I find it odd that parents go out and buy cars...

[radioouman]

My kids will learn that it is stupid to spend tons of money on a car.
They will learn how to do at least minor maintenance on an older car, and to not spend money on something that they can do themselves.

Having said that, I would be willing to spend $2000-$3000 to get them a halfway reasonable used car.

 

[mrzed]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: mrzed

Originally posted by: alkemyst
wow, send your kids back to your experience in school.

My parents bought me my first car...I also worked, my commute was 30mins each way...on a bike: Pizza Hut would have worked

Cannot parse thoughts. Sorry. Pizza Hut? Send my kids back? Does not compute.

I will have much more money to offer my children than I ever grew up with, and I plan on offering them any advantage I can. I just don't consider a car an advantage. Then again, I live in a city, not suburbs or rural. Then again, that is a choice.

Pizza Hut and the like would be the type of places close enough to ride a bike too. When I was going to school I worked in a bank.

Most people think they will have way more than growing up when they come out of school...more often than not it doesn't work out that way in the beginning. Unless you came from a poor family.

I already have much more money than when I grew up. I grew up in rental housing, now I own my own home. Just renovating the kitchen with high end appliances. I do have a car. 1993 deisel Passat. Not nice by car nut standards, but it is comfy, roomy, safe, handles well and gets almost (Canadian) 50mpg. I am currently living the DINK life with my wife. I make more money myself than my parents ever did, and my wife makes more than me.

Suffice it to say, barring a Maybach or something equally ridiculous, we could walk into any luxury car dealership and walk out with anything we wanted. Our income, credit rating, and account balances are more than OK. But why would we?

I grew up what most people would consider poor. Single mom, on welfare until I was about 7, working poor for the next few years, then a modest increase during my teens. I don't consider myself particularly disadvantaged. I'm unlucky compared to kids with good families who were supportive and gave them things I could never have. I'm lucky in every way compared to the vast majority of the world, who would have loved to have had my poor Canadian kid lifestyle.

I firmly beleive that once you are an adult, any advantages and disadvantages you had growing up are moot. Your past doesn't determine my success, effort does. A parents job is to provide any real advantage to their kid they can. IMO, that means give them anything that will help them, but not spoil them. I just don't think of a car as a big advantage.

I'm not an anti-car zealot. If we didn't need a car for work, we'd still have one, just use it far less. I just don't agree that people need them nearly as much as they want them. People convince themselves that they don't have a choice but to drive. I call balls on that. Some people do need cars, but for most of us they are tied to other choices we made that were optional. Many people need cars to get to work. But they don't need to live in places that are far away from employment and services.

Sad thing is, the tax system and infrastructure (in North America at least) make that lifestyle much cheaper relative to its real cost. So more people are encouraged to move to distant suburbs far from the nearest store.

Originally posted by: gokuWhat city? If I lived in a city, I don't think I'd want a car either. If you live in a city, you can get around easier with out a car than with a car.

Victoria, Canada. Small city, if my wife and I didn't both work out of town (opposite directions, I carpool), we'd ride more than we drove.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: mrzed
I firmly beleive that once you are an adult, any advantages and disadvantages you had growing up are moot. Your past doesn't determine my success, effort does. A parents job is to provide any real advantage to their kid they can. IMO, that means give them anything that will help them, but not spoil them. I just don't think of a car as a big advantage.

Your examples hardly show any type of true financial freedom and a normal perspective on real life.

Rental housing vs owning a home doesn't really measure anything...there are some rentals that are multiples in montly payment than a typical mortgage. Outfitting a kitchen with high end appliances is a typical thing many do. The ability to go into a car dealership and drop nearly 6 figures on a car is not a hard thing to do either, balancing that purchase with the rest of your expenses is though.

If your parents / family are truly successful, that success can have a huge bearing on your adult life and opportunities that are offered.

A car is a luxury item when it's debated, as is a microwave, a tv set, a computer, etc. Anyone can do without them, it just why do so when they are available; unless you have to.

 

[Blazin Trav]

Probably because if the kid has a $60k car, their parents are pushovers.

 

[vshah]

one girl in my hs had a vette and a viper

 

[daveymark]

My kid will be getting a nice car if she keeps her 4.0 GPA and stays on course for an ivy league college

i figure since I have the money why not let her enjoy the results of her hard work.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Blazin Trav
Probably because if the kid has a $60k car, their parents are pushovers.

or what the parents view as an entry level car for their economic ability.

 

[chuckywang]

Originally posted by: daveymark
My kid will be getting a nice car if she keeps her 4.0 GPA and stays on course for an ivy league college

i figure since I have the money why not let her enjoy the results of her hard work.

Actually, she'll be enjoying the results of your hard work.

 

[Jack Ryan]

Originally posted by: chuckywang

Originally posted by: daveymark
My kid will be getting a nice car if she keeps her 4.0 GPA and stays on course for an ivy league college

i figure since I have the money why not let her enjoy the results of her hard work.

Actually, she'll be enjoying the results of your hard work.

So freakin true.

I spend a lot of time thinking about how I will teach my children (have none yet) the value of money. Working hard in school and getting rewarded with cars and the like don't look like a good idea to me. I have seen on more than a few occasions that thinking backfire for the parents.

When parents have no value for money, the kids aren't going to either, no matter how many "rules" or "achievements" are set. I just hope I can come up with something by when the time comes for me.

 

[alkemyst]

Class distinction certainly shows in topics like this.

How is buying a car for your child showing a lack in knowing the value of money?

I can understand two parents living in a double wide driving 30+ year old cars going out and financing against everything they have a brand spanking new IROC Z for junior.

However; those of upper middle class and beyond usually have the means to pick up a decent $15k+ car for their child that will not leak oil all over their driveway and not have them shuttling the kid back and forth when the car is always broken.

I personally feel a nice car will not spoil a kid in and of itself. Also a nice car can help them fit in way better at times than a beater. This is assumed the kid is going to a school were semi-new to new cars are the norm. If you buy your child a $50k car to park in a school full of those on lunch assistance programs, there is going to be animosity.

 

[mrzed]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Your examples hardly show any type of true financial freedom and a normal perspective on real life.

Rental housing vs owning a home doesn't really measure anything...there are some rentals that are multiples in montly payment than a typical mortgage. Outfitting a kitchen with high end appliances is a typical thing many do. The ability to go into a car dealership and drop nearly 6 figures on a car is not a hard thing to do either, balancing that purchase with the rest of your expenses is though.

If your parents / family are truly successful, that success can have a huge bearing on your adult life and opportunities that are offered.

A car is a luxury item when it's debated, as is a microwave, a tv set, a computer, etc. Anyone can do without them, it just why do so when they are available; unless you have to.

I think you may be seriously misunderstanding my posts there guy. Perhaps some perspective - I'm an adult. Not a quasi-adult like many here, but an adult. I wouldn't say I have true financial freedom, because we can't afford to retire just yet in our mid 30's. But we live better than most, and part of the reason is we don't spend money on cars (a depreciating asset). When we got enough money we spent it on a house (an appreciating asset - though not likely for the next couple of years).

And I was bringing up the walk into a dealer and walk out with an expensive car as an example. I'd rather not show you my bank balances to convince you that it would (by many people's measures) be not unreasonable. For me, it would seem stupid, because we already have a decent car, but then I think differently than a lot of people.

My point is, I would have the ability to provide the kids with a car, but I would choose not to. Because I don't think it's an advantage. My new kitchen on the other hand is an advantage. I saved money by doing almost all the work myself, and spent more on the stove because I like to cook. Is it a luxury? Damn straight, but it's one I value more than a better car. Besides, we paid cash for it, along with the rest of the renovations. Does that make it better? Or less "typical?"

And sorry, but renting vs owning does mean something. Recent real estate shenanigans in the USA aside, owning a home is one of the best financial instruments for a normal family. Yes, the rich can afford to rent 4K penthouses, but who really cares what the rich do? How relevant is it to the rest of us?

 

[ArJuN]

Comming from a HS senior:
Yea, we all drive those nice ass cars, but our parents don't buy them for us. (That would be pretty sweet...) Usually, atleast how it is with me and my friends, our parents have an extra car, and we just take that. So don't think some HS kid owns a nicer car than you. He or she just lucked out.

 

[Lithium381]

I worked during HS and bought my own car....$3500 still have it yay!

 

[RbSX]

Originally posted by: logic1485

Originally posted by: Duddy

Originally posted by: ChaoZ

Originally posted by: Duddy
When I turned 18 I bought my own Mazda3 Hatch for $22,000. My dad was the co-signer because I had no credit and he had awesome credit.

I pay for every $280 a month bill and pay my own insurance.

Just because a kid has a nice car doesn't mean they are spoiled. They might have worked very hard for it like me.

Why the hell would you do that when there's still college to consider. I would've just got any car that works.

Because my scholarships cover college. And if not, my parents will cover it.

My parents are rich, and they worked their asses off for years to get there. Their main drive was to be able to have their children live comfortably. I make awesome grades and work real hard at my job and they pay me back by giving me money when I need it and paying for my college.

Just like that guy with the SLK AMG.

I forgot his name, where did he go?

Qosis, and it's his dads... AND it's financed.

 

[Dudewithoutapet]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Class distinction certainly shows in topics like this.

How is buying a car for your child showing a lack in knowing the value of money?

I can understand two parents living in a double wide driving 30+ year old cars going out and financing against everything they have a brand spanking new IROC Z for junior.

However; those of upper middle class and beyond usually have the means to pick up a decent $15k+ car for their child that will not leak oil all over their driveway and not have them shuttling the kid back and forth when the car is always broken.

I personally feel a nice car will not spoil a kid in and of itself. Also a nice car can help them fit in way better at times than a beater. This is assumed the kid is going to a school were semi-new to new cars are the norm. If you buy your child a $50k car to park in a school full of those on lunch assistance programs, there is going to be animosity.

Sorry but you must seriously be either misinformed about the more common reliable cars or you are just plain anti-ricers. There are many great japanese cars that will not do any of that for less than $15k. I can vouche for the many used Hondas, Acuras, Toyotas, and Nissans of this country. I personally drive a '97 3.2 TL (less than $8k easily). Not a oil leak and it has yet to break down on me. Now there might be American cars that can do that too, I dont know American cars as well as I know Japanese cars.

 

[pennylane]

I drive a 200something Toyota Camry.

 

[fatdragondzc]

Kids are spoiled nowadays. They cant b happy with what they get.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: mrzed
I think you may be seriously misunderstanding my posts there guy. Perhaps some perspective - I'm an adult. Not a quasi-adult like many here, but an adult. I wouldn't say I have true financial freedom, because we can't afford to retire just yet in our mid 30's. But we live better than most, and part of the reason is we don't spend money on cars (a depreciating asset). When we got enough money we spent it on a house (an appreciating asset - though not likely for the next couple of years).

Nope no misunderstanding. You don't really seem to understand what point you are trying to bring across and at the same time claim wealth with false pretenses.

Living better than most is really opinionated, esp when you consider it at the expensive of giving up luxury items; most of which depreciate. I don't understand how a home purchase wouldn't be appreciating from the moment you bought it; unless you over-spent or bought in a dying neighborhood.

Originally posted by: mrzed
And I was bringing up the walk into a dealer and walk out with an expensive car as an example. I'd rather not show you my bank balances to convince you that it would (by many people's measures) be not unreasonable. For me, it would seem stupid, because we already have a decent car, but then I think differently than a lot of people.

Like I had said though, many adults could do this if they chose to blow their nesteggs on such a purchase. During a mid-life crisis, you see many doing just that.

Originally posted by: mrzed
My point is, I would have the ability to provide the kids with a car, but I would choose not to. Because I don't think it's an advantage. My new kitchen on the other hand is an advantage. I saved money by doing almost all the work myself, and spent more on the stove because I like to cook. Is it a luxury? Damn straight, but it's one I value more than a better car. Besides, we paid cash for it, along with the rest of the renovations. Does that make it better? Or less "typical?"

Again here is where your whole thought process is flawed and self-centered in nature. You seem to think you have it all figured out and others have no clue. To many a stove is just a stove...it's purpose is to heat items to a certain temperature in certain ways. You can get one for $150 capable of cooking just about anything as reliably as a $1000 one. By the same reason you prefer it, so may your child prefer a car which they will probably be spending more time in than you cooking. I spend my money first on the things I need, then the things I just want. I love driving...I would never pay more than my annual salary on a car currently, however; can't say I wouldn't pick up an exotic if I could. Currently I feel spending between $25 and 35k on a car is reasonable.

Paying cash for a kitchen again is all relative. There are $5000 kitchens and $50,000+ kitchens...all in all paying cash means nothing. It's like the idiot that walks into a new car showroom and thinks they can negotiate by saying 'I am paying cash'.

Originally posted by: mrzed
And sorry, but renting vs owning does mean something. Recent real estate shenanigans in the USA aside, owning a home is one of the best financial instruments for a normal family. Yes, the rich can afford to rent 4K penthouses, but who really cares what the rich do? How relevant is it to the rest of us?

Didn't say renting vs owning didn't mean anything...you were the one that used it for the purpose. You seem to care what the rich do though based on the set of line items you used to portray wealth. Most of the time spending cash on high ticket items is usually the worst way to do it. If your credit is good, and you have enough cash; getting a low APR credit extension for a big purchase while your money is in a high-yield account could actually make that purchase cheaper even if you farmed out the labor. As would taking that cash and paying off higher APR debt.

Bottom line is more often than not, those that choose not to buy their child a decent car vs an embarrassing beater simply cannot afford to do so or do not have children and are still reeling from having to driving a 1980's Chevette to school; rather than thinking it's going to upset some fragile balance of nature. Also being already socially unacceptable or introverted as an adult can have the same impact on a child. Being young doesn't require luxury items, but they are far more popular now than when I went to school. Helping you child fit in and be socially accepted goes a longer way than just attending class. Most of grade school is more about learning and exploring your role in society/socializing than they basic skills you learn there. College or in whatever career you pursue afterwards is what defines your real knowledge and ability.

Also whether or not the car is 'owned' by the parent's makes not much difference, having access to that car is what matters. This is the lowbrow approach to things: "Hey know what? I own me double wide, but that there guy is actually making payments on that silly Cayenne Turbo S...if he'd were so rich why don't he jus' have buyed it" and then you have the one's that brag about the same purchase and leave out the fact that the cash actually came from putting the car, second home, boat on top of their mortgage that they are now paying on.

Å

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Dudewithoutapet

Sorry but you must seriously be either misinformed about the more common reliable cars or you are just plain anti-ricers. There are many great japanese cars that will not do any of that for less than $15k. I can vouche for the many used Hondas, Acuras, Toyotas, and Nissans of this country. I personally drive a '97 3.2 TL (less than $8k easily). Not a oil leak and it has yet to break down on me. Now there might be American cars that can do that too, I dont know American cars as well as I know Japanese cars.

I never stated in my post that one had to spend $15k or more to get reliability.

I currently own a 1998 240SX SE, I have owned both a 1966 Mustang GT (I bought the 'shell', the the full restoration was technically paid for by my father while I was in high school) and 1988 Mustang GT. All these cars have been mint and low mileage. I choose cars I do not see all the time. My 1988 GT had T-Tops which were awesome down here in Florida, and also extremely rare to see especially in light grey on red. I personally target around $10k for the base car, when other's like it are going about 50% above that...takes time to shop it. Then I make them the way I want too. I like to do the work and enjoy it once everything is installed.

This is much of what those that are happy with just a Camry or Accord, or Town Car don't understand. For some a car is not just a tool, it's a hobby much like their high end kitchens, BBQ's, clothing, etc. Though I like a little of each of those too.

My point was spending $15k+ or more by those in the UPPER Middle class and above is not unreasonable, and will hardly be spoiling a kid growing up in such a household.

There is nothing wrong with many sub $15k cars, as not alot wrong with many sub $10k ones....when you get down to the mid 4 figures though it's hit or miss and those with an appreciatable amount of income usually have less free time; the last thing they want to buy is a problem...so occasionally they overspend.

 

[mrzed]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Nope no misunderstanding. You don't really seem to understand what point you are trying to bring across and at the same time claim wealth with false pretenses.

Never claimed wealth. I only claimed I am better off than average. That's fact, not opinion. It's very easy to find average family income in Canada (where I live) or the USA. I am well above that. I don't think it makes me a better person, just a combination of lucky and hard working. I only brought it up because I reject the idea that parents who are capable of doing so should always buy cars for their kids.

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Didn't say renting vs owning didn't mean anything...you were the one that used it for the purpose.

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Rental housing vs owning a home doesn't really measure anything...

Sorry for misunderstanding then . . .

Originally posted by: alkemyst
You seem to care what the rich do though based on the set of line items you used to portray wealth.

I was not trying to portay wealth. I was trying to show that there are different values. Your 35K car is not likely more functional than my 8K car. Mine is reliable, doesn't leak oil, safe, comfy. I also spend less on insurance and fuel. You would not seem to question a family spending the equivalent of an annual salary on a car, but I would. I'd rather not explain to my kids that the 27K difference that exists could have sent them to school for at least a year (or an entire degree if I invested the difference now).

Now I could do both, and I don't think people who do are idiots, I just have different values. It doesn't mean I think car people are bad. Judging people like that never gets anyone anywhere. I don't judge other people, I just live the life that fits my values. For me, that means not living a car-focused life.

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Most of the time spending cash on high ticket items is usually the worst way to do it. If your credit is good, and you have enough cash; getting a low APR credit extension for a big purchase while your money is in a high-yield account could actually make that purchase cheaper even if you farmed out the labor. As would taking that cash and paying off higher APR debt.

The only thing rich people do that I care about is how they invest their money. Reason being, they often have a more sophisticated financial understanding. One thing rich people tend to do is pay cash for their toys and borrow for their investments. Reason being, the interest on an investment loan is fully tax deductible.

Originally posted by: alkemyst
Bottom line is more often than not, those that choose not to buy their child a decent car vs an embarrassing beater simply cannot afford to do so or do not have children and are still reeling from having to driving a 1980's Chevette to school; rather than thinking it's going to upset some fragile balance of nature. Also being already socially unacceptable or introverted as an adult can have the same impact on a child. Being young doesn't require luxury items, but they are far more popular now than when I went to school. Helping you child fit in and be socially accepted goes a longer way than just attending class.

Well regardless of your bottom line (evidence pending), I am a contrary example. Argue all you want, but I didn't drive a crappy car to school, I rode my bike, and I never felt put out by it. Now that I have more resources, my values haven't changed.

I think it is far more important to give children a consistent set of values and a strong sense of self that to give them every advantage to help them fit in. Much of the good that has been done in this world has been done by people that were at least in some way outsiders. Doesn't mean that parents can ignore social pressures entirely, but neither should they give into them at every turn.

 

[acemcmac]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: acemcmac
I had to buy my own car. That's why I drive a 99 Mustang V6 autotragic. It was the nicest, most reliable (on paper) car I could afford at the time.

Did you pay for your own insurance?

Yep. I made all of my money buying and selling on ebay until I graduated.

 

[greatfool66]

As Adam Smith said ""The chief enjoyment of riches consists in the parade of riches." I think this will probably always be true. Parents who buy really nice cars for their kids are doing so partially to demonstrate their own status. I think this is poor parenting, but less so than being too stingy with kids.

When my sister wrecked her Landrover and my parents bought her a BMW a month later, I told them straight out, thats probably not good parenting... But these weren't 50k cars, they were both slightly used and bought for 15k and 20k. My father is successful in business because he bargains and doesn't waste a lot of money. So my point is what may look extravagant on the outside can make sense from some perspective.

 

[exdeath]

I can't stand those brats. It?s not so much the act of buying/getting the car as the attitude it reinforces. It?s one thing if they appreciate it and are humble about it but I absolutely can?t stand the brats that flaunt it like it?s their own, like they did it themselves, and purposely put other people down not in the same boat . I see these brats revving their brand new Mercedes and peeling out next to some kid in a hoopty just trying to make a living and pay for his/her own school? Yeah, I had my share of that. I drove (and still have) a 95 Camry, and while it?s no hoopty, it?s not sporty or fashionable so it automatically sucks (wait till I stick a 500 HP 3SGTE in it lol).

I paid for my own school and bought my own car. I also (now) drive a highly modified 2003 Cobra and I love eating them alive. I bet I could tell them I?m making almost 900 HP at the crank and they would go get on yahoo autos trying to find any car with more than that for their daddy to buy them, and be terribly confused and upset when they couldn?t find anything even close to it let alone over. While they bullied my Camry I pullied my Cobra lawl.

What is it with these kids that think because it?s new and says BMW on it that it?s the fastest car in the world?

There are also people that think they are intrinsically superior in their 2007 when you have a 2006 even when it?s a carry over with absolutely ZERO changes. *shrug*

And no, speaking from experience, if I had kids I wouldn't buy them a ub3r car just because I didn't have one in highschool. I'd help them find a good job or hone their skills so they could do it themselves.

What goes around comes around. Simple as that.

 

[exdeath]

Originally posted by: dotcom173
kid at my school (junior/senior years in HS) drove a 5-series, sold it, bought a G35, modded it, totalled it...bought an IS250, sold it, bought an M3....totalled it monday night and died....true story. he had two girls in the car, both in critical condition, breaking their backs, legs, necks, and some other bones too. not good.

P.S. - it was street racing.

Not to gloat on people dying or anything, but fitting end to that story. He was probably being a dick and wasting people left and right with crappy cars and paniced when someone actually stepped up and could take him so he pushed the limit out of desperation to not get served, and he paid for it.

All the money in the world can't buy brains.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: exdeath
And no, speaking from experience, if I had kids I wouldn't buy them a ub3r car just because I didn't have one in highschool. I'd help them find a good job or hone their skills so they could do it themselves.

What goes around comes around. Simple as that.

WHAT THE F is a good job in HS for most? I was lucky to work at a bank due to my father. Still I had a $40k car he bought.

No kid is going to be able to buy the car they want unless they turn to crime.

Originally posted by: exdeath
Not to gloat on people dying or anything, but fitting end to that story. He was probably being a dick and wasting people left and right with crappy cars and paniced when someone actually stepped up and could take him so he pushed the limit out of desperation to not get served, and he paid for it.

All the money in the world can't buy brains.

you have some pent up rage...perhaps this happened to you younger or now. Most that are driving those kinds of cars are only in serious street races...not that it's right, but there is a lot of serious performance on the road today.