire 100 disc spindle can be replaced by a single retired 500GB disk drive.
That would be when a retired working HDD comes along, which isn't that common in my line of work.

I don't see having two hard drive backups as "vulnerable in the same way". It's not like both will be rendered useless if one is lost in a fire or flood while the other is in your safe deposit box on the other side of town.
While it's useful to look at possible/specific disaster scenarios, considering that disasters (I'm using that term in a personal and relatively speaking way) don't often come in predictable forms, I think it's useful to simply look at the storage medium and analyse its vulnerabilities. I look at HDDs and see the following:

1 - Vulnerable to physical shock
2 - Vulnerable to strong magnetic fields (admittedly I have no idea how strong a field is required to cause problems)
3 - Easy to read/write (say if I made a mistake and my system got infected in some way, and I connected the backup device)
4 - Vulnerable to water damage
5 - Vulnerable to sudden drive death
6 - Vulnerable to steady drive death (bad sectors)

Of those, optical media is vulnerable to points 4 and 6. Optical media also has its own vulnerability that sometimes optical drives don't like certain formats or brands of disc (which is one reason why I have two optical drives connected to my PC). Optical media is considered not to have great longevity partly because of its increased vulnerability to point 4, but I haven't personally experienced this and I have recorded discs dating back about 15 years (which I've tested from time to time out of curiosity).

Considering a single layer DVD's lack of capacity, it's not as likely to get damaged in the same way that a HDD could be; I have little reason to get my backup DVDs out often whereas a backup HDD is likely to be in use as I would be backup up to it on a regular basis.

On the other hand, because I'm not likely to be reading or writing to a particular disc on a regular basis, one could say that undetected creeping death for optical media is more likely unless the discs are tested reasonably regularly. But then any backup device ought to have its data integrity tested.

It's easier to catalog 100 discs than it is to catalog a single disc?
Admittedly my point here had flaws. When I back up to a DVD I immediately note in a spreadsheet what I've backed up and when, and I also number the discs. Retiring a DVD is less problematic, I simply snap the disc in two after checking that the original/live data is OK, and there's less data to consider. I'm always more nervous about deleting retired files from say a backup HDD.

Sorry. One HDD is much easier to store than 100 DVDs. Smaller, too.
The internal 3.5" HDDs I have aren't easier to store (IIRC, 1x 250GB, 1x 320GB, 1x 400GB and 1x 500GB). While I have two nice Samsung plastic cases that came with some drives I once bought, they're not common in my experience, which means I have to otherwise bag the drives in anti-static bags and stack them, double-checking that when I stack them, the circuit boards aren't flat against the surface of the drive beneath. This normally isn't an issue if the drives are identical brand ones, but mine aren't all the same brand. Storing them in a stacked criss-cross fashion would probably be safe, but bagged cross-cross stacked drives use up a lot of room and it's not easy to determine which drive is which (unless I start putting stickers on the bags).
 
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snickersnack

Member
Feb 14, 2012
34
0
61
I still put optical drives in my workstations. I like to run linux liveCDs on WORM media for secure web browsing or checking the contents of hard drives I don't trust.

I also still burn discs. Maybe 10-15 a year. They're mainly for liveCDs or moving files to suspect computers. I don't use them for backups.
 
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