Caddy: Why can't we discuss the real issues behind this?
Moonbeam: I know you realize that when you say real you mean real in your opinion, but perhaps you would like to tell us people out here who don't know what's real, of course in your, opinion, what real in your opinion is. Try to be clear and logical in your explanation and don't appeal to any negatives that are just assumed. Make a logical case for anything you wish to imply is good or bad. I know it will be logical, in your opinion, but we all have various amounts of judgment we have to call up to evaluate such things. I have lots of judgment, I'm sure you agree.
C: The issue Mr.Condescending asshat is that it's a societal judgment(or feelings).
Homosexuality is not accepted as normal by society.
Interspecies relations are not accepted as normal by society.
Polygamy is not accepted as normal by society.
Incest is not accepted as normal by society.
Pedophilia is not accepted as normal by society.
and you could list all the other societal "taboos" as not "normal".
Now then why is one a "rights" issue and the others not? Anyone who runs around and bellers "BIGOT" at people is a two faced hypocrite if they do not wish to grant "rights" the above - according to their usage of "bigot" anyway.
So this "gay marriage" issue is not about "rights" - it's about becoming a societal "norm". What are the reasons for it to become a societal "norm"? Why should homosexual marriage be a "norm" and not the other examples?
I'll be waiting on the edge of my seat for your "enlightened" reply
M: by your command an enlightened post:
I guessed when you said you wanted to get real that you meant fly off into irrelevancy. This is the issue as I see it:
How does it happen, Caddy, that you and the rest of your like minded bigots out there, have come to value your conditioning in homophobic hate above the right of two people who happen to love each other and want to devote their lives to each other in love unto death do they part? You are the same person as the person who kills your wife. How did you get so far away that you can't see what you do unto others. You are a monster but you are blind and there is nothing to do but forgive you and hope that you grow in the light.
C: Wow - looks like I guessed correctly - no substance to the "enlightened" response - just more blubbering about "bigots" and creating the illusion of hate.
Get back to me when you find time to address my questions.
M: Illusions of hate? I hardly think somebody who would murder his wife over a theory of bigotry is an illusion of hate. You are hate in the raw. Of course you couldn't understand unless somebody did kill your wife like you would do unto others.
C: Yep - continue the games moonie. Someday you'll have to address my questions - you can't blow smoke forever.
Get back to me when you find time to address my questions.
M: I'm sorry Caddy but why should I obey your request when you didn't bother with mine. Above you will note that I said:
"I know you realize that when you say real you mean real in your opinion, but perhaps you would like to tell us people out here who don't know what's real, of course in your, opinion, what real in your opinion is. Try to be clear and logical in your explanation and don't appeal to any negatives that are just assumed. Make a logical case for anything you wish to imply is good or bad. I know it will be logical, in your opinion, but we all have various amounts of judgment we have to call up to evaluate such things. I have lots of judgment, I'm sure you agree."
You then proceeded to answer with a statement full of unconscious bias and bigotry and unjustified implications and claims exactly as I had asked you not to. And you did so while pretending to be real. All that was real there was your bigot and the obvious fact you are blind. Your bigotry is like the smell of gas soaked into your clothes. Everything that comes our of your mouth or fingers is loaded with bigotry. Here is your reply once more with annotations to help you see, useless as those will be for you:
"The issue Mr.Condescending asshat is that it's a societal judgment(or feelings).
Homosexuality is not accepted as normal by society. (Interracial marriage was not accepted as normal. End of relevance for 'not normal' as a bone of contension.)
Interspecies relations are not accepted as normal by society. (This was what you called getting real. We are talking about gay marriage your bigotry wants to tar gays with animal sex. Animals do not consent to having sex with people and is a form of abuse, animal abuse or cruelty to animals and is against the law because it hurts animals and without their consent)
Polygamy is not accepted as normal by society.(What society and when did we get on polygamy. The implication is that we are on a slippery slope but the real slippery slope is that we are in danger of becoming the Taliban if bigots like you succeed in creating bigoted law.)
Incest is not accepted as normal by society. (Incest is generally a father taking advantage of his position of authority to seduce his daughter. Her consent, therefore has to be seen as suspect. There are also known genetic risks and what is not normal in the animal world is inbreeding. But I'm glad you didn't feel it was a problem for Adam and Eve's kids)
Pedophilia is not accepted as normal by society. (This involves people below the age of consent who are therefor legally protected.)
as you could list all the other societal "taboos" as not "normal".
(But the real point is your use of the words 'not normal'. You want to do what all bigots do which is to impute evil into not normal as though good were the norm. You do this because your brain has never learned to think critically. You are a propagandist rather than a logician because you are brainwashed with the notion that homosexuality is evil. Cancer is not normal. people with cancer can marry. Not normal is no reason not to marry. What you mean is evil should not marry. But homosexuality isn't evil. Bigotry is though because of the damage it does. Nuts like you threaten to destroy the checks and balances put up to stop the tyranny of an insane and bigoted majority, assholes who think they are normal.
So you see, well of course you don't see, but other people will, there is nothing real about what you call getting real. If social judgment(or feelings) were a source of truth or justice or light, then a majority of people who believed that slavery's OK and create laws to hold slaves would be living in the right, the same right that went on for thousands of years. )
Now then why is one a "rights" issue and the others not? Anyone who runs around and bellers "BIGOT" at people is a two faced hypocrite if they do not wish to grant "rights" the above - according to their usage of "bigot" anyway.
(Nobody can grant rights, dunce. Rights come from the fact that they are self evident and given by the Creator. It is you who wants to play God and take rights away.)
So this "gay marriage" issue is not about "rights" - it's about becoming a societal "norm". (Hehe, here you try again to conflate norm with evil because you were put in a box as a child and told that outside that box is evil. Gay marriage will never be the norm because gays are a small percent of the people)
What are the reasons for it to become a societal "norm"? (That is the wrong question since it's not about becomming. It's about retaining the right to be free in the face of bigotry. The truth is there is no logical, rational reason why gays can't marry. There is only bigotry that stands in the way. The courts will simply reaffirm what we already knew, that we live in a land of the free.)
Why should homosexual marriage be a "norm" and not the other examples? (As stated, it will not be a norm. Gay marriage will happen in smaller numbers than straight marriage. Straight couples marrying for the fifth or sixth time won't be the norm either, but they will be represented, I'm sure. A bigot cannot comprenend 'norm')