This second part is what I wanted to say but was too frustrated to put into words. Thank you.
This second part is what I wanted to say but was too frustrated to put into words. Thank you.There's two problems here that I want to highlight. First, rewarding those who broke the law while ignoring everyone following it is a travesty. That's my main point. Any immigration system should (1) apply to the needs of the country as a whole, and (2) be fair to a would-be immigrant. Any proposals by you pro immigrant crowd reward law breakers while shafting those following the laws. That's not fair, period, no matter how stupid you think the laws would be.
If Obama passes an admin fix that says anyone illegal in the country gets an employment authorization that's infinitely renewable, how is that fair to someone in the queue, working here, who would have to get a visa and jump through all the hoops that represents? Even worse, I could just throw my papers away, make up a fake name, and get the exact same benefits. How does this make any sense whatsoever?
If I need to change jobs with my visa, I need to prove a variety of things, including how special my knowledge is and how I'm not harming american workers wages, which is correct because, you know, this is your country and you don't want your own people to be shafted.
If I had come here illegally, I can get my employment authorization with NO rules whatsoever on how it distorts the labor market, switch jobs willy nilly, and so on.
There's maybe a few hundred thousand of me and several million illegals.
HOW THE FUCK DOES THIS MAKE SENSE?
That's the problem with you guys. You use grandiose ideals to solve a problem thats incredibly complicated when it comes to details.
Secondly, immigration law. I found this comment of yours interesting:
I appreciate your desire to be immigrant friendly, and I agree that the current system is convoluted. But you're asking the wrong question, because you're starting from an assumption that any and every immigrant is what the USA needs.
The real question is, what kind of immigrants benefit the USA? How can the laws ensure that such immigrants have an efficient time immigrating? That's where you start at. Not at looking at the current system, realizing it doesn't work, and just opening the borders.
There's a quote saying that immigrants can be hypocritical, and would love to shut the doors behind them. I can't speak for all immigrants, but I can speak for myself.
I came here because of the opportunities this country provides. However, I don't believe these should be "free". If you want the opportunities America represents, then you have to be able to put in the work that's required to make it here, show that your skills are needed, and that you're a valued member of society. The USA is a VIP club and you have to prove that you merit to be here. That's how I view it.
If you just let everyone in willy nilly, then why would I want to come here?
So the ideal solution would be to figure out what America's needs are in this century, based on pragmatism, not on poems written on statues. Then structure a policy around that, and enforce a policy.
I realize this is impossible to happen in the current, polarized state of the political machinery here... so if this can't be done, at least make sure that any fixes apply fairly to people who follow the law.
This is an interesting story.
What country do you come from that it takes 25 years to become an American citizen?
Unfortunately nixium, the answer from the pro-Open Borders crowd to 'what kind of people do we need here' is: Whoever can make it, and, if you disagree with that, you're a racist xenophobe.
And with that, the lines are drawn...
And guess whose problems get listened to? I mean, look at your post, you started with "interesting story" implying you don't really believe this could happen.
Thanks, liberals. Thanks a LOT. If I ever make it to citizenship, you'll know who I'm going to vote for... if the country isn't already fucked by then.
Is there a lot of these Open Borders people posting here?
It's not hard to understand what people are arguing for...
- I came here as a student when I was 17 (2001)
- After my bachelors, I continued into grad school. I wanted to do a PhD, but a company seduced me away. After spending a while in China, I came back here.
- They filed a employment based green card for me in 2009.
- Thanks to government errors, my application only made it through in 2011.
- This is where the problem is. Every applicant for permanent residency has to abide by a diversity rule, which means that no more than 7% of all green cards in a year can go to a person born in that country.
- I'm of Indian origin, and we're oversubscribed. So the wait time (non-linear - No one really knows how the government calculates this - is 6-7 years IF you have a grad degree.
- I won't go into the convoluted details of the exact process that a company needs to file an immigrant petition for someone. It'll ruin your faith in anything Government does, and I don't think you're ready for that yet.
- If you change jobs when this process is going on, you have to file an application all over again (you get to retain your original date, thankfully) Which I just did.
- Oh, did I mention that the actual application process takes a year if everything goes smoothly? If there are audits, it can take 3 years, in which time more hoops have to be jumped through.
- So doing the math, I'm thinking I'll get my green card in about 2017 or so, assuming everything goes OK.
- add five years for citizenship (2022)
Total time spent in the country ~ 23 years.
And I have to have a squeaky clean record the whole time. No minor arrests, prove that I don;t have any serious diseases, prove that I've been paying taxes, etc. I get to be quizzed every time i enter or exit the country and have to maintain a suitcase full of documents.
Contrast this:
- If I was from Pakistan, I would be a citizen by now. Or from Iran, North Korea, hell even Russia. Fuck, the Boston bombers got a green card before I did.
- If I had thrown away my student visa after I got here, I would have a unlimited employment authorization that I could use to freely change jobs without having to refile applications over and over again.
And guess whose problems get listened to? I mean, look at your post, you started with "interesting story" implying you don't really believe this could happen. Well you better believe this, because I'm living this life. But my story doesn't matter... the story of someone who stole in here and wants all the benefits while breaking all the rules makes it to NYTimes.
Thanks, liberals. Thanks a LOT. If I ever make it to citizenship, you'll know who I'm going to vote for... if the country isn't already fucked by then.
Lol! How did "liberals" screw you exactly?
Videos And Pics of illegals getting better treatment than many american groups every would:
By having a CIR-or-bust approach to solving this problem, and not taking it piecemeal as it's supposed to be.
Fix the issues surrounding legal immigration, then figure out what to do with the illegal immigrants already here. The two are not connected and I blame liberals for only focusing on the latter.
By having a CIR-or-bust approach to solving this problem, and not taking it piecemeal as it's supposed to be.
Fix the issues surrounding legal immigration, then figure out what to do with the illegal immigrants already here. The two are not connected and I blame liberals for only focusing on the latter.
Not a problem. I'll be happy to. My point is that you're an emo wacko that can't grasp the concept of hyperbole and mild hyperbole at that. You're fucked up in the head. Thanks for asking.So why don't you say exactly what your point is, rather than continuing to mouth vague shit.
The outcome I desire is for the illegal uneducated 3rd world masses to go home.
America does not have a lack of uneducated workers.
Not a problem. I'll be happy to. My point is that you're an emo wacko that can't grasp the concept of hyperbole and mild hyperbole at that. You're fucked up in the head. Thanks for asking.
Oh I'm sure they're the wrong questions, asking them makes allowing so many illegals in mighty painful for the Politicians and those pro-Open Border. Tell me, how does it help an established society with established wages and established standards of living to have 3rd worlders come in, live 10 to a house, put large strains on the social services (that their tax revenues will never pay for), all the while directly competing with the lower and lower-middle working classes? Does it help the high school student who graduated with a D average and is making $15 an hour doing flooring, the market rate, when a flood of your legal (now illegal but legal under your dream) come in and saturate the market with low wage opportunity? I mean, I know it helps the owner employing these new legals, he gets to charge the same and pocket more. I know it might (and I stress might) help the customer, as in theory, they're going to get more for less (unless the owner just pockets the difference, which is common)...and then there's the re-work/long term quality that they won't see initially. But, for all the already US citizens before these new legals come in, the ones who will now go from $15 an hour to $9 an hour to compete, or who will just loose their jobs, you know, the ones that can't afford to, exactly what happens to them? Sorry, I must have missed it, how is allowing tens of millions of competition for them into the US going to benefit them again? Please don't say 'Oh, they can retrain'. Guess what - they can't/won't. They're a D average high school grad, those don't retrain, they go on unemployment and suck up social services, and so do the 2-4 kids they have.
Of course they'd go legit, haha. That's not the US problem, that's theirs for coming here illegally. As for 'net positive', WTF are you smoking man? Have you lost your mind completely? Lets do the math: Minimum wage dad and mom, both now legal, with 2 kids. That will be a complete Fed tax return of...everything. State as well. Plus, state sponsored healthcare. Plus, because kids, some kind of food handout. Plus, because kids, housing assistance. Plus, because kids, they are both in school. 8 years gradeschool, $13k per year per kid. Another 4 years high school, last I looked 2 years ago, $16k per kid per year. Then, since they're legal, they will themselves be entitled to social security and Medicare. Can you break it down for me exactly where they're net positive? Please again, don't tell me it's because they're providing less cost to customer.
No actually I want it on our southern border, and, as I already said, not a wall (at least not in all areas).
No actually they're not the same thing at all. Your heart bleeds for these people, fine. Bleed at home. Enjoy the benefits of them living on top of you, of you paying for them. Heck, it's 'a net positive' for you, amirite? I mean, look, they'll do the dishes sometimes, maybe clean once a while, and, you can accountant account for everyone in your household being bilingual (well, no need for that if we didn't allow tens of millions in, but hey, why be practical about it). Are you now saying you don't want to support your familia? I get this sense you want them here, you want the "cheap" lawncare, the "cheap" vending, but you don't want to actually live with the problems these tens of millions bring to others. Err...why is that? You're not xenophobic are you? If having them here is good, then having them in your own house directly contributing to you, and you to them, would be even better, would it not?
Well, when governments build walls - real or virtual - to keep invaders out (lethal or otherwise), and let their own population go where they want, I'm not seeing a problem from their own populations perspective. Sorry, exactly how would that affect a US citizen again?
There's two problems here that I want to highlight. First, rewarding those who broke the law while ignoring everyone following it is a travesty. That's my main point. Any immigration system should (1) apply to the needs of the country as a whole, and (2) be fair to a would-be immigrant. Any proposals by you pro immigrant crowd reward law breakers while shafting those following the laws. That's not fair, period, no matter how stupid you think the laws would be.
If Obama passes an admin fix that says anyone illegal in the country gets an employment authorization that's infinitely renewable, how is that fair to someone in the queue, working here, who would have to get a visa and jump through all the hoops that represents? Even worse, I could just throw my papers away, make up a fake name, and get the exact same benefits. How does this make any sense whatsoever?
If I need to change jobs with my visa, I need to prove a variety of things, including how special my knowledge is and how I'm not harming american workers wages, which is correct because, you know, this is your country and you don't want your own people to be shafted.
If I had come here illegally, I can get my employment authorization with NO rules whatsoever on how it distorts the labor market, switch jobs willy nilly, and so on.
There's maybe a few hundred thousand of me and several million illegals.
HOW THE FUCK DOES THIS MAKE SENSE?
That's the problem with you guys. You use grandiose ideals to solve a problem thats incredibly complicated when it comes to details.
The real question is, what kind of immigrants benefit the USA? How can the laws ensure that such immigrants have an efficient time immigrating? That's where you start at. Not at looking at the current system, realizing it doesn't work, and just opening the borders.
This isn't going to happen. So you may as well explore realistic options.
Liberals said the same thing 10 years ago. No one is saying you are going to deport 10 million people over night. If we had implemented it then it would have happened by now.
Nobody is rewarding people for breaking the law. It would allow an avenue of citizenship that is simply not realistic right now as your story proves. It is dealing with the reality of the situation that we cant deport 20 million people.
No it wouldn't. We already deport hundreds of thousands of people each year. The result is the illegal population is growing.
List the number of countries in the last 100 years that built walls and armed them. Then let their citizen flow freely.
Because we have policies that encourage more to come.
Illegal immigrants should be living in fear. Whereas in reality they feel free to have cross-country van tours advertising they are illegal immigrants. Or show up in a court of law claiming to be an illegal immigrant. Or show up at congressional offices claiming to be an illegal immigrant.
I mean we are catching illegal immigrants on the border and they are now being released and told to come to court later
I think you have a bloated idea of what it is like to be an illegal immigrant in this country. It isn't some picnic. The only stories you hear about are the fringe about an illegal showing up to court and being released.
There is a reason why they go underground. If they felt as free as you claim they wouldn't hide.
Maybe chucky should start out with a much smaller wall to begin with.
Build a 50 ft. wall around Chicago, and some more smaller 30 ft walls to separate the neighborhoods
Then in a decade show the rest of the US all the positive results