If you wanted something that handled well, had some decent low end torque, could serve year round and was a four door...

[bozack]

So I had a CSVT which I liked but grew tired of, plus the repair bills started adding up (AC, Brakes, body work...etc) so I dumped it, we got an Accord EXL but while I like the car overall I hate driving it, the auto is boring, the car rolls around corners, and it just feels like a boat to me...so I am stuck with my wife's old Saab 92X (subaru impreza)....overall it is sportier than the Honda but still boring, and the low end blows, too much turbo lag for me...

So I am in the market for something smaller, four door, manual transmission, at least 200hp, and sporty-ish with a little luxury that can go year round....

Had a few cars in mind but wondering if there is anything out there I might not have thought of??....

Cars I have considered, all used:

TSX
BMW 3 (kinda spendy)
Mercedes C300 (again kinda spendy)
CTS


Thanks

 

[Bignate603]

My personal preference would be the TSX or CTS. They're cheaper to buy and as they age they should be cheaper to maintain.

 

[LOUISSSSS]

3 series would be unmatched in this category that you're looking for.
the a4 would be great too but reliability issues still plague VW.
infinity g35 or 37 are beasts and all around winners, hence why you see so many of them on the road.
how about the IS350??? great car and a bit cheaper than the 3 series and you get toyota reliability.

over here at AT you're going to bump into many "buy american" fanboys. so take all of your suggestions with a grain of salt.

your requirement for sporty luxury 4 door limits you to the BMW/MB/Audio territory.

the accord's "loose" suspension can be fixed with a $300 upgrade to some eibach pro-kits.

 

[Arkaign]

We need a more specific budget to look at, as the cars you mentioned are available in various configurations that are drastically different. Knowing the budget will also put more options on the table possibly. Forget the TSX, it has no low end power, though it's a decent car. If you're looking at Acura, look at the TL instead, similar $$ but a far better car.

Volvo S60 are also nice, and can be had at reasonable prices, even with the pretty sweet -R performance package (300HP Turbo AWD). A bit rare though, and maintenance, while cheaper than Audi, is still more than Japanese or Domestic. The rarity might even be a bonus, considering how commonplace 3 series, G35, TL, etc are.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/...ist=782&standard=false

EDIT : Very informative review here : http://www.edmunds.com/insidel...lowup/articleId=101293

 

[Bignate603]

Originally posted by: LOUISSSSS
over here at AT you're going to bump into many "buy american" fanboys. so take all of your suggestions with a grain of salt.

Oh the irony...

In this segment the CTS is a valid option. It may not be the one he prefers but he should definitely give it a test drive and see how he likes it as he should with any of these cars. Compared to the 3 series its a much larger car, closer to the size of the 5 series. Depending on what he wants this could be a good or a bad thing.

You do bring up a good point with the Lexus. It's worth looking at. After he takes a spin in every one of the vehicles he can make a better decision.

 

[Fenixgoon]

you mentioned year round - how much driving do you need to do when snow is around? if a lot, you may want to look into AWD vehicles, otherwise, FWD/RWD/AWD are all valid options.

Cadillac CTS, Audi A4, BMW3, Mercedes C, Lexus IS, (not sure what Acura offers), and Infiniti G35 are the luxury models I can think of offhand
for non-luxury models, Nissan maxima or altima, Chevy Malibu, toyota camry, ford fusion, honda accord

normally i would recommend a pontiac G8GT (honestly i find it quite hard to beat at $25k), but on account of the brand being killed off, i can no longer do so

 

[thescreensavers]

Hyundai Genesis Coupe! 200hp or 300 pick your engine!

its 2door though..

 

[Strk]

The Subaru Outback with the flat six is a decent option if you're ok with a wagon. The AWD is nice in the winter.

You could always look at a Nissan Altima, Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan or Mazda 6 too. I'm not sure how much luxury you're looking for, but I'd rather go for a non-luxury marque at the $25-30k price range. You get more car for your money.

 

[bozack]

I'd like to keep it around 30K or so at the top end....

Also it has to be manual and either AWD or RWD, I live in a snowy area in the winter and have to keep that as a consideration.

I also would rather a luxury maker as I have had my share of non luxo cars and while they are "fine" I am a believer in you only live once so might as well have nice stuff.

The CTS is something I considered, as is the IS250 and the TSX, not a fan of the TL due to its size.

And the Genesis is interesting, but not too keen on a high end Hyundai even though I know it isn't a bad car. Thanks

 

[mc866]

Used E46 330XI, 225HP and decent low end, handles like a dream, has luxury, and you get the benefit of AWD and can get it in a manual.

Otherwise maybe a G35, the standard G35 is available in the manual, if you wanted AWD you could get the G35x but manual wasn't offered in AWD.

Audi has lots of great AWD options too

Depending on your definition of luxury the Subaru LGT is a nice option too, though some don't like the interiors as much.

 

[Zenmervolt]

If Ford offered the Fusion Sport with a manual, I'd include it, but they don't, and that's unfortunate because it's a great car.

The older Volvo S60 R variants with the manual transmissions would be a good choice. Not the cheapest things to maintain, but a lot of fun and the basic turbocharged I5 engine is very robust. Plus, they have more interior room than the BMW or Mercedes you're considering.

On a similar maintenance cost level, a late-model BMW 330 would be a decent option. With a set of snow tires it could be fine in the snow. Heck, you might even be able to find a 330xi with the AWD system but I don't know if those were offered with a manual. Still, it's another fun option.

Even though I'm a Ford guy, I still like the CTS. It's a solid machine and reasonably fun to drive.

Overall though, I'd be gravitating towards the Volvo or the BMW, but I'm biased.

ZV

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: bozack
I'd like to keep it around 30K or so at the top end....

Also it has to be manual and either AWD or RWD, I live in a snowy area in the winter and have to keep that as a consideration.

I also would rather a luxury maker as I have had my share of non luxo cars and while they are "fine" I am a believer in you only live once so might as well have nice stuff.

The CTS is something I considered, as is the IS250 and the TSX, not a fan of the TL due to its size.

And the Genesis is interesting, but not too keen on a high end Hyundai even though I know it isn't a bad car. Thanks

Hmm. With your budget, I'd actually recommend a low-miles E39 M5. Very cool car, and one of the most satisfying V8's ever made. They also respond very well to aftermarket stuff (mostly Dinan, pricey but very high quality), lots of E39 M5's in the 500+rwhp range.

Here's a black on black, 6spd, Navi, 60k miles, for $20k. That is a lot of luxury, comfort, class, balance, and power in one package.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/...st=1289&standard=false

You can keep the remaining part of your budget for aftermarket and maintenance concerns. Maintenance will be higher than of ordinary BMW models, and on par with Mercedes AMG and Audi RS costs.

Another good choice would be the 1G CTS-V, which can be had for similar $, though the interior is not at the level of refinement and attention to detail than is in the E39. Maintenance will be lower, and there is of course a significant aftermarket for pretty much all GM V8's.

 

[halik]

Audi A6 2.7T

Aka what I drive. Great in the winter (Quattro FTW), a ton of lux goodies and 380lb/ft of torque (as soon as I get the APR flash)

 

[mc866]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
If Ford offered the Fusion Sport with a manual, I'd include it, but they don't, and that's unfortunate because it's a great car.

The older Volvo S60 R variants with the manual transmissions would be a good choice. Not the cheapest things to maintain, but a lot of fun and the basic turbocharged I5 engine is very robust. Plus, they have more interior room than the BMW or Mercedes you're considering.

On a similar maintenance cost level, a late-model BMW 330 would be a decent option. With a set of snow tires it could be fine in the snow. Heck, you might even be able to find a 330xi with the AWD system but I don't know if those were offered with a manual. Still, it's another fun option.

Even though I'm a Ford guy, I still like the CTS. It's a solid machine and reasonably fun to drive.

Overall though, I'd be gravitating towards the Volvo or the BMW, but I'm biased.

ZV

You can get the 330Xi in manual, just more rare than a auto, I had an '03

 

[amdhunter]

Volkswagen Jetta GLi w/DSG? I am in love with my car, and aside from my shift linkage needing readjustment (i have a manual) I haven't had any issues with the car.

The DSG model should be a lot of fun to drive.

 

[BassBomb]

The TSX will have a very similar driving experience to the Accord

Look for a 3 series or G35

 

[Strk]

Originally posted by: BassBomb
The TSX will have a very similar driving experience to the Accord

Look for a 3 series or G35

That depends on which Accord. The new Accord is a full-size sedan with a more relaxed suspension. The TSX is more like the older one (yeah, I know it's a Euro Accord).

 

[ElFenix]

tsx and low end torque? wtf?

and i disagree that the tsx and accord drive very similarly. i drove them back to back when looking for a new (to me! take that!) car this past january. the tsx was sharp and responsive, but the engine needed too much right foot to get anywhere and the transmission had to shift all the time. the accord v6 had the much better drivetrain but the steering was numb in comparison.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
tsx and low end torque? wtf?

and i disagree that the tsx and accord drive very similarly. i drove them back to back when looking for a new (to me! take that!) car this past january. the tsx was sharp and responsive, but the engine needed too much right foot to get anywhere and the transmission had to shift all the time. the accord v6 had the much better drivetrain but the steering was numb in comparison.

This is very true. I don't understand why anyone with any performance aspirations would want a TSX. TL is not very much more, but a world of a better driver.

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: LOUISSSSS
troll troll troll your boat...

 

[MikeMike]

look at the Pontiac G8 GT... minus a row your own transmission, it is fast, powerful, huge, and a nice interior... and brand new well under 30k with rebates/discount... its basically a prior gen BMW 5 series...

 

[zoiks]

G35.

 

[exar333]

Originally posted by: zoiks
G35.

G35 FTW.

 

[mitaiwan82]

2nd gen G35
E90 330i
E46 330i or xi (try to get with ZHP package)
E36 M3 sedan

basically what everyone has already said =)

 

[NutBucket]

If you're otherwise happy with the 9-2X you might try one of the 2.5L turbo cars. Your torque complaint will be thrown out the window and turbo lag is significantly reduced. Just a thought.