I hate credit!

bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
Gray below is off topic.

I’ve never really needed credit nor wanted it. After my only big loan…

(an oddly loaded new, 1989 Camry with a 5 sp. stick - it was fun to drive, even on twisty roads; I made the Sacramento to Tahoe to Reno trip many times, and Squaw Valley used our HW/SW throughout its operation along with Boreal and Mammoth/June. The main person I dealt with at Squaw was a sweet lady who explained the slight modification needed to account for the hazard pay they gave the groomers. She explained that they drive huge CATs on the edges of a ridge line, heavy equipment dangling, smoothing out the slope below, and that occasionally one goes over and caused a few deaths. Her daughter worked at the ice cream shop during the summer (mountain biking was getting really big). Her name was Amber, and she was smokin’. Her mom introduced us, listened to our greetings, then left to catch up on something. She initiated contact between us then left us alone twice. I however was a closet case at work, and it was a bit awkward. I brought a friend’s 9 y.o. son with me once. We rode up the main, huge lift with all the skiers, me in my tie. We were the only ones in it on the way down after having been packed like sardines on the way up. I asked the operator if he’d take it to 100% for the descent - for the kid, really. He said, “We always do!” What had turned from a fairly serene trip up became amazing on the way down, huge sways at every tower, tons of steel swinging wildly through the still, crisp air, feet stuck to the floor like two shoed limpets, feeling the g's, going steeply down so fast. The child cocked his head at me with a worried look, so I said, “It’s OK, look out the window.” We were surrounded by 12,000 ft.+ peaks on one side, and the distant Owen's Valley floor on other, the aptly named White Mountains beyond. He had never seen anything like it, and was too short to previously see out among the schussers. There was no turn-around time except shutting the door. Edit: I hated the times I'd need chains, they were good about plowing, but no salt in an otherwise pristine wilderness. The roads were amazing and pretty steeply banked. One time, heading up to Mammoth, a big storm came up like they do in the mountains. I stopped by a roadside diner to call my contact. She said that part of the roof was coming off and not to come. I was sad for her, but relieved. I didn't want to get stuck up there somewhere in the the High Sierra, there was nobody to eat.)

...I started feeling kind of silly spending more money to get money. Why not save then buy? I’ve never been interested in a home after seeing all the headaches my dad went through, and I hate the feeling of owing.

(Besides the normal stuff he added a large family room by himself with help from my brother and me. One night a surprise storm came, and he hadn’t gotten the tar paper down over the plywood on the shallowly sloped roof. He had a lamp up there with a huge exposed incandescent bulb. It blew over and created a big, bright, explosive show in the dark of the gathering storm.)

...I like the secure feeling that an apartment provides; if something goes wrong, they always come and fix it, and if it’s a wear and tear item, they don’t charge, and they all have been that. I also know the advantages of homeownership, especially for families.

So I just didn’t care. And all these years later I never needed credit for anything until I went to write a check for a new car last year, election day. The place was empty. They wouldn’t take my check because of an “insufficient credit history,” so I had to leave and get a cashiers check, a minor inconvenience. I also realized if something happened to this building, and I’d need to rent another apt., they’d probably check my credit.

So I went about building my credit. I had to get a secured card because of the lack of history, and I continued my usual financial patterns except I now had to move money from one bank to another every month (always paying the balance) since Chase doesn’t offer a secured card.

The credit card is from Citi, and from their website to the way they show you your balance, and that you don’t have to pay it for a while, a long, profitable while, they hope you run a long-term balance, that you fail at their game.

Their monthly due date seems a difficult target. Purchases can take a while to process, and you can’t pay more than their approved balance by even a weekly grocery amount.

I forgot about the impending due date, and used the card (instead of my debit) on groceries the other day. Now I’m trying to pay a $76 amount that is showing as my only balance and their site won’t let me. I click on the amount, hit the pay now button and I get a blank screen. The tab with it has been open since I started writing this. Nothing, no progress bar, just the bank’s logo up top. It happened last night too, I've tried refreshing and rebooting, so now I get to enjoy calling a big bank - tomorrow.

My credit is up in the 700’s now, and my main source of mail is from banks with “the most amazing” credit card offers. At least I can go from having a card with Citi to it all being done at Chase now. I just kept my account open through Glendale Federal then Washington Mutual, now Chase after the meltdown and demise of WAMU with minimal bother in between. They’ve always been good to me (except now that no one needs a physical bank for much, they are so thinly staffed for my semi-annual laundry quarter needs).

The wonderful world of credit. It's nerve-wracking even if you don't run a balance.
 
Last edited:

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,917
12,379
126
www.anyf.ca
The only credit that really makes sense is a mortgage, since it's always better to own something than to rent it, and in the case of a house it's kind of what your life revolves around, what would be the point of even having a job and making money if you don't have a place to call home to go to after.

Anything else you can typically buy cash including a car, I always buy used. I can't justify the cost of a new car. That's like 30-40k I could put towards the house instead.

I do have a credit card which I use but pay off as I go, and then I have a credit line, that I sometimes dip into, but I use it more as a cash advance for when I need to do a large purchase and it might take a few pays to pay it off.

I've been kind of on a spending frenzie latetly, just random stuff like Home Depot purchases or just random stuff. So I need to slow down. Like today I went to HD to buy more screws for my shed... but of course the "while I'm here..." kicks in. $200 later....

What's funny is my credit card limit is crazy now, it's like 10k? I can't imagine actually putting 10k on a credit card! That's how you get yourself in never ending debt. The interest alone would be insane to try to pay that off.
 
Reactions: bradly1101

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
20,431
3,537
126
I started feeling kind of silly spending more money to get money. Why not save then buy?

Because there is a good chance you can make more money elsewhere. I could have bought my car outright but a 1.99% interest rate is low enough that I kept my money in the stock market instead for a 17% ROI. Sure that won't always happen but risking a few hundred per year in interest to keep my $ in something that historically does 3x better isn't really that risky to me.

My credit is up in the 700’s now, and my main source of mail is from banks with “the most amazing” credit card offers. At least I can go from having a card with Citi to it all being done at Chase now. I just kept my account open through Glendale Federal then Washington Mutual, now Chase after the meltdown and demise of WAMU with minimal bother in between. They’ve always been good to me (except now that no one needs a physical bank for much, they are so thinly staffed for my semi-annual laundry quarter needs).

The wonderful world of credit. It's nerve-wracking even if you don't run a balance.

If you learn how to make credit work for you and are disciplined in your approach there are a lot of benefits. Banks are all too happy to throw $ at you to get their credit card with the hope that you don't pay it off every month. If you do pay it off every month then that sign up bonus is free money to you that you can repeat across banks. (None of the cards I have had have given me any issues paying a balance other than the minimum or full balance. I've also made multiple payments in a month with no issue) Good credit gets you the lowest rates on loans allowing you to potentially take more advantage of situations like the car loan situation I mentioned above.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,931
5,802
126
I love credit (cards). I've saved like $6k or more in the past year in flights alone due to credit cards.

And I've payed exactly $0 in interest to credit cards for more than a decade.

Thanks Chase!

EDIT:

Damn this just reminded me I need to sign my wife up for 2 SW cards to try and get the Companion pass for me the next 2 years. Anyone know if there are any 50k bonus offers going on right now? I only see 40k bonus offers right now.
 
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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,931
5,802
126
They had 60k offers out recently but it looks like those have ended - the links are 404ing. The 60k business page is still up though

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/sou...k-60k-sigunup-points-offers-no-referrals.html
Thanks. I may see if I can get her the business card then and a normal one with 40k. Getting that 10k points shouldn't be too tough.

Do you know how often the 60k ones come for the non-business cards? I know I tried to get a business card once and got denied, then I tried another time and it worked for the Chase Ink Business card for me.
 

bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
Because there is a good chance you can make more money elsewhere. I could have bought my car outright but a 1.99% interest rate is low enough that I kept my money in the stock market instead for a 17% ROI. Sure that won't always happen but risking a few hundred per year in interest to keep my $ in something that historically does 3x better isn't really that risky to me.

The market is great, there's a lot of money to be made. More tension though. Diversifying into foreign markets has paid big. But it's all a scheme based on the hope of infinite growth, a sometimes shaky feeling proposition. Anxiety to mix with my greed.

If you learn how to make credit work for you and are disciplined in your approach there are a lot of benefits. Banks are all too happy to throw $ at you to get their credit card with the hope that you don't pay it off every month. If you do pay it off every month then that sign up bonus is free money to you that you can repeat across banks. (None of the cards I have had have given me any issues paying a balance other than the minimum or full balance. I've also made multiple payments in a month with no issue) Good credit gets you the lowest rates on loans allowing you to potentially take more advantage of situations like the car loan situation I mentioned above.
Yes it seems like they'll do almost anything to get you. My credit score jumped from the 400's to the 700's in a month. So generous. I can go from a secured card with a $1K limit to almost anything. I like the $1K limit in case the credit line gets hacked or I lose the card. I know I don't have to pay fraudulent charges, but I feel that I'm less of a target with so little on the line. Edit: Can you even request a low limit on an unsecured card?
 
Last edited:

bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
I love credit (cards). I've saved like $6k or more in the past year in flights alone due to credit cards.

And I've payed exactly $0 in interest to credit cards for more than a decade.

Thanks Chase!

EDIT:

Damn this just reminded me I need to sign my wife up for 2 SW cards to try and get the Companion pass for me the next 2 years. Anyone know if there are any 50k bonus offers going on right now? I only see 40k bonus offers right now.
I forgot about the advantages with flying. I don't travel much really, but it's hard to miss the highly paid actors on TV telling me about all the free miles as long as I make purchases. Even if you pay off your monthly balance, and use the miles to save a lot, the bank still makes out in transaction fees alone. Consumer spending creates widespread profit for all.

As a saver I must be a little frustrating to them, shredding credit applications almost daily, The poor, grinding machine now getting a workout because I'm seen as credit-worthy, higher up as a human than before.
 
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bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
It pisses me off a bit that being able to plunk down a check for a car doesn't raise my credit. My saving up for things, my financial responsibility, is the opposite of what they want, makes me less worthy. Such a scheme to make us dependent on the credit game.
 
Last edited:
Feb 25, 2011
16,823
1,493
126
It pisses me off a bit that being able to plunk down a check for a car doesn't raise my credit. My saving up for things, my financial responsibility, is the opposite of what they want, makes me less worthy. Such a scheme to make us dependent on the credit game.
They've found that being able to save $X doesn't make you necessarily more likely or able to pay back $X if they loan it to you.

Past performance is the best indication of future results, and all that.
 
Reactions: bradly1101

snoopy7548

Diamond Member
Jan 1, 2005
8,088
5,084
146
So I just didn’t care. And all these years later I never needed credit for anything until I went to write a check for a new car last year, election day. The place was empty. They wouldn’t take my check because of an “insufficient credit history,” so I had to leave and get a cashiers check, a minor inconvenience. I also realized if something happened to this building, and I’d need to rent another apt., they’d probably check my credit.

So I went about building my credit. I had to get a secured card because of the lack of history, and I continued my usual financial patterns except I now had to move money from one bank to another every month (always paying the balance) since Chase doesn’t offer a secured card.

The credit card is from Citi, and from their website to the way they show you your balance, and that you don’t have to pay it for a while, a long, profitable while, they hope you run a long-term balance, that you fail at their game.

Their monthly due date seems a difficult target. Purchases can take a while to process, and you can’t pay more than their approved balance by even a weekly grocery amount.

I forgot about the impending due date, and used the card (instead of my debit) on groceries the other day. Now I’m trying to pay a $76 amount that is showing as my only balance and their site won’t let me. I click on the amount, hit the pay now button and I get a blank screen. The tab with it has been open since I started writing this. Nothing, no progress bar, just the bank’s logo up top. It happened last night too, I've tried refreshing and rebooting, so now I get to enjoy calling a big bank - tomorrow.

My credit is up in the 700’s now, and my main source of mail is from banks with “the most amazing” credit card offers. At least I can go from having a card with Citi to it all being done at Chase now. I just kept my account open through Glendale Federal then Washington Mutual, now Chase after the meltdown and demise of WAMU with minimal bother in between. They’ve always been good to me (except now that no one needs a physical bank for much, they are so thinly staffed for my semi-annual laundry quarter needs).

The wonderful world of credit. It's nerve-wracking even if you don't run a balance.

I thought a secured card allowed you put a certain amount of money "onto" the card, and you can spend up to that much each month. It's like a debit card, except you get to build your credit with it.

I'm with the people who like credit cards. I tend to get about $20-30 each month in rewards (I don't churn), which pays for my snowboarding season pass and then some. Plus you get the extra security offered by credit cards. Never paid interest and never will, but this is the part where everyone who is going to fail fails. Having a credit card requires some self-control and financial awareness.

If you want to stop getting all those credit card offers, you can temporarily or permanently opt-out here. I did it a couple of months ago and I haven't gotten a single junk offer since. After you sign up, they'll mail you a form you have to sign and mail back.
https://www.optoutprescreen.com/?rf=t

BTW, I do think it's bogus these credit agencies created a product that you have no choice in, and you can't do certain business or live in certain places without it even if you otherwise have the means. Then again, even if it were optional I'm not sure if it would be very different.
 
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MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,969
20,227
136
It pisses me off a bit that being able to plunk down a check for a car doesn't raise my credit. My saving up for things, my financial responsibility, is the opposite of what they want, makes me less worthy. Such a scheme to make us dependent on the credit game.

Agreed. It's consumer capitalism at it's best. You don't need to do too much, just get one high limit credit card, use it every month for some decent coin and pay it off in full. I don't think you need to carry a lot of credit cards to make it work, but you do need one.
 

AznAnarchy99

Lifer
Dec 6, 2004
14,705
117
106
I just ran into that recently where I got a loan from my credit union but they wanted to run a credit check on me anyways. I guess it's cause people write bad checks that bounce.
 

bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
Sounds beautiful. How was the descent?
Really scary, and at the same time unmissable. Like the first time you take a lift up to a more advanced run. You're going down fast, know the risks, and have an absolute blast. I never did, but always wanted to, take the cornice run at Mammoth, I admired the courage of others doing it though. My big brother always did it.


Edit: On skis of course it's much, much faster. They call it "dropping into the cornice," but really it's dropping from the cornice into a bowl, like a flame going over the edge into a pipe's bowl, gravity sucking you down.

I've taken the same lift to an easier slope. In it once a skier asked us all if we'd mind if he sparked up a doobie. After seeing that no one cared, two other people pulled out joints. By the time we reached the top, the lift was filled with skunky smoke. The employee at the top who opened the door could obviously smell it, and rolled his eyes just a bit since this was a regularly recurring event I'm sure.
 
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AMDisTheBEST

Senior member
Dec 17, 2015
682
90
61
Well, credit is worth it if you use it as an investment. If you are just using it for personal consumption, you are better off without it.
 

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
20,431
3,537
126
Do you know how often the 60k ones come for the non-business cards? I know I tried to get a business card once and got denied, then I tried another time and it worked for the Chase Ink Business card for me.

I think the 60k offers were new this year and I think they ran it twice with another 50k offering earlier in the year. They seem to run it several times per year, 3-4 maybe? So another 50k+ offer around March that runs through the end of April would follow their loose pattern but its tough to say for certain

The market is great, there's a lot of money to be made. More tension though. Diversifying into foreign markets has paid big. But it's all a scheme based on the hope of infinite growth, a sometimes shaky feeling proposition. Anxiety to mix with my greed.


Yes it seems like they'll do almost anything to get you. My credit score jumped from the 400's to the 700's in a month. So generous. I can go from a secured card with a $1K limit to almost anything. I like the $1K limit in case the credit line gets hacked or I lose the card. I know I don't have to pay fraudulent charges, but I feel that I'm less of a target with so little on the line. Edit: Can you even request a low limit on an unsecured card?

Well there's risk to cash too so it just depends on which scheme you want to deal with really. They do let you set lower limits with unsecured cards. I do that from time to time so I can get approved for an additional card at a bank. Usually confuses the rep though as most people ask for a higher limit not lower
 
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Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
30,856
4,974
126
Just paid off my CCs. My score jumped nearly 100 points in 1 month. THANK JEEBUS!
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
25,214
3,631
126
Really scary, and at the same time unmissable. Like the first time you take a lift up to a more advanced run. You're going down fast, know the risks, and have an absolute blast. I never did, but always wanted to, take the cornice run at Mammoth, I admired the courage of others doing it though. My big brother always did it.


Edit: On skis of course it's much, much faster. They call it "dropping into the cornice," but really it's dropping from the cornice into a bowl, like a flame going over the edge into a pipe's bowl, gravity sucking you down.

I've taken the same lift to an easier slope. In it once a skier asked us all if we'd mind if he sparked up a doobie. After seeing that no one cared, two other people pulled out joints. By the time we reached the top, the lift was filled with skunky smoke. The employee at the top who opened the door could obviously smell it, and rolled his eyes just a bit since this was a regularly recurring event I'm sure.
Thanks for posting, looks like fun.

Credit is great, as long as it is used properly. But, it is easy to fall into traps when starting out on credit.
 
Reactions: bradly1101
Dec 10, 2005
24,434
7,356
136
Credit cards are great if you play the points game and pay the entire balance off every month.
They're great too even if you don't play the games of chasing after the big sign up bonuses. Sure, it isn't as glamorous, but I've saved a few hundred dollars over the last year or so on cash back and Citi's price rewind feature. And in the past, I've gotten a phone for free through AmEx's accidental damage coverage (somehow cracked the rear glass on my Nexus 4 many years ago within the first 90 days of purchase- they just credited me the money).
 
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