IDE vs. SCSI reliability

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: Googer

Anyone know anything about cracking open a Compaq server case? Any surprises generally?

Nothing too scary in there, you may large funny shaped passive cooling device and a few proprietary parts (ram).

*Groan*...So I have to order the RAM from Compaq? That's outrageous...

I've never heard of proprietary RAM (thought it was SDRAM/DDR/Rambus, etc. - always a standard). I'll have to investigate. Thanks for the tips.

Compaq uses a special SPD that does not allow the computer to boot unless it has the correct ram. This is an old trick used by manufacturers for a long time now, to get you to buy ram from them.

Compaq, Dell, and I believe IBM or Gatewaty do this and have done this since the 80's

You can find HPaq compatible RAM at many resellers, Viking, Kingston, and Crucial come to mind.
Of course HPaq won't support it, but that's another matter

 

[SickBeast]

OK I'm bringing this thread back from the grave w/ an update :light:. Here is some information that some people may find useful:

- Compaq Proliant servers based on P3 667's use a proprietary SCSI carriage for drives mounted in the external SCSI rack (there are G1, G2, and G3 versions; the one I have been dealing with is a G1)

- there is NO ROOM inside the chassis for IDE hard drives; only 3 5.25" bays to accomodate CD-ROM drives and such

- an 18GB 10K SCSI drive for the server costs $650CDN from Compaq

Here is my plan:

1. Build an archival storage machine based on Windows XP Pro. In essence it will have two 250GB SATA drives in RAID-1, along with a DVD burner. It will also serve as a print server.

2. Back up the current 18GB drives to another workstation on the network (possibly two for redundancy?).

3. Disassemble one current 18GB drive chassis and replace the 18GB drive with a 74GB 10K SCSI (~$400CDN). There is no OS on the current drive, only files.

4. Enjoy the increased storage capacity.

I figure that down the line I can disassemble the other chassis, install and format a new drive, and install Windows XP Server, or potentially Longhorn if/when it is released, and again, enjoy even more storage capacity.

Here are the specs of the "Archival Server"

- ASUS P4E motherboard (SATA RAID onboard)
- 1.8GB Celeron *groan*
- 2 250GB Maxtor SATA drives w/ 16MB cache
- some crappy ATI video card (AGP)
- 512mb of RAM
- Pioneer 109 DVD burner

I could use some ideas on a backup solution for the main server. It will need to be capable of backing up 92GB of data. My thought is software that will copy the contents of the server to one of the workstations on a daily basis. I don't have the name of the program off-hand, but it essentially "syncs" a server folder with a location on one of the workstations in the office. It would be nice to have something that can store the data off-site. An external USB hard drive is probably the way to go...it would be awesome if I could get a 3.5" laptop drive that could do the job.

Ideas people, ideas! :beer:

 

[mechBgon]

:Q ~ someone said "SCSI!"

If you have three 5.25" bays available, what about... a herring!

wait... wrong script.

...a Supermicro hot-swap rack module for your choice of SATA or SCSI drives Pack four or five drives into three 5.25" bays, assuming your Compaq's PSU can hack it. Newegg's out-of-stock on the black ones (you know the black ones perform better ) but you could also look at other vendors like RackMountPro.com or wherever you shop.

You could have one or two 120GB SATA drives in the rack that are dedicated to the off-site storage role, and keep one or the other stashed (very gently) in a safe-deposit box at the bank. For backup purposes, Windows Backup can back up to a hard drive, and you can schedule jobs to suit your needs.

Then if you need a DVD burner in the mix somewhere, just plunk it into your own workstation. Am I missing any of the main goals here?

 

[SickBeast]

Interesting suggestion...

I'm guessing, then, that I would need a PCI-based SATA-RAID controller card?

That looks like a very elegant solution to the problem, thank-you very much.

My thought was to build a second server to act as a print server, and eventually a web server. Your proposed solution appears to be ideal for the time being and I can focus on a second server down the line (if it will even be necessary).

Question: For some incredibly odd reason, the server contains a plethora of files which have file extentions longer than 3 characters. I cannot copy these files over the network or burn them to DVD. Does anyone know how to work around this or deal with it? Batch renaming software perhaps?

 

[Sunner]

You don't need to buy the old Compaq branded disks, the HP branded disks(universal U320) are backwards compatible, and far cheaper.
Getting the old ones is expensive as hell since they're pretty much just spare parts these days.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: mechBgon
:Q ~ someone said "SCSI!"

If you have three 5.25" bays available, what about... a herring!

wait... wrong script.

...a Supermicro hot-swap rack module for your choice of SATA or SCSI drives Pack four or five drives into three 5.25" bays, assuming your Compaq's PSU can hack it. Newegg's out-of-stock on the black ones (you know the black ones perform better ) but you could also look at other vendors like RackMountPro.com or wherever you shop.

You could have one or two 120GB SATA drives in the rack that are dedicated to the off-site storage role, and keep one or the other stashed (very gently) in a safe-deposit box at the bank. For backup purposes, Windows Backup can back up to a hard drive, and you can schedule jobs to suit your needs.

Then if you need a DVD burner in the mix somewhere, just plunk it into your own workstation. Am I missing any of the main goals here?

You need a supermicro case for those to work the fit on the bottom and are partaly exposed to front of the case for easy access and removal.

But I am not sure if motherboards made by anyone (iwill, intel, asus, tyan, gigabyte) else would mount in a supermicro case.

http://supermicro.com/products/chassis/4U/942/SC942i-R760.cfm

 

[Googer]

Also WD Raptors have an unproven and so far questionable track record for reliabilty. I have heard a few complaints about the 36gb model.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Sunner
You don't need to buy the old Compaq branded disks, the HP branded disks(universal U320) are backwards compatible, and far cheaper.
Getting the old ones is expensive as hell since they're pretty much just spare parts these days.

Are you certain that the HP drives will work in an external Compaq Proliant SCSI rack? The drives appear to have some kind of custom retention mechanism. I'll take a photo the next time I'm at work.

Thank-you for a potentially excellent suggestion.

 

[sharkeeper]

RAWR!

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: Sunner
You don't need to buy the old Compaq branded disks, the HP branded disks(universal U320) are backwards compatible, and far cheaper.
Getting the old ones is expensive as hell since they're pretty much just spare parts these days.

Are you certain that the HP drives will work in an external Compaq Proliant SCSI rack? The drives appear to have some kind of custom retention mechanism. I'll take a photo the next time I'm at work.

Thank-you for a potentially excellent suggestion.

Actually it will depend on how old they are.
If they are of the "Universal" type, they'll work.
The difference is fairly obvious, the old drives are in a rather flimsy plastic tray, while the new Universal drives are a far more robust metal "case", it's also far larger than the old ones.

Look here.
The ones on the left are universal drives(as you might figure out if you read the page ).

We had to replace an 18 GB 7200 Compaq branded drive in an old ProLiant 1600 recently, and there's a brand new HP branded U320 drive in there now, working just fine.

 

[Googer]

I have seen those retention mechanisms for sale on various site before, so that any drive cound be used.