I returned a broken 8800GTS to frys and they put it back on the shelf

[Cookie Monster]

You should have checked your PSU more thoroughly. how? by putting your GTS on another pc preferably with a good PSU (such as seasonsic, corsair, PCP&P).

Maybe somebody needs to go over with you the troubleshooting basics 101.

Im sure a 7900GS consumes less power both idle/load by a mile. (reference to xbitlabs where a 7900GT itself consumes around 48.42W at load, the 7900GTX being around 84.21W or so compared to a 8800GTX which is around ~145.5W)

 

[nitromullet]

FYI... Jonnyguru attempted to do a review on the nMedia MP-500, but they didn't post it at the request of nMedia... The first one blew up, so they got a second one... It blew up also...

http://www.jonnyguru.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1094

posted by jonnyGURU on page 6:

Well, the second PSU died just like the first one.

It was sitting there with a 508W load on it and the AC input just started climbing and climbing and climbing and then POP! It blew.

nMedia asked me not to put the review up. Jack's been really nice and he's a bit concerned that his job would be in jeoprady if such a scathing review went live. I won't put it in regular navigation, but I will link what I do have here once I thumbnail the Oscope shots tonight.

...not sure how many "gems in the rough" would deserve a scathing review...

 

[Cookie Monster]

Ouch, that pretty much put the final nail in the coffin of this thread.

 

[HOOfan 1]

Hey I agree everyone was being a little to hard on taltamir, I like I originally posted, I won't even say his PSU was at fault. But his argument was faulty because he had and possibly still has some misconceptions about how PSUs work.

Really I can't imagine just saying you won't even bother with the 8800 anymore....I also can't understand why anyone would be willing to spend $300+ on a videocard but cheap out on the PSU to run it.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Agreed. Should have taken extra steps to find out what the problem was, because ~$300 isnt any small money.

Well everybody's different though.

 

[JAG87]

Originally posted by: nitromullet
FYI... Jonnyguru attempted to do a review on the nMedia MP-500, but they didn't post it at the request of nMedia... The first one blew up, so they got a second one... It blew up also...

http://www.jonnyguru.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1094

posted by jonnyGURU on page 6:

Well, the second PSU died just like the first one.

It was sitting there with a 508W load on it and the AC input just started climbing and climbing and climbing and then POP! It blew.

nMedia asked me not to put the review up. Jack's been really nice and he's a bit concerned that his job would be in jeoprady if such a scathing review went live. I won't put it in regular navigation, but I will link what I do have here once I thumbnail the Oscope shots tonight.

...not sure how many "gems in the rough" would deserve a scathing review...

rofl, I want the money I bet on the salesman, wheres my money bitch!

Originally posted by: HOOfan 1
Hey I agree everyone was being a little to hard on taltamir, I like I originally posted, I won't even say his PSU was at fault. But his argument was faulty because he had and possibly still has some misconceptions about how computers work.

Really I can't imagine just saying you won't even bother with the 8800 anymore....I also can't understand why anyone would be willing to spend $300+ on a videocard but cheap out on the PSU to run it.

fixed

 

[Avalon]

Guess my benefit of the doubt was ill founded.

 

[ELopes580]

Originally posted by: JAG87

Originally posted by: taltamir

Originally posted by: HOOfan 1
I wasn't saying your PSU wasn't enough, merely saying that your assumption that it was capable of 33Amps on the 12V rail was incorrect.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817151036
Check out this 650watt seasonic PSU.
It has 4 v12 rails... 3 of them at 19 amps. and a fourth with 0.8 (dont ask me what it is for)

My PSU has two v12 rails. One at 16 amps (to which the hard drives connect)... and one at 18amps to which the video card is connected.

If I wanted to connect TWO video cards to my PSU I would have to have one get 18 amps to itself, and one share 16amps with the rest of the system (using molex to PCIe power convertor)... BAD IDEA. My PSU can NOT support two video cards.

However if you had that 650 watt 120$ seasonic PSU you would get the ability to plug two video cards each to their own 19 amps rail, and the rest of the system would run in the third 19 amp rail.

So that PSU gives 1 extra amp. 19 instead of 18, to the video card... (unless I am completely wrong about how my PSU is structured and its 16amps dedicated to video card and 18 amps to the rest of the system... but that wouldn't make sense).

This 700watt 130$ PSU from OCZ:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817341002

Has 4 v12 rails with 18 amps each...
So it can have 1 rail support the system... and 3 rails each for a video card giving a dedicated 18amps per video card. SAME amount per video card as my PSU... except MY psu is limited to ONE video card. This PSU can feed 3 video cards.



So assuming there is no way to use multiple rails in parrallel (ie, that a video card cannot draw power from both rail 1 and rail 2... which doesnt make sense according to my knowledge of electricity). then my PSU gives the same treatment per video card as those PSU's... except mine is limited to one video card...

Ofcourse, that wouldn't explain why that 4 rail v12 PSU has only TWO PCIe power plugs... that means it can only get two video cards plugged in, does that mean that the other two 18amp rails are split between the various connectors going to the rest of the system? with each hard drive taking less then 0.5 amps at full power that second 18amp rail going to the system could power an additional 40 harddrives!

god, you are so clueless.


This basically sums it up. /thread

 

[Puffnstuff]

PS's also loose capacity as they heat up which is why it might run stable right after the system boots but after a few minutes of building heat it sags below what they system needs and something happens. This is one of the reasons I bought an enermax galaxy ps this time around. Its power rating is at a sustained 50C 24/7 and it's the only one that I know of with this rating apart from enterprise grade ps's.

 

[Zap]

Originally posted by: Puffnstuff
Its power rating is at a sustained 50C 24/7 and it's the only one that I know of with this rating apart from enterprise grade ps's.

That's because a lot of higher wattage PSUs are really just repurposed server PSUs.

I've taken apart an old dual 1.6GHz Xeon server (should give you an idea of how old) and the PSU was the spitting image of a high end gaming unit down to the +12v output on the label and 80mm fan, minus the PEG plugs.

 

[Keysplayr]

Talt, I wish there was a way you could get back that exact 8800GTS, and buy a higher capacity PSU (a quality one) and run them.
Basically, at least 5 people in this thread have mentioned that PSU's, when stressed enough, can degrade VERY quickly. Quick enough for the naked eye and a amp meter to see according to Jonny Guru.

What you would "need" to do, if you're really still in the market to upgrade your vid card to a 8800GTS, is to buy a well rated PSU that has a surplus of power. Higher than your needs. Search the net for a method of measuring your current power draw of your system with your 7900GS in it. Take that number, subtract the power the 7900GS uses, then add the power the 8800GTS uses.

When you arrive on your number, visit Johnny Guru and see what is recommended for your power consumption. Then purchase a PSU accordingly.

I have an Antec 500W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817103940
It came with a case I purchased. It runs my rig with either a 8800GTS 640 or a 2900XT 512.
I only have 2 Hard drives and 1 case fan. An E 6420 @ stock speeds. and 2GB DDR2.
I will admit, the PSU did run much warmer with the 2900XT connected,caused me some concerns, but I didn't run it in there for very long. Just long enough for benchmarking. Now the 8800GTS 640 has been in there since April '07.

 

[bfdd]

Man the PSU is one thing I don't mind splurging on. It's definitely his PSU, I read the first 3 pages didn't get to the 4th and 5th. That graphics card + his harddrives is already eating up over 300w of power when he was gaming. I'm guessing his CPU is overclocked, throw in the mobo, case fans and all that jazz he's raping his 450w PSU.

 

[AmberClad]

Originally posted by: bfdd
Man the PSU is one thing I don't mind splurging on. It's definitely his PSU, I read the first 3 pages didn't get to the 4th and 5th. That graphics card + his harddrives is already eating up over 300w of power when he was gaming. I'm guessing his CPU is overclocked, throw in the mobo, case fans and all that jazz he's raping his 450w PSU.

You really need to read this one through to the end . You haven't even seen the climax of this little story yet, if you've only read pages 1-3...

 

[Zap]

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: bfdd
he's raping his 450w PSU.

You really need to read this one through to the end . You haven't even seen the climax of this little story yet, if you've only read pages 1-3...

I only see one page.

For bfdd, it was shown that the guy's PSU was tested by Jonnyguru and found unable to output "rated" power.

 

[ArchAngel777]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Talt, I wish there was a way you could get back that exact 8800GTS, and buy a higher capacity PSU (a quality one) and run them.
Basically, at least 5 people in this thread have mentioned that PSU's, when stressed enough, can degrade VERY quickly. Quick enough for the naked eye and a amp meter to see according to Jonny Guru.

What you would "need" to do, if you're really still in the market to upgrade your vid card to a 8800GTS, is to buy a well rated PSU that has a surplus of power. Higher than your needs. Search the net for a method of measuring your current power draw of your system with your 7900GS in it. Take that number, subtract the power the 7900GS uses, then add the power the 8800GTS uses.

When you arrive on your number, visit Johnny Guru and see what is recommended for your power consumption. Then purchase a PSU accordingly.

I have an Antec 500W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817103940
It came with a case I purchased. It runs my rig with either a 8800GTS 640 or a 2900XT 512.
I only have 2 Hard drives and 1 case fan. An E 6420 @ stock speeds. and 2GB DDR2.
I will admit, the PSU did run much warmer with the 2900XT connected,caused me some concerns, but I didn't run it in there for very long. Just long enough for benchmarking. Now the 8800GTS 640 has been in there since April '07.

Why is this thread rated down?

Anyway, I certainly agree that it *could* be PSU related, but I doubt it. I have three very old PSU's that are running, or have run G80 (8800GTS) cards. Two of them were 22A single rail on the +12 and one of them was even a 16A single rail!! Crazy, but it worked and 3DMark06 gave it the score it should have. The machine didn't crash and was stable. Now that isn't to say I would recomend running a weak power supply like that, but mine were several years old, low quality and they were up for the task. Again, I don't understand why this thread was rated down.

 

[John]

Originally posted by: taltamir
"It is more then enough, besides watts dont mean anything, my PSU is rated for 33 amps on the 12 volt rail and this card only needs 24"

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this yet, but the 24A recommendation is for the entire system and not the graphics card. It's also on the high side to account for low quality psu's. Since the 8800GTS (old and new) only have a single PCIe connector the max power that the card is capable of consuming is 150W (12.5A). IIRC the TDP of the G92 is around 110W. These are not power-hungy cards, but with the factory hsf they do run hot (in most cases).

Its a gem in the rough.

Your psu is more rough than gem. I've seen psu's cause problems with video cards on several occasions over the years. A while back I had a customer with a BFG8800GTS (G80) and he kept experiencing artifacts after a few minutes of gaming. BFG was generous enough to RMA the card 3 times, and since he still had the artifacting problem he brought it to me to diagnose. While I was troubleshooting I noticed that he had a Thermaltake 480-500W psu (don't recall the exact model), and after I disconnected the 24-pin ATX connector I noticed some burn marks. Once I installed a new psu the artifacts were no longer a problem.

I have these hard drives:
http://www.westerndigital.com/...oducts.asp?DriveID=311
2 of the 750GB models and 2 of the 500GB models...

All connected to a SATA power cable coming out of the PSU (SATA power cable provide 3.3, 5, and 12 volt to the drive for it to use whichever it wants!)

They are set up into two raid1 arrays (software based, with the nforce570 mobo)
Their idle consumption is 0.45 amp from the v12 and their active consumption (read/write) is 0.46 amps.
So assuming all 4 drives are writing at once, and that the 500GB drives take the same amount of power as the 750GB model... I Would be looking at absolute max 1.84 amps from v12.
The raid1 array made up of two 750GB drives is the one where my games are running from (also where I keep my CD images. I don't use a CD drive for games...)

One thing to keep in mind is that while each drive only consumes 8-10W during read/write they will each consume 25-30W during spinup.

http://wdc.custhelp.com/cgi-bi...YWtz&p_li=&p_topview=1

If I were in your shoes I'd seriously consider a quality psu instead of using a ticking time bomb.

 

[TecHNooB]

I hope I get this much help when I build my next PC

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I hope I get this much help when I build my next PC

That's easy... Just post that you are planning on pairing up this with this, and you'll plenty of 'help' from AT forums.

 

[skillyho]

You guys are harsh......geez. What happened to enlightening instead of bashing?


Talt, Did you ever purchase a new card?

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: skillyho
You guys are harsh......geez. What happened to enlightening instead of bashing?


Talt, Did you ever purchase a new card?

This thread was never written as a request for help. The OP was trying to poke fun at Fry's employees. AT forums just pointed that if you're going to poke fun at someone else, you might want to know what you are talking about. Consider it a life lesson instead of tech support.

 

[dreddfunk]

Originally posted by: nitromullet

Originally posted by: skillyho
You guys are harsh......geez. What happened to enlightening instead of bashing?


Talt, Did you ever purchase a new card?

This thread was never written as a request for help. The OP was trying to poke fun at Fry's employees. AT forums just pointed that if you're going to poke fun at someone else, you might want to know what you are talking about. Consider it a life lesson instead of tech support.

Ah yes, the wonderful life lesson of, "it's a-okay to make fun of someone who tried to make fun of someone else as long as they were wrong about their facts."

Nitro, I have to respectfully disagree and say that this is not a valuable lesson to learn.

The valuable lesson to learn is to not poke fun at people for their lack of knowledge. Another valuable lesson to learn is that when you poke fun at people they stop listening to you. Thus poking fun is only about bolstering your own ego at someone else's expense, not about teaching them any "valuable life lessons." A final lesson to learn is that bolstering your own ego at another's expense is pretty unsavory behavior.

In the end, Taltamir simply shouldn't have poked fun at the Fry's employee; and many people here shouldn't have poked fun at Taltamir.

If someone can't be taught, there is no reason to engage in conversation with them. If someone can be taught, there is no reason to deride them.

 

[ManWithNoName]

Originally posted by: skillyho
You guys are harsh......geez. What happened to enlightening instead of bashing?


Talt, Did you ever purchase a new card?

Most weren't harsh until page 3 of trying to "enlighten" him. Just read through this whole thread and there were plenty of people trying to enlighten him instead of bashing him. Including a post by Nitro on the first page, another by Keysplayr2003, another by HOOfan 1, plus others. He basically refused to be "enlightened" no mater what anyone said. Small wonder it turned ugly after a while.

 

[AzN]

Looks like you broke it and returned it. That's what most people do anyways. Dump the problems to the manufacturer or retailer.

I thought you bought 8800gt from dell why did you buy this from Fry's for nearly $400?

 

[mooncancook]

Sounds similar to my story. Bought a 3870 from fry's, ran fine for a day, the next day after some AOE3 I started getting lots artifacts that won't go away (but only during gaming). Returned it and I saw them putting a return for resale sticker on it. Anyway I got an eVGA 8800GTS512 after returning, and I agree that the cooler is huge yet it still runs very hot. Quite disappointed.

Another time I returned a memory card reader. I told them it worked fine, just that the model doesn't support SDHC which I needed. The guy put a Return to Vendor sticker on it.

 

[Synomenon]

I've had a similar experience with a motherboard. Bought a motherboard from Fry's. Got home and opened it only to find that the NB heatsink was loose in the box and had knocked some caps. off the board. Went back, explained what I had found upon opening it and the employee simply printed out one of their resale stickers and put it on the box.