If the United States were a company, what financial shape would it be in?

misle

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
3,371
0
76
If the United States were a company, what financial shape would it be in? And what would it make sense to do to put the company on a sounder footing? These are the intriguing questions that a group of investment analysts from Kleiner Perkins, headed by Mary Meeker, set out to answer. The resulting report, which includes 460 Power Point slides, is here. It is titled "USA Inc."

Article: http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/03/028597.php

Direct link to slides: http://images.businessweek.com/mz/11/10/1110_mz_49meekerusainc.pdf

It is pretty interesting, and damned scary, to look at the financial shape of the US. This should be a big wake up call to all Americans to demand that the US Federal Government become fiscally responsible.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,030
2
61
If the US Gov't were a company, it would have declared bankruptcy a long time ago, and the CEO's and accountants would be hauled off to jail.
 

Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
13,293
1
76
Really ?
1. extremely high inventory of valuable assets.
2. very high income
3. very high outflow.
4. manageable debt.

The only difficulty is matching the income and outflow better. We could raise some taxes without hurting anything, it just isn't popular. We could cut spending but again, it isn't really popular.

So it's pretty easy to solve, we the people have to get realistic about taxes and spending and stop being taken in by political lies like we don't have to pay for the government we want.
 

Macamus Prime

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2011
3,108
0
0
The USA is a company.

Since when are the middle class and poor considered? According to conservatives, the poor should be left as is, the middle class should be taxed and the rich should be left alone in order to create jobs.

Well, for the past 30 years - the rich haven't been creating jobs. They have been outsourcing them.

So, USA Inc would be a company where the executive partners do whatever they want, just for their own benefit. Everyone below them be damned.
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
0
0
The USA is a company.

Since when are the middle class and poor considered? According to conservatives, the poor should be left as is, the middle class should be taxed and the rich should be left alone in order to create jobs.

Well, for the past 30 years - the rich haven't been creating jobs. They have been outsourcing them.

So, USA Inc would be a company where the executive partners do whatever they want, just for their own benefit. Everyone below them be damned.


There was no jobs here in the USA? The unemployment rate was about 5% in 2007. So it looks like everyone had jobs to me.
And what about the jobs that other countries businesses started in the US?
Guess we should outlaw that, how dare those countries bring any jobs here right?
Oh yeah, the top 1% pays about 1/3 of all income taxes and the bottom 50% pays no income taxes. So the rich pay no taxes right?
 

GuitarDaddy

Lifer
Nov 9, 2004
11,465
1
0
If the US Gov't were a company, it would have declared bankruptcy a long time ago, and the CEO's and accountants would be hauled off to jail.


You mean like GM and Chrysler? Um nobody went to jail, oh you must mean like Merril Lych or Goldman Saks? Opps again none went to jail there either.

Corporate BK is like celebrity rehab, it's all the rage!
 

PeshakJang

Platinum Member
Mar 17, 2010
2,276
0
0
Really ?
1. extremely high inventory of valuable assets.

That has since been marked down significantly, if you are referring to real estate.

Generally speaking though, the assets possessed is not inventory, it is working capital. Residual value of most government property is significantly less than the purchase price. These assets are not sold for profit. A measure to use would be return on assets. How much in tax dollars are collected each year compared to the total value of all government held assets?

2. very high income

Which hasn't exceeded expenses for the majority of the last century. Even during the Clinton "surplus" years, the surplus was never realized, it was on paper.

3. very high outflow.

Got that right.

4. manageable debt.

Very arguable.

If you saw a business with $130 billion worth of long-term debt, with income of $15 billion and expenses of $30 billion annually, and the board of directors kept insisting that revenues will double in a few years when the economy improves, would you call that sound?

The only difficulty is matching the income and outflow better. We could raise some taxes without hurting anything, it just isn't popular.

And would contribute an insignificant amount compared to the overall budget.

We could cut spending but again, it isn't really popular.

It's popular with a lot of people. I'd say more popular than raising taxes.

So it's pretty easy to solve, we the people have to get realistic about taxes and spending and stop being taken in by political lies like we don't have to pay for the government we want.

That's how it's been for decades. The government will give you what you want, will solve your problems, and will take care of you for your life, and you won't have to pay for it... somebody else will.

Same thing with public unions. Keep raising their salaries, because you won't have to deal with the problems, the next guy will.
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
0
0
Look at this chart, its the real revenue per capita:



The revenue is not the problem.
The spending has gotten out of control:




I could be persuaded to temporarily raise taxes, but only if it comes with steep spending cuts.
 
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Macamus Prime

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2011
3,108
0
0
There was no jobs here in the USA? The unemployment rate was about 5% in 2007. So it looks like everyone had jobs to me.
And what about the jobs that other countries businesses started in the US?
Guess we should outlaw that, how dare those countries bring any jobs here right?
Oh yeah, the top 1% pays about 1/3 of all income taxes and the bottom 50% pays no income taxes. So the rich pay no taxes right?

Sorry, I meant wealth distribution;
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelookout/20110223/ts_yblog_thelookout/separate-but-unequal-charts-show-growing-rich-poor-gap#mwpphu-post-form
 

wuliheron

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2011
3,536
0
0
It is pretty interesting, and damned scary, to look at the financial shape of the US. This should be a big wake up call to all Americans to demand that the US Federal Government become fiscally responsible.


It's called government of the people, by the people, and for the people but that's no guaranty the people are sane to begin with. They'll keep voting for all these two-faced lawyers taking billions from the wealthy, corporations, and special interests groups and then complain that there are no good politicians to choose from. You might as well encourage them to demand a chicken in every pot for all the good it will do.
 
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Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
13,293
1
76
That has since been marked down significantly, if you are referring to real estate.

Generally speaking though, the assets possessed is not inventory, it is working capital. Residual value of most government property is significantly less than the purchase price. These assets are not sold for profit. A measure to use would be return on assets. How much in tax dollars are collected each year compared to the total value of all government held assets?



Which hasn't exceeded expenses for the majority of the last century. Even during the Clinton "surplus" years, the surplus was never realized, it was on paper.



Got that right.



Very arguable.

If you saw a business with $130 billion worth of long-term debt, with income of $15 billion and expenses of $30 billion annually, and the board of directors kept insisting that revenues will double in a few years when the economy improves, would you call that sound?



And would contribute an insignificant amount compared to the overall budget.



It's popular with a lot of people. I'd say more popular than raising taxes.



That's how it's been for decades. The government will give you what you want, will solve your problems, and will take care of you for your life, and you won't have to pay for it... somebody else will.

Same thing with public unions. Keep raising their salaries, because you won't have to deal with the problems, the next guy will.


The assets of the USA aren't limited to real estate, although I'm sure "real estate owned by the USA is worth tens if not hundreds of trillions of dollars.

Debt manageable ? Measure of that is what we have to pay to service it. have you checked the interest rate we pay ? Not bad.

Cutting spending isn't more popular in reality, it's just easy to exploit people's greed by talking about cutting everbody else's spending.

Cut medical care for illegal aliens ? hell ya. Close the redundant military base that buys supplies from my hardware store ? Hell no !

Multiply that sentiment by everybody's particular ideas of good spending and bad spending and you get pretty much exactly the spending we have.

You reveal your bias by your characterization of tax increases. You're just part of the reason the deficit is so high, you want to cut stuff you don't care about and that's it. no pain for you, no taxes to pay for wars, just cut the other guy.

That doesn't work and we have to stop supporting politicians who feed us lies that we can fix the deficit without any pain.

Even at that, it's not anywhere near as serious as the current politically motivated hysteria makes it out to be.
 

TheDoc9

Senior member
May 26, 2006
264
0
0
Oh yeah, the top 1% pays about 1/3 of all income taxes and the bottom 50% pays no income taxes. So the rich pay no taxes right?

When you own 90% of the money available, paying most of the income tax is inevitable. Remember that dollar amounts and percents are totally different measurements, so if someone making a billion dollars a year pays even just 10% total tax - that 100 million is far more than the 30% total tax the person making 50k per year pays. But who feels it more? Who is able to jet set around the world on a whim for whatever reason? Who gets the best healthcare?

This is a misleading statistic that needs to stop being repeated on this forum.
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
0
0
When you own 90% of the money available, paying most of the income tax is inevitable. Remember that dollar amounts and percents are totally different measurements, so if someone making a billion dollars a year pays even just 10% total tax - that 100 million is far more than the 30% total tax the person making 50k per year pays. But who feels it more? Who is able to jet set around the world on a whim for whatever reason? Who gets the best healthcare?

This is a misleading statistic that needs to stop being repeated on this forum.

I never mentioned the amount of taxes taken out of their paycheck.
They do pay more % in taxes out of their pay check than people with less income though of course.

I don't care if they don't "feel" it as much. Thats irrelevant.
They are paying plenty of income taxes.
If the top 1% did not exist 1/3 of our income taxes would be gone.
So yes, I'd say they pay their "fair share"

You wish it would stop being repeated because it doesn't fit with your "the rich pay no taxes" so we need to raise taxes agenda.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
If the top 50% are paying for all the services for the bottom 50% then you have enough income distribution. In the history of the world nobody has ever taxed us out of a recession.
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,733
565
126
If the United States were a company it would have been bailed out of self inflicted bankruptcy due to being "to big to fail" by the United States government several times by now.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
It would probably also be declared a monoploly and broken up into smaller Governments.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,030
2
61
In addition to my comments above, a countless number of charges would be brought up against it including but not limited to all degrees of murder, felonious assault, grand theft, collusion, racketeering, counterfeiting, fraud, and running a ponzi scheme. And Craig would probably be of some flavor of libertarianism.
 

Macamus Prime

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2011
3,108
0
0
The families of dead Iraqi civilians would sue USA Inc.

The families of dead US Soldiers would sue USA Inc as well, since said soldiers gave their lives for securing WMDs that do not exist.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
When a company has a $3.69T annual budget and a 14.3T debt (~100% of GDP) that's skyrocketing...it's in trouble. It's in really deep shit when its led by officers who can't find a way to cut even a measly $60B.

And it's doomed when half the shareholders are oblivious idiots who ridicule those who want to do something about it.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,130
5,658
126
Any Government in any Nation in the world looked at as a Business will look like it is in trouble. This is a nefarious comparison.
 
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