Hurricane Sandy! (Watch out, NE)

[Vdubchaos]

I have to drive either the Merritt or I-95 every day. The stretch between Stratford and Stamford southbound during the morning rush and northbound during the evening rush is one of the worst commutes in the USA.

I don't know about that....

2 weeks ago I left Newark at 4:00 and thought I wouldn't be home until 7-8.

Didn't hit ANY traffic (I-87+ 15).....I was shocked. It was a Monday too.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

I've got the CBS news on here and now at 11:00 pm on Saturday November 10th a full 12 days after the full force of Sandy hit there are more than 125,000 customers STILL without power on Long Island. Nice job by LIPA.

If I lived on Long Island I'm pretty sure I would have tracked down at least a few LIPA executives and beat the living shit out of them.

 

[BUTCH1]

I've got the CBS news on here and now at 11:00 pm on Saturday November 10th a full 12 days after the full force of Sandy hit there are more than 125,000 customers STILL without power on Long Island. Nice job by LIPA.

If I lived on Long Island I'm pretty sure I would have tracked down at least a few LIPA executives and beat the living shit out of them.

Why? what don't you understand about the damage a hurricane can do to overhead power lines?. This isn't about replacing a blown transformer here or there or a few trees down, the entire grid for your area was heavily damaged, hell, hurricane Charley was 1/4 the size of Sandy and we went 10 days without power..

 

[Red Squirrel]

I've got the CBS news on here and now at 11:00 pm on Saturday November 10th a full 12 days after the full force of Sandy hit there are more than 125,000 customers STILL without power on Long Island. Nice job by LIPA.

If I lived on Long Island I'm pretty sure I would have tracked down at least a few LIPA executives and beat the living shit out of them.

If you still have a house in which you need power for, you should be grateful. Lot of people lost their houses.

 

[Brainonska511]

I've got the CBS news on here and now at 11:00 pm on Saturday November 10th a full 12 days after the full force of Sandy hit there are more than 125,000 customers STILL without power on Long Island. Nice job by LIPA.

If I lived on Long Island I'm pretty sure I would have tracked down at least a few LIPA executives and beat the living shit out of them.

My parents just got power back this evening. F*cking ridiculous. They weren't even near the shore or anything like that. Just smack in the middle of the island.

A recent article in Newsday said that LIPA had received the results of a study back in 2006 on what would be required to harden the network against disaster. Apparently, LIPA did almost nothing suggested.

 

[Dude111]

My love and compassion goes out to everyone who has been affected by this storm and those who are still in the dark....

 

[BUTCH1]

My parents just got power back this evening. F*cking ridiculous. They weren't even near the shore or anything like that. Just smack in the middle of the island.

A recent article in Newsday said that LIPA had received the results of a study back in 2006 on what would be required to harden the network against disaster. Apparently, LIPA did almost nothing suggested.

The one most important item would be burying the lines, but it's extraordinarily expensive, they did LOTS of those type of studies in FL after 2004, problem is someone has to pay for that and then you would have people screaming "WTF our bill is sky-high because the spent so much $$ for a storm that might happen once every 100 yrs., those idiots!"

 

[bruceb]

Power from First Energy / JCP&L finally restored on Sat Nov 10 at 3:30PM .. We were without ac power for 12 days, but a generator keep essential circuit up (at a cost of 4 gallons or so of gasoline for a 12 hr period) Generator did not run overnight. Bad news is that my old Frigidaire refrig / freezer seems to have died. But it is about 22 years old or so. Time to get a new one.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

The one most important item would be burying the lines, but it's extraordinarily expensive, they did LOTS of those type of studies in FL after 2004, problem is someone has to pay for that and then you would have people screaming "WTF our bill is sky-high because the spent so much $$ for a storm that might happen once every 100 yrs., those idiots!"

Most utility companies that I know of add a few dollars every month to your bill to establish a slush fund for improvements, and maintenance.
You can also be billed as much as $10 a month to own a home, or business in their grid, even if your meter is turned off. Also, most improvements, and additions to the grid are payed for by the developers. This fund far exceeds the actual costs of said improvements, and maintenance by millions, and MILLIONS of dollars! There has even been talk that the utility companies will be raising their rates to cover the lost revenue they didn't get from customers that were without power.
Now that is rich, lol.

 

[BUTCH1]

Most utility companies that I know of add a few dollars every month to your bill to establish a slush fund for improvements, and maintenance.
You can also be billed as much as $10 a month to own a home, or business in their grid, even if your meter is turned off. Also, most improvements, and additions to the grid are payed for by the developers. This fund far exceeds the actual costs of said improvements, and maintenance by millions, and MILLIONS of dollars! There has even been talk that the utility companies will be raising their rates to cover the lost revenue they didn't get from customers that were without power.
Now that is rich, lol.

They might be raising the rates to cover the cost to do repairs after such a huge event, usually a power co should have to go in front of a PSC (public service commission) to ask for an increase, reason being is they are a monopoly. Power company must have saved a lot on fuel to generate electricity with so many people not using any for weeks (you would think anyway). developers are responsible for what they develop but not general line and pole and substation maintenance. Again, if the "improvements" are going to mean burying the lines it's another ball of wax altogether, drive down the streets and think of what it would take to dig trenches all along every street to bury the lines, replace the lines in use to ones suitable for burying, remove all the old poles, and pay for landscaping. Then the issue is if a simple repair is needed a bucket truck is useless, get out a backhoe, a much longer repair and maintenance procedure vs overhead lines. If you were building a community from scratch, burying would make much more sense and would look much better, like I mentioned before this was discussed to death after what happened here in 2004, bottom line was consumers were unwilling to have their bills jacked way up for a LONG time to cover burying lines..

 

[Brainonska511]

The one most important item would be burying the lines, but it's extraordinarily expensive, they did LOTS of those type of studies in FL after 2004, problem is someone has to pay for that and then you would have people screaming "WTF our bill is sky-high because the spent so much $$ for a storm that might happen once every 100 yrs., those idiots!"

I know burying lines is expensive. I'm not suggesting it.

LIPA missed the boat on a host of other things:

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...ngs-it-wasn-t-ready-for-major-storm-1.4203976

...


Even cheap measures were neglected by LIPA, according to the June report. LIPA lacked basic procedures for clearing roads outside of hospitals and schools, locating and repairing downed wires, communicating with customers and keeping call centers working, maintaining poles, and trimming trees around power lines in order to prevent “tree-caused outages associated with major storm events.”


LIPA spends less thinning vegetation around transmission stations than other utilities, clears less — 6 feet around distribution equipment as compared with the industry standard, which is 10 feet — and doesn’t have a consistent cycle for trimming trees. Workers might not hit some trees for seven or eight years, according to the report, which recommended a four-year cycle.
....


But LIPA’s biggest flaw identified by the report was the utility’s inability to communicate well with the public. Clogged call centers are especially problematic since LIPA relies on customers to report their own individual outages.


...

The communication issue has been huge.

 

[K1052]

Apparently 1/3 of New Jersey Transit's rolling stock is damaged or destroyed. They left a lot of it in the low lying yard at Kearny. The rail operations center was flooded and the Kearny connection which enables most of the NJT service to get to Penn was severely damaged. It could be months or up to a year before pre-storm service levels are restored.

The MTA has done a lot better job.

 

[nageov3t]

the PATH trains being down is basically killing my personal life.

I've got no way of getting into the city for dates/socializing without driving into Manhattan and paying +$30 for parking (likewise, no way for my friends in the city to get to me in Jersey)... and pretty much 0 communication from the Port Authority.

and why the limited PATH service that is running stops at 10 pm for some reason just boggles my mind.

I can't imagine what it's like for people who rely on the trains from Newark to get into the city for work. at least I've got the option of driving down to my company's central Jersey office. NJ transit to NY Penn Station and then subway downtown? that must suck when you used to be able to go directly from Newark to World Trade.

 

[K1052]

the PATH trains being down is basically killing my personal life.

I've got no way of getting into the city for dates/socializing without driving into Manhattan and paying +$30 for parking (likewise, no way for my friends in the city to get to me in Jersey)... and pretty much 0 communication from the Port Authority.

and why the limited PATH service that is running stops at 10 pm for some reason just boggles my mind.

I can't imagine what it's like for people who rely on the trains from Newark to get into the city for work. at least I've got the option of driving down to my company's central Jersey office. NJ transit to NY Penn Station and then subway downtown? that must suck when you used to be able to go directly from Newark to World Trade.

Service is truncated since they still have repair work to do overnight between Newport and 14th St.

Hoboken and the downtown tubes to WTC are a total wreck. Apparently the flood barriers were only 6 feet tall. Oops

Communication from PA and NJT has been pretty bad though I kind of assumed it was because of the massive damage both properties took and the question asking that is to follow.

 

[nageov3t]

given the lack of damage to the area, though, I'm amazed that Newark -> Journal Square could be as bad as the PA is claiming... just getting that up would let people outside of Jersey City connect to the limited service going into midtown.

 

[K1052]

given the lack of damage to the area, though, I'm amazed that Newark -> Journal Square could be as bad as the PA is claiming... just getting that up would let people outside of Jersey City connect to the limited service going into midtown.

PATH pretty much parallels the NEC from Newark through Kearny on the way to Journal Square. I think they have some of the same kind of issues NJT has (washed out track and damaged signal/power systems). The PA at least had the good sense to move the PATH rolling stock on to high points on the line and bridges instead of letting it sit in the low lying yard.

 

[Brainonska511]

PATH pretty much parallels the NEC from Newark through Kearny on the way to Journal Square. I think they have some of the same kind of issues NJT has (washed out track and damaged signal/power systems). The PA at least had the good sense to move the PATH rolling stock on to high points on the line and bridges instead of letting it sit in the low lying yard.

What a bunch of maroons at NJT! That's part of why the MTA shutdown occurred a day before the brunt of the storm - the need to move all the equipment to higher ground. Because of that move, the MTA was able to report that none of its rolling stock was damaged, which facilitated in bringing partial service restoration (and quicker full-restoration to some lines).

 

[K1052]

What a bunch of maroons at NJT! That's part of why the MTA shutdown occurred a day before the brunt of the storm - the need to move all the equipment to higher ground. Because of that move, the MTA was able to report that none of its rolling stock was damaged, which facilitated in bringing partial service restoration (and quicker full-restoration to some lines).

MTA also pulled vital components from river tunnels and low lying track after they shut down assuming they would take flooding. They did everything plausible that could have been done to prepare on short notice. They agency reworked it's contingency plans after Irene and the blizzard last year showed where the problems would be.

 

[Markbnj]

JCP&L customer in northern New Jersey. We got our power back yesterday at 5:10 PM. just shy of twelve days. The whiners who blame the power companies for the extended outage are idiots. If I were a LIPA lineman and I drove by and saw those "LIPA sucks!" signs I'd call in sick for three days. Let the pissy bitches shiver some more. If LIPA was uniquely unprepared why have we _all_, throughout the tri-state area, suffered similar outages? Why did JCP&L need the help of Duke Energy, Penn Power, Didado, and dozens of other companies to get their grid back up? Why did it take 12+ days? Because they were just as uniquely unprepared as LIPA? No, it was because the grid was freaking destroyed.

The people who criticize the response in times like these are assholes, every one of them. These guys have been out in those buckets in all weather for two weeks putting those wires back up. The out-of-staters haven't seen their families in that whole time. One of them told me they didn't even know where all the damage was, and that it would be easier to build a new grid.

You want less wind-related outages? Cut down the freaking trees near the lines. Every year JCP&L wants to aggressively remove trees that pose a risk, and every year the townships and property owners around our area fight to stop them. No, don't hurt the pwetty twees! You want your goddamn trees? Fine, then you get a goddamn twelve day outage after a massive storm, so stfu.

I think property owners who don't want their trees cut back should be made fully liable for all damages when they fall over during a windstorm. That would put the responsibility where it should rightfully rest.

 

[nageov3t]

given the amount of money they must be losing, I can't imagine the utility companies aren't working around the clock to get 100% of service restored asap.

no power = I'm not using any electricity = my bill should be super low this month.

 

[BUTCH1]

JCP&L customer in northern New Jersey. We got our power back yesterday at 5:10 PM. just shy of twelve days. The whiners who blame the power companies for the extended outage are idiots. If I were a LIPA lineman and I drove by and saw those "LIPA sucks!" signs I'd call in sick for three days. Let the pissy bitches shiver some more. If LIPA was uniquely unprepared why have we _all_, throughout the tri-state area, suffered similar outages? Why did JCP&L need the help of Duke Energy, Penn Power, Didado, and dozens of other companies to get their grid back up? Why did it take 12+ days? Because they were just as uniquely unprepared as LIPA? No, it was because the grid was freaking destroyed.

The people who criticize the response in times like these are assholes, every one of them. These guys have been out in those buckets in all weather for two weeks putting those wires back up. The out-of-staters haven't seen their families in that whole time. One of them told me they didn't even know where all the damage was, and that it would be easier to build a new grid.

You want less wind-related outages? Cut down the freaking trees near the lines. Every year JCP&L wants to aggressively remove trees that pose a risk, and every year the townships and property owners around our area fight to stop them. No, don't hurt the pwetty twees! You want your goddamn trees? Fine, then you get a goddamn twelve day outage after a massive storm, so stfu.

I think property owners who don't want their trees cut back should be made fully liable for all damages when they fall over during a windstorm. That would put the responsibility where it should rightfully rest.

Well said, people have no idea about the amount of damage that happens, as hurricane Charley marched across the state from west to east we sat on our west facing porch and watched as dozens of huge flashes of light lit up the entire night sky, it was the power grid being demolished and this was a small hurricane, same wind speeds as Sandy, we were out for 10 days in August, ugh. Never saw any signs like that though, that's ridiculous and downright stupid to not understand the fucking grid is in shambles and start to bitch at the linemen trying to get it back up..

 

[spidey07]

given the amount of money they must be losing, I can't imagine the utility companies aren't working around the clock to get 100% of service restored asap.

no power = I'm not using any electricity = my bill should be super low this month.

Exactly, they are doing every thing they can because they're losing incredible amounts of money. Think about it this way, they can't produce their product and have nothing but costs and associated repair cost. A double whammy. They want power back much more than the customer ever could.

 

[bruceb]

Mark, Glad to see you finally got your electric power back up. Mine came on Saturday at 3:30PM Where abouts in Northern, NJ area you at ? ? I am in Wayne, NJ ... And I agree, either the utilities company or the state / townships, should be proactive in trimming tree limbs. You don't need to remove the entire tree, unless it is diseased or very likely to fall. But branch trimming is a standard that Verizon and Power companies are supposed to do (but they put it off to save $$$) .. Spidey, the electric company still produces the power, storm or not. They just can't deliver it to the users, so they can't rake in the exorbitant rates they charge us for it. And as a friend pointed out to me yesterday, there is a Service Charge (aka usage amount) and a Delivery Charge (to use their wires to get the power to you) .. You can be sure, the Delivery Charge will go UP to cover all these repairs.

 

[Markbnj]

Mark, Glad to see you finally got your electric power back up. Mine came on Saturday at 3:30PM Where abouts in Northern, NJ area you at ? ? I am in Wayne, NJ ... And I agree, either the utilities company or the state / townships, should be proactive in trimming tree limbs. You don't need to remove the entire tree, unless it is diseased or very likely to fall. But branch trimming is a standard that Verizon and Power companies are supposed to do (but they put it off to save $$$) .. Spidey, the electric company still produces the power, storm or not. They just can't deliver it to the users, so they can't rake in the exorbitant rates they charge us for it. And as a friend pointed out to me yesterday, there is a Service Charge (aka usage amount) and a Delivery Charge (to use their wires to get the power to you) .. You can be sure, the Delivery Charge will go UP to cover all these repairs.

We're in western Morris county. It's not easy for utilities to raise any component of their rates. They have to make a case for it to the state. I also think this is one of the reasons they do bill averaging, so that incidents like this don't drop them into a revenue hole.

 

[BD2003]

Exactly, they are doing every thing they can because they're losing incredible amounts of money. Think about it this way, they can't produce their product and have nothing but costs and associated repair cost. A double whammy. They want power back much more than the customer ever could.

Believe me, when you havent had heat or a hot shower for a week, you will trade any amount of money for it.