If Fury is overpriced, why is a $1000 Titan-X acceptable?

[BFG10K]

By all accounts, the Titan-X is overpriced garbage given it's marginally faster than a 980Ti, but costs a whopping $350 more. That's more than the cost of an entire GTX970.

Yet a Fury - overall slightly slower than a 980Ti, but costs the same - is a "massive disappointment", and has many threads detailing how wrong such a product is to exist.

Meanwhile, the Titan-X continues to quietly sit in the corner and sell for $1000. It must be selling well enough, because the price hasn't dropped.

So I have a question for the forum: why do you think there's such a blatant double standard?

 

[96Firebird]

Who here is suggesting a Titan X to anyone?

 

[DarkKnightDude]

Gotta think about it, the 980 Ti is slightly faster and has 6 GB of VRAM. Fury X however is priced at 650 like the 980 Ti. Makes no sense.

 

[BFG10K]

Who here is suggesting a Titan X to anyone?

If the Fury is overpriced for it's performance, the Titan-X is far worse.

So where are all the "Titan-X is a disappointment" and "Titan-X: what went wrong" threads?

Gotta think about it, the 980 Ti is slightly faster and has 6 GB of VRAM. Fury X however is priced at 650 like the 980 Ti. Makes no sense.

Thanks for perfectly proving my point about double standards. :awe:

 

[crisium]

Halo Tax.

Sure a Gigabyte G1 is faster than Titan X out of the box. But if you put Titan X and 980 Ti on water, then they will overclock about the same and you get the bonus of more Shaders, more TMUs, and more memory on the Titan X. Even most enthusiasts will chose the 980 Ti but for those with the money, skill, and time then getting Titan X's will undoubtedly provide the fastest 3D gaming achievable.

Fury X costs the same as a 980 Ti and provides slower 3D gaming.

 

[amenx]

If 980ti did not exist, OP would have a valid point. But it does so to compare Furyx to Titan x re pricing is pointless.

 

[ShintaiDK]

You describe it yourself. The Titan X is faster, got 12GB VRAM etc. Premium goods can charge premium price.

The Fury X is slower than the 980TI at the same price, uses more power, lacks some features and only got 4GB VRAM. However it got a water cooler.

 

[Silverforce11]

Apparently water cooling isn't worth anything. Cool, quiet, all the heat exhaust out your case, worthless. /s

I'd take Fury X CF over any 980Ti SLI except for the EVGA Hybrid.

As a single GPU setup, Fury X is about $50 too expensive. If it was $599, it could justify itself, trading blows**, less OC headroom but a lot more quiet/cooler & vent exhaust out case.

Exactly the same applies to the Titan-X, yet it continues to sell, and we never see a "Titan-X post-mortem: why the hell is it still $1000" thread.

Obviously the market tolerates nVidia's behavior, so why shouldn't AMD act the same way?

Actually I think you're onto something. AMD figures there's users out there who do value water cooling more than ppl on forums suggest. If they are all selling out, why should they lower the price?

** When I say trading blows, I mean it. Even at 1440p, I don't play Project Cars, Dying Light or most other GameWorks titles (except for Witcher 3) so the crap performance in those games mean nothing to me. For gamers who do play those games, Fury X at $400 isn't worth it because the performance deficit in some of those titles is 50% or more.

 

[Ancalagon44]

The Titan X is overpriced in comparison to the 980Ti, but not in comparison to any AMD hardware, because no AMD hardware directly competes with it.

The Fury X is overpriced because it costs as much as a 980Ti, but is slower than it.

Put it this way - if you have $1000 burning a hole in your pocket and you want a single GPU (not multi GPU), then the Titan X is your only option. Relative to the 980Ti, the Titan X is overpriced because you don't get an extra $350 worth of performance from it.

If you have $650 in your pocket, and you want a single GPU, then you can choose between Fury X and 980Ti. If you choose Fury X, you are getting a slightly slower card that doesn't overclock as well. Relative to the 980Ti, it is overpriced.

 

[Keysplayr]

BFG you know the answers to every question you posed in the OP. Why post this thread? Was it just to express outrage over Halo tax?

There is no double standard. Titan X is in a position all by itself at the top. At least for now.

And once again, the massive disappointment was due to the mega-hype for the product that didnt deliver. Something we've come to know as an AMD synonym.

Im very curious as to how you could not know any of this?
Please enlighten?

P.S. Also, didnt you buy an original Titan?
I assume you bought it used or heavily discounted. Scratch and dent maybe?

 

[Silverforce11]

Titan X isn't actually in the top position. Custom 980Ti come faster out of box by 10%. OC vs OC, they are still faster because they reach higher clocks more often, and the custom 980Ti can do it while being quieter.

Titan X has less TDP reserves due to power wasted on 6GB extra vram that serve no purpose in gaming.

So it's not a $350 halo tax. It's a $350 stupid tax.

 

[Alatar]

1) Titan came out first with no competition
2) Titan is still the fastest ref card
3) Nvidia also offers the 980Ti as a solution

Problem here is that AMD came into a competitive market with competing cards already selling at set price points and they couldn't quite match the 980Ti that was apparently their target.

If AMD wanted to get the same reaction as the Titan cards what they would have to do is launch before nvidia and put overkill amounts of memory on the cards. Have you noticed when premium NV cards work? It's when NV launches before AMD does.

Hard to pull a premium halo product when you bring it into market where the competing non-premium/halo products are going to beat it.

Apparently water cooling isn't worth anything. Cool, quiet, all the heat exhaust out your case, worthless. /s

I'd take Fury X CF over any 980Ti SLI except for the EVGA Hybrid.

As a single GPU setup, Fury X is about $50 too expensive. If it was $599, it could justify itself, trading blows**, less OC headroom but a lot more quiet/cooler & vent exhaust out case.

Even taking out the most NV favored titles (might as well take out Ryse, etc. for AMD then) the 980Ti is still faster at 1440p and definitely at 1080p (for people who run 120-144hz 1080p) so that "trading blows" does indeed require some asterisks because it's only really true at 4K and even at 4K you have to drop a couple of NV games to get parity with 980Ti.

 

[TemjinGold]

Put it this way - if you have $1000 burning a hole in your pocket and you want a single GPU (not multi GPU), then the Titan X is your only option. Relative to the 980Ti, the Titan X is overpriced because you don't get an extra $350 worth of performance from it.

Hey hey pocketing $350 should be an option!

 

[Keysplayr]

Titan X isn't actually in the top position. Custom 980Ti come faster out of box by 10%. OC vs OC, they are still faster because they reach higher clocks more often, and the custom 980Ti can do it while being quieter.

Titan X has less TDP reserves due to power wasted on 6GB extra vram that serve no purpose in gaming.

So it's not a $350 halo tax. It's a $350 stupid tax.

It's halo. Regardless of how stupid you believe it is. Regardless of how much of its memory you claim is useless. Regardless of its o/c potential. Its also full GM200. Halo.

To head off your next post to me....
No, i think TitanX is overpriced. I do not condone spending 1000.00 on a halo card. I was always the type that bought 2nd tier. Ti4400, 5900, 6800GT, 7900, 8800gts, etc. I still do.

 

[Ma_Deuce]

So I have a question for the forum: why do you think there's such a blatant double standard?

The goal posts do seem to shift a lot on these forums, but I don't think that the price of the Titan is a very good example if that... Titan pricing = It's good to be king

As far as the Fury X vs 980ti, I don't think it's as cut as dry as some label it. I would prefer the cooler and quieter card with water cooling @ $650 vs $650. Much for the same reason I got my 780 vs the 290x. Performance wasn't far enough negate the benefits of a quieter card.

 

[crisium]

Titan X isn't actually in the top position. Custom 980Ti come faster out of box by 10%. OC vs OC, they are still faster because they reach higher clocks more often, and the custom 980Ti can do it while being quieter.

Titan X has less TDP reserves due to power wasted on 6GB extra vram that serve no purpose in gaming.

So it's not a $350 halo tax. It's a $350 stupid tax.

http://site.ekwb.com/news/579/19/EK-releases-NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-TITAN-X-water-blocks/

I don't see any evidence that a water 980 Ti overclocks at least 9% more than a water TX (TX has 9% more Shaders/TMUs). Then there's no way you can account for double the VRAM. If you want the best, this is the best. It just takes a lot of money and the know how.

 

[Silverforce11]

It's halo. Regardless of how stupid you believe it is. Regardless of how much of its memory you claim is useless. Regardless of its o/c potential. Its also full GM200. Halo.

So its halo because NV says it is, not that its faster than custom 980Ti.

That's the point BFG is making, double standards.

AMD thinks Fury X is halo because its got great performance in a great package. As long as its sold out, they are justified.

 

[Abwx]

You describe it yourself. The Titan X is faster, got 12GB VRAM etc. Premium goods can charge premium price.

The Fury X is slower than the 980TI at the same price, uses more power, lacks some features and only got 4GB VRAM. However it got a water cooler.

100km south of your location they find the price very competitive, and no, the Titan is not faster overall.

http://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x-test/6/

http://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/...t/5/#diagramm-assassins-creed-unity-3840-2160

 

[Silverforce11]

http://site.ekwb.com/news/579/19/EK-releases-NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-TITAN-X-water-blocks/

I don't see any evidence that a water 980 Ti overclocks at least 9% more than a water TX (TX has 9% more Shaders/TMUs). Then there's no way you can account for double the VRAM. If you want the best, this is the best. It just takes a lot of money and the know how.

You mean you don't see any evidence to show OC Titan X beating OC 980Ti.. cos I don't see any credible reviews of that. But I've seen plenty of credible reviews that show custom 980Ti OC beating Titan X OC.

 

[Aristotelian]

I think some people are disappointed that this highly anticipated launch produced a card (at this stage, with early drivers) that can roughly match the 980ti at times, and at other times fall far behind - then the argument about why the Fury X falls behind comes into play.

I think people were expecting a Fury X that was - generally - faster than the 980ti and roughly the same price in order to compete, but this did not materialise. So I think people - from a competitiveness point of view - do not have that appealing reason to choose a Fury X over a 980ti unless the watercooling solution appeals and certain games will not be played.

That's the disappointment issue. On 'overpriced' I find this subjective unless there are clear comparisons, i.e., - two cards perform exactly the same but one is 100 dollars more - that's overpriced. If one card is even 5% faster but costs 15% more I would not argue it is overpriced because the utility that is derived from that 5% is a subjective value depending on the person.

And on the Titan X - is it not the fastest single gpu card in the world, hands down? If so, it stands in a category by itself and Nvidia can honestly charge whatever they want for it - depending on what the market will bear.

 

[Keysplayr]

100km south of your location they find the price very competitive, and no, the Titan is not faster overall.

http://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x-test/6/

http://www.computerbase.de/2015-06/...t/5/#diagramm-assassins-creed-unity-3840-2160

When AMD was on top in the CPU arena (pre conroe) what did they set as msrp on their flagship processor?

 

[SirPauly]

By all accounts, the Titan-X is overpriced garbage given it's marginally faster than a 980Ti, but costs a whopping $350 more. That's more than the cost of an entire GTX970.

Yet a Fury - overall slightly slower than a 980Ti, but costs the same - is a "massive disappointment", and has many threads detailing how wrong such a product is to exist.

Meanwhile, the Titan-X continues to quietly sit in the corner and sell for $1000. It must be selling well enough, because the price hasn't dropped.

So I have a question for the forum: why do you think there's such a blatant double standard?

I haven't read any posts recommending strongly the Titan X and ironically I read that the Titan X is overpriced, specifically when compared to the GTX 980ti.

The AMD Fury has exotic cooling, HBM, was suppose to be worth the wait, and yet doesn't out perform a cut down GM-100 core over-all, with far less cores utilizing traditional memory and far less bandwith, so, some disappointment would be expected considering the sheer hype of HBM for higher resolutions.

Your point of blatant double standards would hold water if there wasn't a GTX 980ti.

 

[ShintaiDK]

100km south of your location they find the price very competitive, and no, the Titan is not faster overall.

Price doesnt change 100KM south from me in any favour of the Fury X.

Both the Titan X and the 980Ti is faster than Fury X.
http://anandtech.com/bench/product/1447?vs=1513
http://anandtech.com/bench/product/1496?vs=1513

The only sole thing the Fury X got going for it is the water cooler. Assuming thats what you want in the first place. For all other parameters you get the 980Ti.

 

[Dribble]

You know there's a certain very small subset of buyers who just don't care how much it costs because they're rich. Titan still sells to them - some boutique pc builders are quite happy selling SLi titans boxes for $silly. If you are the top dog that's what you can do - look at cars, you can spend a lot of money on what is almost the same car only with a better badge.

 

[crisium]

You mean you don't see any evidence to show OC Titan X beating OC 980Ti.. cos I don't see any credible reviews of that. But I've seen plenty of credible reviews that show custom 980Ti OC beating Titan X OC.

Why wouldn't a custom 980 Ti beat the blower Titan X? There's no water vs water. I'm saying the Titan X exists for the smallest of the elites.

Unlimited budget and no time constraints, you would choose 4x 2816 Shaders and 6GB over 4x 3072 Shaders and 12GB on custom water? Titan X on water exceeds 1500MHz, just as 980 Ti. I agree anyone who buys a blower Titan X in today's market and doesn't modify it has thrown money away on worse performance compared to aftermarket 980 Ti.