If the Nintendo rumors are true, won't Nintendo be in the same situation?

[SAWYER]

i have read tons of rumors that the new console will be on par with the ps3/360, but if that is the case and then Sony and MS are close to releasing new system soon then Nintendo will be leap frogged once again. And if Nintendo doesn't change up their horrid online system, they will never pull away people from MS/Sony

 

[Beev]

I thought I had heard something about them making a better online system (or maybe the 3DS actually has a better system already?). And as long as they appeal to the masses like they did with the Wii then it won't matter how powerful it is.

Hell if I were going to get SNES quality games then they can have SNES quality graphics for all I care. I just want it to be awesomely fun.

 

[Oyeve]

Hell if I were going to get SNES quality games then they can have SNES quality graphics for all I care. I just want it to be awesomely fun.

This. Its all about quality games which all the systems seem to be lacking lately.

 

[SAWYER]

I think nostalgia is making you two think games back then were better than they were imo. So much junk back then and the games were pretty basic, I would say there are way more quality games than there was back then.

 

[Anubis]

.

Hell if I were going to get SNES quality games then they can have SNES quality graphics for all I care. I just want it to be awesomely fun.

THIS

as i often say, graphics are the LEAST important part of the equation

 

[Beev]

I think nostalgia is making you two think games back then were better than they were imo. So much junk back then and the games were pretty basic, I would say there are way more quality games than there was back then.

I still play the DKC trilogy every few months or so, as well as old RPG's. I also favor the graphically inferior arcade games that can be had on XBL and the PSN to a lot of major releases. Sometimes nostalgia is blinding (Goldeneye did not age well ), but simple sidescrollers will forever rock.

(The new Rayman looks awesome)

 

[dpodblood]

I agree. Project Cafe will be more powerful than the current gen "HD" consoles, but it will be outclassed graphically by the PS4 and XB720 when they're released. I think Nintendo will make up for it though by coming up with another new control mechanism like they did with motion controls and the Wii. They will also be much earlier to market than MS and Sony's offerings, and looks like they will have better 3rd party support this time around.

 

[smackababy]

I think nostalgia is making you two think games back then were better than they were imo. So much junk back then and the games were pretty basic, I would say there are way more quality games than there was back then.

Ever heard of Chrono Trigger? Need I go on?

 

[SAWYER]

yes please do, because imo I would say overall games are much higher quality and on much more regular release today then back then.

 

[Naeeldar]

Ever heard of Chrono Trigger? Need I go on?

This. If you are fan of rpgs, there is not near as many great rpgs these days.

 

[Tristicus]

yes please do, because imo I would say overall games are much higher quality and on much more regular release today then back then.

This...don't know why people get so caught up in old games. Sure, Driver 2 for instance is my favorite game, and it is fun going back and playing the old Marios, but GTA IV and Little Big Planet are MUCH better games than those two.

 

[THRiLL KiLL]

yes the wii had less specs then the ps3/360.

but what they did was aim at the casual gamer, and it looks like it paid off in the end.

 

[darkewaffle]

I think Nintendo would be quite happy to be in the same situation next generation as they are this generation.

Not to mention every day graphics get closer to 'good enough' and a lot of the new tech that only high end hardware can use simply does not produce significantly visible results. For most people, a dose of AF and AA at full res and they'll be pretty happy.

 

[Born2bwire]

yes the wii had less specs then the ps3/360.

but what they did was aim at the casual gamer, and it looks like it paid off in the end.

Personally I don't mind it. To me, the Xbox and Playstation are becoming more identical in terms of general experience, performance, and games. Outside of the big first party releases, most 3rd party developers are releasing on as many platforms as they can. One of the reasons why I never went with an Xbox or Playstation was that most of the games that I was interested on the systems I could get on PC. Having Nintendo try to compete at the same game would just muddy the waters even further.

 

[akugami]

i have read tons of rumors that the new console will be on par with the ps3/360, but if that is the case and then Sony and MS are close to releasing new system soon then Nintendo will be leap frogged once again. And if Nintendo doesn't change up their horrid online system, they will never pull away people from MS/Sony

Consoles are limited by the HDTV resolution so you can only have 1080p resolutions at best. I think currently shutter based 3D graphics are not there yet so not being able to display at 120fps is not a huge deal. We're at a stage where console graphics get harder and harder to make a noticeable difference in terms of how well each console can display graphics. Art direction and graphical presentation becomes much more important to make your game stand out visually. Honestly, even Sony and Microsoft is going to have a hard time making graphics stand out with their new consoles.

IMHO, games today are all about graphics and to a large degree gameplay has stagnated. I know in another thread people got excited by some of the new games coming out on the PS3 but they were sequels and while pretty didn't look like they offered anything new. At least with the Mario and Zelda games you can say Nintendo has continually strived to differentiate and expand the gameplay. Rarely does Nintendo make the prettiest game but they have always attempted to make the best playing games. I think the next gen of consoles will have games that need to differentiate themselves by having great gameplay.

 

[Medu]

i have read tons of rumors that the new console will be on par with the ps3/360, but if that is the case and then Sony and MS are close to releasing new system soon then Nintendo will be leap frogged once again. And if Nintendo doesn't change up their horrid online system, they will never pull away people from MS/Sony

Even if the WiiU is only on par with the current gen the gap between it and the next gen PS360 won't be as significant as between the Wii and PS360. We are hitting diminishing returns on graphics and have been for a while.

However I do hope that Nintendo will show a bit of foresight and be a bit more aggressive with the GPU. With 28nm GPU's by the end of the year they could easily launch with a ~800SP GPU at ~40watts. If MS replied in 2012 they would also be using a 28nm chip and that would only be about ~3 times more powerful and the same is likely true in 2013(I doubt TSMC will be ready with 20nm).
However knowing Nintendo they will likely launch on 40nm with a downclocked 320-400SP chip which is only marginally better than the current Xbox making it very easy for MS/Sony to have a large tech advantage and even more reason for devs dumping the WiiU early.

 

[GeneValgene]

Ever heard of Chrono Trigger? Need I go on?

Best RPG of all time!!!

 

[DougoMan]

Since the new system is the same size as the Wii it's obviously going to be very slow.

 

[purbeast0]

Even if the WiiU is only on par with the current gen the gap between it and the next gen PS360 won't be as significant as between the Wii and PS360. We are hitting diminishing returns on graphics and have been for a while.

/facepalm

 

[smackababy]

yes please do, because imo I would say overall games are much higher quality and on much more regular release today then back then.

Super Metroid, Super Mario Kart, Link to the Past, Super Street Fighter Turbo, Final Fantasy 3 (6), Megaman X, Super Castlevania IV.

Again, the quality of games on SNES was way above that of the current generation.

 

[Ross Ridge]

/facepalm

Like it or not it's true. There's not a lot of reason to expect a huge jump in perceived graphics quality in the next generation of consoles. Few games are going to be able to afford the huge increase in budget this would require. Without a major change in development methodolgies, funding or fundamental technology many games are just going to be 1080p versions of what we see now, with a bit more chrome.

Also just raw spec-wise there's going to be a narrower gap between the Wii-U and the next generation of Sony and Microsoft consoles. The CPU will probably be virtually identical, a quad PowerPC clocked a few 100 MHz faster. Maybe twice the memory or so, but not the almost 6 times advantage the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 have over the Wii. There will probably be similar sized discrepancy between GPUs, though heat issues could end up narrowing the gap here as well.

And this all assumes Microsoft and Sony don't switch strategies and try to make a cheaper, more affordable, much more profitable console like Nintendo did with great success during the current generation.

 

[Medu]

/facepalm

Instead of acting like a 12 year old, could you correct my mistake?

Super Metroid, Super Mario Kart, Link to the Past, Super Street Fighter Turbo, Final Fantasy 3 (6), Megaman X, Super Castlevania IV.

Again, the quality of games on SNES was way above that of the current generation.

I don't think it fair to do a comparison like that. Gaming was still in it's infancy when a lot of those games were released hence they felt a lot fresher. Most games are now a copy of a concept that was developed 12-15 years ago so they often feel stale even if it's a very well made game.

 

[tfinch2]

/facepalm

And your rebuttal is?

 

[crisium]

The most powerful console of the last generation was the Xbox 1 with its GeForce 3. The Playstation 3 has a GeForce 7. So it would seem that to get the same gap in performance we would need to go up 4 generations.

8800
GTX 200
GTX 400
GTX 500

However, let's also consider the Xbox had a single core 733MHz Coppermine PIII/Celeron. Even the CPU in the 360 is vastly more powerful, let a lone the 6 core beast in the PS3.

It is a certainty that the CPU increase from the Xbox to PS3 generation far larger than PS3 to PS4. Therefore, in order to get a similar overall performance increase, we will need at least another GPU increase.

So at the absolute minimum we'd need to see the Radeon 7000 or GTX 600 series in the PS4/Xbox 3. Considering the relatively small gap from Radeon 5000>6000 and GTX 400>500, we would more realistically need to see a Radeon 8000 or GTX 700 series to get the same relative performance increase in the next generation.

If the new consoles come in 2014, considering they need some time to work with the architecture, I'm guessing it'll be a Radeon 7000 or GTX 600 series, though hopefully we do see a step higher.

So we're not quite at diminishing returns, but without a significantly better CPU they are gonna need one hell of a GPU in the next gen to see a similar increase.

Btw, more on topic with the OP, the WiiU has a Radeon 4000. So if it is only 3 GPU cycles behind the Xbox 3 or whatever, then I would imagine it would be closer in performance than the Wii was. Especially considering the Wii had a single core CPU and the new one will have a 3-4 Core PPC. So I do not think the WiiU will be in as serious trouble as last time.

Who knows at this point, but going from PS4 to WiiU may be relatively as simple as turning a PC game down from Very High, to High or at worst Medium. I don't think we're gonna see the same physics, texture, and polygon deficiencies as last time. Every game should be as equally as playable and simply have slightly less impressive graphics.

 

[Medu]

So we're not quite at diminishing returns, but without a significantly better CPU they are gonna need one hell of a GPU in the next gen to see a similar increase.

It's not whether they can increased the polygon count/fill rates 10 fold it's whether people can really notice the increase. It's the same with 480p/720p/1080p- it's very easy to notice the jump from 480p->720p but 720p->1080p is far less noticeable.

Also the power that GPU use has jumped massively over the last few years. Top end Nvidia cards, single chip, are using ~250 watts so their is very little chance that we will see a top end card go into the next gen consoles- at least fully clocked ones. If Sony/MS were releasing a new console atm it likely they would be using a midrange card that consumes ~120 watts- which would certainly favour AMD's chips.