If someone tries to steal your car should you have the right to shoot and kill them?

[DCal430]

The sad thing is I know for a fact if many of you if you saw a 12 year old kid jump into your backyard to retrieve an errant ball you would probably gun them down and claim self defense from an unarmed 12 year old.

Sickening that you place no value on another humans life. Your mind desires a lawless society were people rape, pillage, and steal from each other without any remorse.

 

[MotionMan]

The sad thing is I know for a fact if many of you if you saw a 12 year old kid jump into your backyard to retrieve an errant ball you would probably gun them down and claim self defense from an unarmed 12 year old.

Sickening that you place no value on another humans life. Your mind desires a lawless society were people rape, pillage, and steal from each other without any remorse.

Yeah, that is exactly what we said.



MotionMan

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

You can't use a 12yr kid as example. What's a 12yr going to do 12 at nite and stealing your car.

 

[Farang]

In other words should there be a death penalty for grand theft auto, with cars owners the judge, jury, and executioner?

No.

Its just a car, and its just a person making a dumb decision

 

[DCal430]

You can't use a 12yr kid as example. What's a 12yr going to do 12 at nite and stealing your car.

Who says it has to be 12 at night. There are people on ATOT who would gun down a 12 year old girl who jumped into their backyard at 2pm on a Saturday in broad daylight. People here who would kill a child without a second thought.

 

[bfdd]

car theft and car jacking are two different things. obviously car theft shouldn't involve the death penalty.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

In other words should there be a death penalty for grand theft auto, with cars owners the judge, jury, and executioner?

No.

Its just a car, and its just a person making a dumb decision

Have you ever caught a car thief in the act? Will he just throw his hands up in the air if you stop?
No he will use his illegal firearm and kill you. Judge executioner your dead he gets in your car and then poof gone

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

car theft and car jacking are two different things. obviously car theft shouldn't involve the death penalty.

We don't have a death penalty

 

[davmat787]

This is the problem I have with how this poll/thread was constructed. It forces people to take the absolute extreme ends of the spectrum, and in no way reflects real life situations and how a properly trained firearm owner would conduct himself. Hence all the rage from opposing viewpoints at the opposite extreme. Meanwhile their are millions and millions of law abiding citizens who choose to utilize their rights without doubletapping anyone that looks at them wrong way, as much as the OP feels otherwise.

The poll only serves to stir up shit and bolster the OP's false perception of what it means to own a firearm and proper self defense.

 

[MotionMan]

car theft and car jacking are two different things. obviously car theft shouldn't involve the death penalty.

That brings up a good point:

Car theft is treated under the law as a crime against the property
Car jacking is treated under the law as a crime against the person.

MotionMan

 

[davmat787]

We don't have a death penalty

Mind if I ask what country you are referring to? Would help put things in better context, thanks.

 

[thraashman]

I use to be a cop. 4 of my co workers was driving in visible policing vehicle doing patrols. A guy pulled out a R5 assault rifle firing while walking the vehicle till the clip of 25 rounds were empty. 3 was badly wounded 1s knees were shot of. One knees were dislocated from the force of the projectile when he took two in the butt. One had to go for a skin graph from one round hitting his arm.

I wouldn't consider that a civilian shooting. And something like that would be very rare for even police to be involved in. But for a person to twice be involved in shootings that don't involve police or military, is extremely rare and would make me think twice about the choices that person makes that puts them in situations where shootings occur.

True, it could be random coincidence and nothing he could have helped, but from his postings I would assume otherwise.

 

[Nebor]

The fact that you've been involved in two shootings scares me. I live in a major city. Used to work downtown in that city. Have friends and family that live in major cities and very bad cities. I know a good number of people. I literally do not know a single person who has ever been involved in a civilian shooting (had to clarify civilian as I have family that's been in the Marines). And you've been involved in two? Things like that make me question if you're the type of person who's the problem here. Are you the type of nut who just starts shooting at the slightest provocation? A vast majority of people will never be involved in one and you've been involved in two? That's not something to be proud of you know.

First incident was at my home at around 10pm, where I heard someone trying to open my front door. I peaked through the front blinds, made eye contact with a guy in a white t-shirt, and then he went sprinting around the back side of my house. I grabbed the phone and grabbed a handgun and went to close the backdoor, since only the glass storm door was closed due to the nice weather. By the time I got to the back door he was on my back patio. He reached into his pocket and pulled out a shiny piece of metal and I shot him once, center mass, through my storm door and he crumpled. I called the police, the guy was all strung out on drugs and had a mile long wrap sheet of burglary and assault. Turns out he had a screw driver in his hand. The police were great about the whole thing. Sucked having to replace a screen door and go testify in court at his trial though.

Second incident was out in the the Oak Lawn\Cedar Springs area of Dallas, around 11pm. I was walking through the Kroger parking lot on my way to a drag show and as I rounded the corner I saw a group of big guys beating the shit out one much smaller guy on the hood of a car. I shouted at them, "What are you doing?" I got a mixture of "Fuck off" and "fuck you" and replied with "Leave him alone." That's when two of them turned towards me and started advancing, less than 20 feet away. I was admittedly a little quick on the trigger and fired one round that hit one of the guys low in the gut. He fell and his buddies all bolted. DPD was there within 3 minutes, since that's a heavily patrolled area. It turns out it was a gay bashing I interrupted (this was in the gay part of town.) The poor kid getting beaten lost his vision in one of his eyes, after spending a week in the ICU. DPD was very professional, though at the time I was a reserve police officer for my home town, so that might have given me some credibility with them. I lost my handgun for a couple weeks. The guy that was arrested gave up his friends' names and they were all charged with aggravated assault with the (new at the time) enhancement of a hate crime.

Both of these incidents happened nearly 10 years ago now. But yeah, I sure am a blood thirsty monster. Both of those situations would have been SO much better if I didn't have a gun, or didn't have the will to use it.

 

[Nebor]

I wouldn't consider that a civilian shooting. And something like that would be very rare for even police to be involved in. But for a person to twice be involved in shootings that don't involve police or military, is extremely rare and would make me think twice about the choices that person makes that puts them in situations where shootings occur.

True, it could be random coincidence and nothing he could have helped, but from his postings I would assume otherwise.

You assume wrong.

 

[MotionMan]

First incident was at my home at around 10pm, where I heard someone trying to open my front door. I peaked through the front blinds, made eye contact with a guy in a white t-shirt, and then he went sprinting around the back side of my house. I grabbed the phone and grabbed a handgun and went to close the backdoor, since only the glass storm door was closed due to the nice weather. By the time I got to the back door he was on my back patio. He reached into his pocket and pulled out a shiny piece of metal and I shot him once, center mass, through my storm door and he crumpled. I called the police, the guy was all strung out on drugs and had a mile long wrap sheet of burglary and assault. Turns out he had a screw driver in his hand. The police were great about the whole thing. Sucked having to replace a screen door and go testify in court at his trial though.

You shot a man to protect your storm door!?! He could have turned over a new leaf and discovered the cure for cancer!!!

You animal.

MotionMan

 

[Nebor]

You shot a man to protect your storm door!?! He could have turned over a new leaf and discovered the cure for cancer!!!

You animal.

MotionMan

Too bad I didn't wing him in the spine or he could have been the next Steven Hawking.

Sorry if that sounds cold, but after seeing the kind of person he was at trial, I really think the world would be better off without him. His whole life has been spent stealing from and attacking others, destroying others sense of safety and well being. People like him are the real monsters.

 

[thraashman]

First incident was at my home at around 10pm, where I heard someone trying to open my front door. I peaked through the front blinds, made eye contact with a guy in a white t-shirt, and then he went sprinting around the back side of my house. I grabbed the phone and grabbed a handgun and went to close the backdoor, since only the glass storm door was closed due to the nice weather. By the time I got to the back door he was on my back patio. He reached into his pocket and pulled out a shiny piece of metal and I shot him once, center mass, through my storm door and he crumpled. I called the police, the guy was all strung out on drugs and had a mile long wrap sheet of burglary and assault. Turns out he had a screw driver in his hand. The police were great about the whole thing. Sucked having to replace a screen door and go testify in court at his trial though.

Second incident was out in the the Oak Lawn\Cedar Springs area of Dallas, around 11pm. I was walking through the Kroger parking lot on my way to a drag show and as I rounded the corner I saw a group of big guys beating the shit out one much smaller guy on the hood of a car. I shouted at them, "What are you doing?" I got a mixture of "Fuck off" and "fuck you" and replied with "Leave him alone." That's when two of them turned towards me and started advancing, less than 20 feet away. I was admittedly a little quick on the trigger and fired one round that hit one of the guys low in the gut. He fell and his buddies all bolted. DPD was there within 3 minutes, since that's a heavily patrolled area. It turns out it was a gay bashing I interrupted (this was in the gay part of town.) The poor kid getting beaten lost his vision in one of his eyes, after spending a week in the ICU. DPD was very professional, though at the time I was a reserve police officer for my home town, so that might have given me some credibility with them. I lost my handgun for a couple weeks. The guy that was arrested gave up his friends' names and they were all charged with aggravated assault with the (new at the time) enhancement of a hate crime.

Both of these incidents happened nearly 10 years ago now. But yeah, I sure am a blood thirsty monster. Both of those situations would have been SO much better if I didn't have a gun, or didn't have the will to use it.

Most people will never be in these types of situations. And from your descriptions these were not situations you put yourself in unnecessarily. Also from what you've said in both these instances you didn't kill either person, and you didn't fire more than once. In addition you didn't shoot until you had to. And even you admit that with one of them you might have been a bit quick on the trigger. That's normal human behavior. Congratulations, you're not part of the problem and appear to be a human with actual emotions.

Some of the posters in this thread indicate that they're the type of person who would unload the clip, reload, then fire the next clip half empty. In fact I've seen nick post in other threads before, I'm quite positive he's the type that would do that.

I apologize for doubting your actions earlier.

 

[davmat787]

First incident was at my home at around 10pm, where I heard someone trying to open my front door. I peaked through the front blinds, made eye contact with a guy in a white t-shirt, and then he went sprinting around the back side of my house. I grabbed the phone and grabbed a handgun and went to close the backdoor, since only the glass storm door was closed due to the nice weather. By the time I got to the back door he was on my back patio. He reached into his pocket and pulled out a shiny piece of metal and I shot him once, center mass, through my storm door and he crumpled. I called the police, the guy was all strung out on drugs and had a mile long wrap sheet of burglary and assault. Turns out he had a screw driver in his hand. The police were great about the whole thing. Sucked having to replace a screen door and go testify in court at his trial though.

Second incident was out in the the Oak Lawn\Cedar Springs area of Dallas, around 11pm. I was walking through the Kroger parking lot on my way to a drag show and as I rounded the corner I saw a group of big guys beating the shit out one much smaller guy on the hood of a car. I shouted at them, "What are you doing?" I got a mixture of "Fuck off" and "fuck you" and replied with "Leave him alone." That's when two of them turned towards me and started advancing, less than 20 feet away. I was admittedly a little quick on the trigger and fired one round that hit one of the guys low in the gut. He fell and his buddies all bolted. DPD was there within 3 minutes, since that's a heavily patrolled area. It turns out it was a gay bashing I interrupted (this was in the gay part of town.) The poor kid getting beaten lost his vision in one of his eyes, after spending a week in the ICU. DPD was very professional, though at the time I was a reserve police officer for my home town, so that might have given me some credibility with them. I lost my handgun for a couple weeks. The guy that was arrested gave up his friends' names and they were all charged with aggravated assault with the (new at the time) enhancement of a hate crime.

Both of these incidents happened nearly 10 years ago now. But yeah, I sure am a blood thirsty monster. Both of those situations would have been SO much better if I didn't have a gun, or didn't have the will to use it.

Wow, you sure sound like a diabolical bastard! You defended yourself and home in the first scenario, and very well may have saved some poor guy from being killed by a bunch of asshole gaybashers. Hell, if the first guy got his way with you, you may have not been around to save the second guy! Good job Nebor!

Some people just can't admit that sometimes a gun can result in a favorable outcome.

I also am curious why the guy that questioned you in this thread immediately jumped to the wrong conclusion.

 

[MotionMan]

Some of the posters in this thread indicate that they're the type of person who would unload the clip, reload, then fire the next clip half empty. In fact I've seen nick post in other threads before, I'm quite positive he's the type that would do that.

I apologize for doubting your actions earlier.

So you were wrong about one. Perhaps you are wrong about others, as well.

In other words, you should not assume that you know anything about anyone you only "know" through a few posts on a web forum.

MotionMan

 

[davmat787]

Most people will never be in these types of situations. And from your descriptions these were not situations you put yourself in unnecessarily. Also from what you've said in both these instances you didn't kill either person, and you didn't fire more than once. In addition you didn't shoot until you had to. And even you admit that with one of them you might have been a bit quick on the trigger. That's normal human behavior. Congratulations, you're not part of the problem and appear to be a human with actual emotions.

Some of the posters in this thread indicate that they're the type of person who would unload the clip, reload, then fire the next clip half empty. In fact I've seen nick post in other threads before, I'm quite positive he's the type that would do that.

I apologize for doubting your actions earlier.

Kudo's to you for being man enough to apologize, in my book this goes a long way. :thumbsup:

 

[Mide]

In a perfect world, yes. We would be allowed to take out anyone who was doing harm to family, friends, or property.

 

[thraashman]

In a perfect world, yes. We would be allowed to take out anyone who was doing harm to family, friends, or property.

Um ... I think you and I have pretty vastly different concepts of a perfect world. In a perfect world, we'd never have to worry about someone doing harm to our family, friends, or property.

 

[alkemyst]

Is that you too, or are you an old fat jackass loser that nobody likes in real life as well?

What property are you talking about defending? You don't own a home...your guns are about the only valuable items you have.

Face it, you love to talk about shooting people, but that's where it stops.

Some dudes were out harassing your ex-gf and you were POWERLESS.

She doesn't come home at night and you were POWERLESS.

Someone breaks in, you are heading out the back window and running. No real man would have handled things the way you did in those first examples.

I'd build up a backbone before playing with more guns.

 

[moshquerade]

Hey Peeps,

Just curious what you think? (the thief has no weapon, and does not pose a threat to your life or your family/ friends lives)

If so Why?
If not Why?
If else Why?

Edit Revised hypothetical: (as people didn't like original one)

Given the scenario you suggested I answered "No".

I would be glad to be away from this person, and would call the police, give them my vehicle make, model, license plate number, and hope the thief is caught.

 

[alkemyst]

You shot a man to protect your storm door!?! He could have turned over a new leaf and discovered the cure for cancer!!!

You animal.

MotionMan

Sound's like he was more than likely trying to jimmy the back door. It's extremely rare once spotted a perp is going to run around to another door especially a see through one.