How the hell could we nuke Japan?!

[ScottyB]

My Grandpa was in a Japanese prison camp for three years, was also on the Baton death march. When America liberated the camp, he killed the commander of the camp with his own baton and took his sword, which we still have. My mom always bitches about MacArthur, and calls him a coward.

 

[FrancesBeansRevenge]

<< Fsck em, they would have done it to us if they could have. I'll tell you what, I don't lose a bit of sleep over it. >>



No, no, no Red Dawn don't you know it's just us evil Americans that do things like that?

 

[PistachioByAzul]

The same reason people like you 'get on a moral high horse' about the military response to the attacks.

Where have I done that? I'm trying to point out the relativity of the situation to these people running around like Hatfields telling everyone just how bad the McCoys are. If everyone weren't 100% confident that their cause is completely justified then there would be no war.

 

[goob2k]

<< Correct me If I am wrong, but I beleive the US had 5 bombs, and 5 targets. Tokyo was next if they didn't surrender, along with 2 more after that. Again, correct me if I am wrong. >>



Tokyo was not a target. Tokyo was seriously fire-bombed and it was pointless to test the atomic bomb's power on burned wood and rubble. I heard somewhere that there were only three bombs. The first was detonated in July 1945 in New Mexico to see if the complex plutonium idea would work. The uranium bomb that was dropped on Hiroshima was so simple that it didn't need testing. The one dropped on Nagasaki was of the same design as the one detonated in New Mexico. I seem to remember that the one dropped on Nagasaki was the last and it was an all or nothing gamble to get Japan to surrender.

 

[FrancesBeansRevenge]

<< The same reason people like you 'get on a moral high horse' about the military response to the attacks.

Where have I done that? I'm trying to point out the relativity of the situation to these people running around like Hatfields telling everyone just how bad the McCoys are. If everyone weren't 100% confident that their cause is completely justified then there would be no war. >>



Ahhh.... okay I must admit I just lumped you into the common 'left-wing' opinions about the US military response.
You know the 'violence has never solved anything!' and 'two wrongs don't make a right!' and 'this isn't justice it's revenge!' crowd.
My bad.

I actually agree with you. Both sides feel that they belong to the justified camp. It is indeed all about perspective.
IMHO, there is no bad guy and no good guy. There is only 'us' and 'them'. Knowing that, I pick 'us'. Fsck 'them'.

To borrow a slogan from Al Davis 'Just win, baby!'.

 

[fatbaby]

The japanese have done some pretty terrible things...read "the rape of nanking"

One instance is where they built a massive human size freezer to test the effects of cold on prisoners and to see how long they can last

And for those who think japan didn't surrender after the 1st bomb was dropped because they were stupid/cruel etc, Tokyo (generals wouldn't believe the news at first)

I believe the emperor of japan wanted to surrender at first because he realized defeat, but was afraid, because the war-loving generals would assinate him. So Japan prepared and dug in for invasion: hundreds of caves in remote locations were stocked up with supplies for months, civilians were armed...etc

If the generals were in command, they would of rather fought to the very end instead of surrendering

 

[Pacfanweb]

<<If I remember correctly more people died in the fire-bombing of Dresden. War is hell, nice things don't happen. A mainland invasion of Japan? I don't even want to think about it. >>

Yes, more people died in Dresden. The Brits were right in targeting German civilians.....who do you think was working in the factories that produced war material for the German army? Civilians. They were legitimate targets. It was a declared war. The German people as a whole were behind the war effort. That is beyond disputable.

<<And actually, the firebombing of Tokyo killed more people than the dropping of the bomb. >>

True. I have a book that has an aerial picture of Tokyo after the fire bombing.....it is unreal.

Also not mentioned is how many millions of leaflets we dropped in Japan on a target BEFORE we bombed it....we told them the date we were going to bomb, and told the civilians to "see how powerless your air force is to stop us". They had fair warning.
And, like in Germany, who do you think was working in Jap war factories? Not soldiers.

Who are the idiots that are saying the casualties of an invasion of the Jap mainland were overestimated?
Do you realize that they were arming women and children with bamboo spears? Do you think they WOULDN'T have fought us?
Would you feel better if our soldiers landed and slaughtered hundreds of thousands of civilians that tried to stop us?
Can anyone legitimately argue that it wasn't better to drop ONE bomb, kill a whole lot less Japanese and NO MORE Americans?

The Japanese, in WWII, were a barbaric, primitive thinking people.

Read about the rape of Nanking

They would not have surrendered. If not for the Emperor, they wouldn't have surrendered after the second atomic bomb.

I'm glad we dropped the bombs. They absolutely saved lives. Anyone who looks at ALL the evidence and says otherwise is a complete idiot.
A lot of you little punks that are criticizing the US for dropping the bombs wouldn't have even been here if not for the bomb, because some of your grandfathers would have been killed invading Japan.

 

[CocaCola5]

The fact that war is the way it is, rightfully led the United Nations to established certain rules for war post ww2.

 

[TheOmegaCode]

<<

<< Correct me If I am wrong, but I beleive the US had 5 bombs, and 5 targets. Tokyo was next if they didn't surrender, along with 2 more after that. Again, correct me if I am wrong. >>



Tokyo was not a target. Tokyo was seriously fire-bombed and it was pointless to test the atomic bomb's power on burned wood and rubble. I heard somewhere that there were only three bombs. The first was detonated in July 1945 in New Mexico to see if the complex plutonium idea would work. The uranium bomb that was dropped on Hiroshima was so simple that it didn't need testing. The one dropped on Nagasaki was of the same design as the one detonated in New Mexico. I seem to remember that the one dropped on Nagasaki was the last and it was an all or nothing gamble to get Japan to surrender. >>


This is a good link on the bombs...

 

[AaronP]

how many japs would have died if we had a long, drawn out land invasion? you fool.

 

[Pacfanweb]

<<Tokyo was not a target. Tokyo was seriously fire-bombed and it was pointless to test the atomic bomb's power on burned wood and rubble.>>

Wrong. Tokyo was the next target. A third bomb was being readied.

Nagasaki was actually a secondary target. The primary was Kokura.

Truman gave the Japs an ultimatum before Hiroshima. Truman also again appealed to the Japs to surrender after Hiroshima, or "expect a rain of ruin from the air, the like of which has never been seen on this earth".
Still, they refused.

BTW, for whoever it was that said Russia was helping us in Okinawa, that is false. Russia declared war on Japan at the last minute, just so they could seize the Kurile Islands.

 

[im2smrt4u]

<< Japan was not going to surrender and a land invasion of mainland Japan would have been necessary. Many more lives would have been lost that way...Ever hear of the rape of Nanking? Bataan Death March? etc... >>



Agreed! A land invasion of Japan would have been really bad. It would probably result in more deaths than those two bombings.

Bottom line: it had to end somehow and it did. 'Nuf said.

 

[Pennstate]

There were ~25-30 million deaths (civilian and military) in WWII due to Japan. Killing ~100,000 to stop the carnage is a bargain!
BTW, there is no civilian and military distinction in the Japanese Shogun mentality. The kamakazee pilots at the end were mere teens.

 

[etech]

<< Who says war has to be declared? Who says civilians aren't acceptable targets? War is whatever works, whatever means necessary, I thought we'd established that? >>



Going by that logic, Israel would be fully justified in leveling Jenin and any other Palestinian town which harbored terrorists attacking them.

 

[PistachioByAzul]

Of course I "choose us" as well, but I don't think a "fsck them" approach is what's required to make peace. Bygones should be bygones, as the most powerful country in the world we need try harder to follow the way of the peaceful warrior, if you will.

 

[Red Dawn]

<< Of course I "choose us" as well, but I don't think a "fsck them" approach is what's required to make peace. Bygones should be bygones, as the most powerful country in the world we need try harder to follow the way of the peaceful warrior, if you will. >>

Jeez it seems our little Conservative Warrior from Bezerkley has been influenced by the Nutz there

 

[PistachioByAzul]

What's stopping them? Israel would be held accountable. Palestine is not a country, there is no single organized effort. They live in squalor, they have nothing to lose.

 

[PistachioByAzul]

Jeez it seems our little Conservative Warrior from Bezerkley has been influenced by the Nutz there

I wouldn't want to give them any credit, hah.

 

[blade]

From this link someone posted:

As early as 1940 both the Japanese Army Air Force and the Navy were thinking that an atomic bomb device might be possible to construct. Typically the two services pursued the idea separately instead of working together ( the Army and Navy in Japan rarely cooperated on anything. ) By 1944 only the Navy project headed by the N-group was still active. The Imperial Navy sponsored the research at the University of Kyoto with the Riken laboratory complex in Tokyo being the major site for research and development. The Japanese atomic bomb effort faced numerous problems including the lack of many basic supplies and enough scientists and engineers. But a key component that's required to make a bomb was constructed - a uranium separator. This device separates uranium-235, which is useful in making a chain reaction, from uranium-238, which is not very useful. Uranium ore or uranium oxide can't be used as is for a bomb without some type of enrichment process since it is made up almost entirely of uranium-238.

The massive bombing raids on Tokyo eventually destroyed over half of the city and not by design but as incidental damage the Riken laboratory was gutted by the raging fires in early 1945. The Japanese were not close to having a working bomb at this time but certainly the intention was to build one and use it against the enemy.

 

[poopaskoopa]

<< how many japs >>


Watch your mouth, bitch.

 

[Cremaster]

sbastedo,
why do you think we cut off their supplies? Because they were cute little pokemons? F#ck NO!! They slaughtered WAY more than the 60,000 "innocent" civilians the bombs killed and would not have stopped until we were all speaking Japanese. (if then)

 

[AAjax]

Ok ok why dont we just admit it, we Americans just like to kill people for no good reason. We are evil and the rest of the world is a bunch of saints. We are the ones who should have surrendered after Pearl harbor, and we are so thick headed that the Japaneese had to bomb our war ships because we in no way could have grasped their first choice of bombing a deserted island to show their overwelming strength.


Idealism is nice, in theory but this is the real world. You might grasp that concept in a couple years (or maybe not)

 

[etech]

Did the Nazis inadvertently fuel U.S. atom bombs?

"Japan was working on its own atomic bomb when the United States dropped atomic bombs on two Japanese cities, Hiroshima and Nagasaki in August 1945.
The U.S. Navy captured a German submarine in 1945, bound for Japan, with a cargo that included uranium oxide, a key ingredient for atomic bombs. A 1995 story from the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reported this historical discovery. "


EngineNr9
They live in squalor, they have nothing to lose.

The reason they live in squalor and have nothing to lose is that is the way the Arab countries have wanted it to be. The Palestinians are being used as disposable pawns in a proxy war by the Arab countries against Israel.

 

[AAjax]

<<
They live in squalor, they have nothing to lose.

The reason they live in squalor and have nothing to lose is that is the way the Arab countries have wanted it to be. The Palestinians are being used as disposable pawns in a proxy war by the Arab countries against Israel. >>




Very well said

 

[microAmp]

<<

<< The problem was that the U.S. only had two working nukes at that time. The U.S. did not want to risk the chance of dropping a dud over a uninhabitated island somewhere in Japan and have the Japanese military laughing their (_|_)'s. Furthermore, bear in mind that, the Japanese refused to surrender after seeing the effects of the first atomic bomb. >>



Correct me If I am wrong, but I beleive the US had 5 bombs, and 5 targets. Tokyo was next if they didn't surrender, along with 2 more after that. Again, correct me if I am wrong. >>



3 really, 1 for testing to make sure it works and 2 for Japan.