HP: WebOS is being opensourced

sciwizam

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2004
1,953
0
0
http://www.precentral.net/hp-open-source-webos-no-hardware-plans-or-partners-announced

HP plans to make the underlying code of webOS available as part of an open source license, allowing anybody from a homebrew developer to a manufacturer to pick it up and make their own enhancements and versions. HP will also “engage the open source community” about the rules of the webOS open source project, and laying out a few promises of their own.

  • The goal of the project is to accelerate the open development of the webOS platform
  • HP will be an active participant and investor in the project
  • Good, transparent and inclusive governance to avoid fragmentation
  • Software will be provided as a pure open source project
HP also intends to contribute the Enyo application framework to the open source community in the near future. So at least that will have the opportunity to live on.
:thumbsup:
 

Red Storm

Lifer
Oct 2, 2005
14,233
234
106
HP does something right for once.

Looking forward to what the community does with it!
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Yeah, it worked so well for Symbian...

Shocked you're already willing to pooh-pooh something not about apple.

Shocked you forgot our rules against personal attacks
-ViRGE
 
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Mopetar

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2011
8,061
6,640
136
Shocked you're already willing to pooh-pooh something not about apple.

He actually has a good point though. Symbian was open sourced and it didn't help much. In the end it was Nokia the drove development and now that they've stopped active development it's almost completely dead.

Also, let's leave the usual name-calling out of the discussion. It's getting old.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
56
Shocked you're already willing to pooh-pooh something not about apple.

Web OS is already a footnote.

Also, if you kept up with the threads, you'd know I have a Flyer and a PlayBook as well as iOS devices.

The Flyer is pretty sweet for a single core device, and I have a feeling if RIM isn't bankrupt (unlikely) or bought out, that they'll spend their last million loonies on making QNX a decent OS...

With your permission lupe, I choose to support devices with OS's that aren't essentially dead.
 
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Red Storm

Lifer
Oct 2, 2005
14,233
234
106
I'm only glad cause this means they aren't going to bury Web OS in a filing cabinet somewhere. Going open source means it's still alive. I don't think anyone is expecting it to actually become a legit competitor to the main players.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
He actually has a good point though. Symbian was open sourced and it didn't help much. In the end it was Nokia the drove development and now that they've stopped active development it's almost completely dead.

Also, let's leave the usual name-calling out of the discussion. It's getting old.

In the end does open sourcing do anything other than allow a company to wash their hands of it? Open source sounds great in theory. In practice it leads to long delays and squabbling about what needs to be implemented. OpenGL died in gaming a decade ago. It is now slowly being replaced by DX in the professional space. OpenCL has never taken off. Linux? Owns about 1% of the desktop market. In the server market is does better when a company is pushing the technology and providing the support.

This is HPs way of saying we give up. Here is our OS that nobody cares about.
 

Stang289

Senior member
Oct 7, 2000
204
0
0
If HTC gets tired of paying M$ for android or doesn't like the way things are going with Googlerola, maybe they will put out some nice hardware with webOS. I switched from a Palm Pre Plus to a Droid Bionic, and I miss webOS. I love the bionic hardware and the app selection in android, but android is a bit disappointing.
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,197
126
Maybe Facebook will do an OS based on WebOS source code. Would be a great fit for them.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
56
In the end does open sourcing do anything other than allow a company to wash their hands of it? Open source sounds great in theory. In practice it leads to long delays and squabbling about what needs to be implemented. OpenGL died in gaming a decade ago. It is now slowly being replaced by DX in the professional space. OpenCL has never taken off. Linux? Owns about 1% of the desktop market. In the server market is does better when a company is pushing the technology and providing the support.

This is HPs way of saying we give up. Here is our OS that nobody cares about.

Or the subtext "No one offered us enough money for it..."
 

Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,505
2,249
136
The webOS followingers rank up there with the Apple followers. I'm sure many are happy with the news. A lot of the not so good things are fixable once the source code is available.
 

MrX8503

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2005
4,529
0
0
WebOS should have been open sourced from the beginning. It may be too late for them.
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,197
126
By 2013, Touchpad owners are all going to be running Ice Cream Sandwich CM9, and never give WebOS another look.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
56
i am thinking, and long ago too, that HP "flubbed" their tablet on purpose, gets a coupla million sold at 99 bucks, goes open source, generates huge interest, come BACK into the tablet market with eager cult following to buy their product.

I wouldn't give them that much credit.

They had a serious group of fans with the OS already, it didn't help retail sales.

By 2013, Touchpad owners are all going to be running Ice Cream Sandwich CM9, and never give WebOS another look.

I suspect they'll more likely be gathering dust in a corner, replaced by the next big thing... The batteries will be toast by then, and quad core tablets will be the norm.
 

hans007

Lifer
Feb 1, 2000
20,212
17
81
If HTC gets tired of paying M$ for android or doesn't like the way things are going with Googlerola, maybe they will put out some nice hardware with webOS. I switched from a Palm Pre Plus to a Droid Bionic, and I miss webOS. I love the bionic hardware and the app selection in android, but android is a bit disappointing.

how would it make any difference.

if they used webOS they'd still be infinging on the same "patents" given they are not HP and dont have that IP just becuase webOS is open source unless HP contributes all of palm's IP to some free patent for everyone consortium.


webOS is dead. HP will give it to developers who of course will not do enough with it for it to be a real platform as there just aren't enough resources unless some other big company takes over the project and really supports it (and why woudl they, you have android for free already and you would risk way less. i mean if HP couldnt make webOS work, its probably a huge financial risk for anyone else to try). but in making the announcement about open sourcing webOS and not just killing it completely (its worthless they know it) they are just putting out good PR so the geek community won't hate them.

I find it disappointing how naive the geek community seems to be sometimes when companies do things for PR reasons. this announcement was a funeral. they will not put any resources into it and just let the OSS community have the code which is a nice gesture but in the end webOS as its own entity just died today. hopefuilly some of the code or ideas will live on in other products etc. but the odds of this starting some sort of revival are very small.
 

BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,365
16
0
I can't believe they think that they can resuscitate it after it's been dead a whole year.

If they would have made it open source from the beginning, it might have meant something. Now it's just good for a press release.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
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Lifted from The Verge's interview:

We've just had a chance to sit down with HP's CEO Meg Whitman and board member Marc Andreessen to discuss the future of webOS given today's announcement. Both Meg and Marc were eager to talk about webOS not as a dead end, but an active platform which the company would continue to put resources and cash against. Most surprising of all? The company plans to create new webOS hardware... including tablets. We've transcribed the full conversation — so read on below.

Will HP be creating any new webOS hardware?

Meg: The answer to that is yes but what I can't tell you is whether that will be in 2012 or not. But we will use webOS in new hardware, but it's just going to take us a little longer to reorganize the team in a quite different direction than we've been taking it in the past.

Are we talking printers? Or tablets and phones?

Meg: In the near term what I would imagine — and this could change, in full disclosure — is I would think tablets, I do not believe we will be in the smartphone business again.

But tablets are a real possibility?

Meg: Yes.

So how will this new webOS team be structured? Will Marc run a webOS Foundation like Mozilla? Will there be a division? Will it be part time for HP engineers?

Meg: So we will keep the core group of employees together - those who want to sign up for this new vision. Admittedly, this is a different vision than webOS had for themselves. That was more akin to a closed-loop system, more like Apple in many ways, and now we're going to an open system. So we will keep the core group together, there will be leadership as there has been, and HP will continue to invest in this. The exact organizational structure we do not know yet — we've looked at Mozilla, Hadoop, Red Hat, and we want to think through that. Many of those models have been successful, we may come up with an alternative model on how we want to organize this. But there will be a dedicated team of resources to this, with the first backer being HP.

But that will be a webOS-dedicated team, a webOS team.

Meg: Correct.

Are there going to be pieces of webOS or IP that you hold onto, that will be HP-only?

Marc: In general, the intent is to open source webOS — so the idea is to open source webOS in its entirety...

Meg: Including Enyo.

Marc: Including Enyo. By the way, there are some current components of webOS — in its current form — that are not open sourceable, so there's some work that has to happen to swap those out and swap in some open source alternatives. So there's some work involved to get webOS into open source, but that's the first order of business.

But the goal is not to keep some pieces of webOS for yourselves. You want the whole thing open source?

Meg: Yes, absolutely.

So what happened with selling? There was a lot of speculation that you would sell it off. Were there no attractive offers, or was this just a different direction you wanted to take — to invest in it, to not sell?

Meg: We looked at a whole bunch of opportunities, the team here — right after the mid-August announcement — said 'what were the alternatives?' Wind down? Sell the portfolio? Run it like we did before, but better? And as we looked at all the alternatives, this seemed to be the one that made the most sense for the industry, for the community, for the developer community. As you go through these structures, you look at the pros and cons of the alternatives, and this was one that was affordable for HP to invest in in the long haul, but also had a great opportunity to fill a market need. And listen, it's a great asset, and who wants it to go away?

Are there going to be more layoffs in the webOS division? Or will that stop here?

Meg: You know, I don't really know the answer to that. We want to keep this team together. We have to build a business plan, we've got to build a 3 or 4 year product roadmap. And exactly who we need on the team and what positions remains to be seen. But what I told employees this morning is that we want them to be part of this. But we this also has the characteristics of a startup — a big startup. It has 600 people, 750,000 devices out there in the marketplace, it has a big company behind it. But it's a startup. What we have to do is figure out exactly where we're going to invest and how many people we need to do that.

So what is the metric for success or failure with webOS at this point? How do you know 'hey we're winning, it's working,' or if you need to reevaluate?

Meg: Well first I want to set expectations about time frame. This is going to take some time. If you look back at the history of Mozilla or Red Hat — these things did not become giant platforms over night. This in my view is a 4 or 5 year timeframe, and I want to make sure we really communicate that. And then I think the measures of success — and I'm not going to give you numbers here — but the measures of success are going to be: how many developers are writing for this platform? Have there been other hardware manufacturers who have signed on and built devices, whether they be tablets or devices of the future or smartphones? And ultimately, the ability of developers to make money.

But you think this is 4 or 5 years before you can evaluate if it's doing what you want it to do?

Meg: There will be milestones along the way, but one thing I know about technology is that if you believe in something, you have to have a longer term horizon than next week, next quarter, or next year. When we looked at alternatives, we said 'what will be affordable to HP to invest, and get this thing going,' and we'll monitor along the way. There's a bit of a test and iterate here — it's not just something you say 'if it's not perfect in a year, we're out of here.'




It looks like a PR stunt, they followed the lead of the interviewers, everything was corporate speak, all BS...

They had a shot at an Apple type ecosystem, they own the hardware and the software, it wouldn't have taken that much to sort out the software, hire some developers to make some core apps, and re-think the hardware, put together an app store, etc...

HP has the resources to pull it off rather easily, but they didn't.
 
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jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
15,047
5,613
136
I think this is pretty much confirmation that the tablet market is heading for a race-to-the-bottom scenario where nobody makes any real profits. Not that they are making a lot now. Except for Apple of course.
 
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