Income inequality: exactly how much money should a person or corporation make?

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Cozarkian

Golden Member
Feb 2, 2012
1,352
95
91
I didn't say remove patent, but what the hell good is a patent if you are only allowed to collect revenue that takes 7 years just to recoup R&D cost? That's just the break even point for one expense. Factor in the other expenses and you are easily looking at over 10 years just to break even, never mind make an actual profit. There isn't a business in he world that would take on that venture day after day.

I didn't propose a regulation that would delay recovery of costs and stifle profits. I proposed an alternative that would reward the initial patent holder and allow competition to set the market price after the inventor collects its reward.

I know you didn't say remove patent. That was the point . You failed to acknowledge the government is already involved. It isn't a matter of keep govt. out, it is a matter of the appropriate level of regulation.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
I didn't propose a regulation that would delay recovery of costs and stifle profits. I proposed an alternative that would reward the initial patent holder and allow competition to set the market price after the inventor collects its reward.

I know you didn't say remove patent. That was the point . You failed to acknowledge the government is already involved. It isn't a matter of keep govt. out, it is a matter of the appropriate level of regulation.

Sorry, I thought you were going along with the whole 15% or R&D max per year crap that DCal430 wants.
 

DCal430

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2011
6,020
9
81
Fine if 15% is to low make it 35%, but instead of 20 year patent, they now have a 5 year patent.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Annual revenue for a drug should be limited to 15% of a drugs total R&D cost. They can make plenty of money with this restriction.

And you know this how? How is all this working for North Korea BTW?

If one does the math and takes into consideration of the total costs of drug research you've created the perfect motivation for no one to ever put one cent into it. They'd put in ten and lose twelve. I guarantee you don't work where you have to pay to do it.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
You'd vastly limit the breadth of research that goes on and therefore drastically reduce discovery and innovation. Very counterproductive.

I wonder how much longer the moon landing would have taken if this had been the model.


Ah fuck that. We went to the Moon and to Mars on the federal dime. I trust the government to research this much more than private companies. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that the prescription drug research should be taken completely out of the hands of private industry. They have had their time of rape and pillage, it is time for them to step aside.

The dirty little secret in all of this is that the federal government is already bankrolling BILLIONS in medical research while private companies are PRIVATELY monetizing the patents which were discovered through those self-same PUBLIC research dollars. We don't need a frigging middle man!!

PS. Thanx Bober for the kind words, I wuv u too! LOL!
 
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BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
You're the idiot who's always bragging about how much money you have. If you have enough to brag about it, you have too much. Tax the shit out of asholes like bshole.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
Fine if 15% is to low make it 35%, but instead of 20 year patent, they now have a 5 year patent.

So they only have 2 years to recover manufacturing, advertising and distribution costs and hopefully turn a profit? That should do them all in pretty quick.
 

massmedia

Senior member
Oct 1, 2014
232
0
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drug companies hemmorage billions and billions on clinical trials.

guess who pays for the trials that fail?
 

massmedia

Senior member
Oct 1, 2014
232
0
0
people buying other drugs that those companies make.

i know of one company that lost almost 3 billion dollars and nearly a decade of work wwhen they had 3 trials fail in a single 365 day span.

they need big profits because cutting edge medical research costs (especially clinical trials) are ungodly

-----

on the other hand, europeans don't go bankrupt paying for their cancer treatments. i'm not saying their systems are perfect, but the payments of those profits for drug companies are shared by all taxpayers. in the us the taxpayers instead chose to share the cost of an ungodly expensive world dominating police force... i mean military.

priorities... priorities
 
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DCal430

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2011
6,020
9
81
Then the government needs to get rid of these private drug companies and sell the drugs it self.
 

xBiffx

Diamond Member
Aug 22, 2011
8,232
2
0
Ah fuck that. We went to the Moon and to Mars on the federal dime.

Using (contracting) companies that were 100% for profit. Now, get rid of those and see how far we get in the same time.

You must think that Northrop Grumman got huge by donating time, materials, and resources to NASA. Silly you.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
As much as they can. Growth is a good thing. If nothing else the non-producers can vote to increase taxes and take more money from the producers, then have whatever they want, like healthcare.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
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Then take it away from private industry altogether and have the federal government fund the research and development. Take out the profit motive altogether. It would be much more cost effective for the American people.

It would also vastly reduce the advancement of health care in this country. The profit motive is a reason for advancement. Whether you like it or not. Putting that in the hands of the federal govt will bring politics into advancement. I know the left whined about the federal ban on stem cell research. You realize while the federal govt was playing politics private industry was moving ahead with research? Now lets apply that to every proposed advancement. Sounds like it should end well for us. But hey, at least we wont have to pay for expensive drugs if they are never created!
 

massmedia

Senior member
Oct 1, 2014
232
0
0
It would also vastly reduce the advancement of health care in this country. The profit motive is a reason for advancement. Whether you like it or not. Putting that in the hands of the federal govt will bring politics into advancement. I know the left whined about the federal ban on stem cell research. You realize while the federal govt was playing politics private industry was moving ahead with research? Now lets apply that to every proposed advancement. Sounds like it should end well for us. But hey, at least we wont have to pay for expensive drugs if they are never created!

this is one of the problems with some forms of public (socalized) medicine... politicians making decisions about what drugs to treat patients with based on drug cost rather than effectiveness, how many heart surgeries to do this year... let's reduce the number of prostate cancer surgeries by 6% this year... etc.

in my mind if you could eliminate politicians ability to make control medical decisions you move much closer to an acceptable socalized system. the above system is very real and very unaceptable in my mind.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
It would also vastly reduce the advancement of health care in this country. The profit motive is a reason for advancement. Whether you like it or not. Putting that in the hands of the federal govt will bring politics into advancement. I know the left whined about the federal ban on stem cell research. You realize while the federal govt was playing politics private industry was moving ahead with research? Now lets apply that to every proposed advancement. Sounds like it should end well for us. But hey, at least we wont have to pay for expensive drugs if they are never created!

Something important to note is that the Feds are already massively subsidizing our drug industry, just in the dumbest way possible. (Not negotiating on prices using Medicare)

I am all for the profit motive, but I'm also all for removing that subsidy. If we are going to subsidize drug companies it should be for things we as a society choose.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
this is one of the problems with some forms of public (socalized) medicine... politicians making decisions about what drugs to treat patients with based on drug cost rather than effectiveness, how many heart surgeries to do this year... let's reduce the number of prostate cancer surgeries by 6% this year... etc.

in my mind if you could eliminate politicians ability to make control medical decisions you move much closer to an acceptable socalized system. the above system is very real and very unaceptable in my mind.

You realize this is exactly what private insurance companies do as well, right?
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
126
Something important to note is that the Feds are already massively subsidizing our drug industry, just in the dumbest way possible. (Not negotiating on prices using Medicare)

I am all for the profit motive, but I'm also all for removing that subsidy. If we are going to subsidize drug companies it should be for things we as a society choose.

There is a lot of dumb ways we subsidize that industry. I say remove it all.
 

uclabachelor

Senior member
Nov 9, 2009
448
0
71
This "income inequality" thing is still talked about and I don't understand it.

How much should a corporation make?
How much should a person make?
How much should a person get paid not to work?

A corporation makes as much money as their customers are willing to pay.

A person makes as much money as their employer is willing to pay.

The inequality comes from the rise in cost of living, inflation, and stagnant wages, and special tax breaks for those who have enough wealth to make use of the tax breaks.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
How much should a corporation make?
Whatever it can, without government intervention - few to little local tax incentives and certainly no subsidies - this is a business. Either it knows how to operate properly or it doesn't.

How much should a person make?
~23% more than what they are currently making; http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/11/us-usa-mayors-jobs-idUSKBN0GB1T920140811

How much should a person get paid not to work?
If they are sick, hurt or disabled - an amount that covers their needs as best as possible.
I don't necessarily agree with all this, but that's a remarkably cogent, concise and simple answer. Kudos.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
I posted limits on wealth already, companies should be fined for compensation over 5 million a year, a 200% fine for each dollar of compensation over 5 million annually. Self employed people should have a 25% fine for each dollar of self employed income over 5 million. This is in addition to income tax.

Income tax also needs to be raised to 50% at 1 million.

No needs to make millions a year, and no one should be allowed to.
If a nation gives its government the power of the North Korean government, that nation will inevitably become North Korea. And it will richly deserve it.

people buying other drugs that those companies make.

i know of one company that lost almost 3 billion dollars and nearly a decade of work wwhen they had 3 trials fail in a single 365 day span.

they need big profits because cutting edge medical research costs (especially clinical trials) are ungodly

-----
SNIP
That's certainly a valid point, but it's worth pointing out that most drugs developed are simply me-too competitor drugs to grab a piece of the market, and while in principle I support free market competition, in practice free market competition begins to fail for prescription drugs and indeed, in general when health care gets to the point of diagnostic machines or drug development running in the tens to hundreds of million dollars.

Wow, me make heap big sentence!
 

inachu

Platinum Member
Aug 22, 2014
2,387
2
41
back in the 80's an it tech would break 80k and now they barely break 50k
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126
There is probably more equality in NK than the U.S.

Even there some lucky bastard is probably getting a second helping of dirt and tree bark to eat, and thus subject to your jealous disapproval.
 
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