Industry certs vs. formal education in the IT field

[mammador]

Both.

Certs and an actual IT and/or IS degree can help.

 

[Scarpozzi]

If your resume gets through HR, you have a shot. The biggest problem for a lot of orgs is they throw degree requirements on a lot of jobs....in actuality, many will hire based on the fact you have a 4 year degree AND valid experience in your field.

Certifications are just a way for corporations to claim they have an expert on staff. It gives management warm and fuzzies because it's cheap insurance... The certificate holders typically want to show off that they have all the letters next to their names. They shouldn't be required, but may give you a leg up when a job comes down to you and another person with a tech degree.

 

[sourceninja]

Most IT professionals I know don't have IT degrees. They have degrees in other fields and the majority have certs they have picked up over the years. I myself have no degree, but it hasn't held me back.

Personally I'd value certs over the degree if I was looking for people who had a specific skill set.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Oh and I'd agree here. The bachelors you already have is all 95% of employers will care about. It won't matter it's not IT related. Many of the really good people I have worked with have no degree in IT either. A masters I think is overkill for most IT jobs as well. But I'd agree in getting your masters in IT over getting a second bachelors degree.

Not in my experience. Every job I've come across require a 4 year degree in cs.
But of course I'm looking at much higher level stuff than entry level it.

 

[torpid]

Most certs are worthless. Cisco ones are decent, but most of the others you listed would not be of much value, IMO.

Since you already have a bachelor's degree I don't think the associate's is going to help a whole lot. Some jobs require a bachelor's degree of any kind (not sure why), so I think you have that covered.

 

[Uhtrinity]

Why not look into a program that will allow you to complete school more quickly if you already know the material?

http://www.wgu.edu/online_it_degrees/information_technology_degree_networks_admin

Here's Western Governors University and their Network Admin 4 year degree. Depending on how much you know and how quickly you work I'm sure you can do it quicker than that. You'd end up getting quite a few certs a long the way too.



Here's a link to all their IT degrees.

http://www.wgu.edu/online_it_degrees/bachelor_degree_programs


I would rather change programs than just give it all up based on a bad and painfully slow experience.

I can vouch for WGU as I went that route. I already had 15 years of IT experience and an AAS in electronics, but decided to finish with a BS in IT. You can finish rather quickly if you are dedicated. In my best term I completed almost 30 credits, my worst was 8, but that was juggling a job and a child. I've seen some experienced and dedicated IT folks finish in as little 18 months from start to finish with no formal education prior to starting. Those people however had extensive experience.

As to the original question, 3 things matter (the trifecta):

1. Experience
2. Certs
3. Formal Education

If you have 2 out of the 3 you are off to a good start, but without all 3, mainly the formal education you will eventually hit a glass ceiling. Experience is a given after your first job and will grow with the responsibilities you take on.

edit: Btw, there are some good discussions here about certs and WGU's IT program. http://www.techexams.net/forums/

 

[Bacon_00]

Yeah. That's a good breakdown.

I think I could probably knock out the WGU thing pretty quick, assuming my current BS would fulfill almost all of the general education pre-reqs. Then if I go into it with my A+ and CCENT already completed, that'd knock those competencies out. So a year to a year and a half sounds do-able (assuming I wasn't working at the same time). That's why it sounds so appealing, because it's not any more of a time commitment than I've already planned for/mentally prepared for. It might not be entirely necessary, but having that BS in IT in addition to my traditional BS would do nothing but help as I gain work experience and move up in the field.

But, at the same time, if I can start working with just a couple of self-taught certs, I might be a bit of a fool to keep throwing money at educational institutions for things I don't really need/won't help me significantly in the future.

Just tough to make a decision because there seem to be big pluses and minuses to both routes.

 

[Uhtrinity]

Most certs are worthless. Cisco ones are decent, but most of the others you listed would not be of much value, IMO.

Since you already have a bachelor's degree I don't think the associate's is going to help a whole lot. Some jobs require a bachelor's degree of any kind (not sure why), so I think you have that covered.

However there are quite a few jobs on the IT side that will require certs, mainly the high end ones. The low end certs show that you have the basic skills, mainly when applying for entry level jobs like help desk.

Btw, AAS / AS isn't much better than certs alone IMHO.

 

[SagaLore]

I can vouch for WGU as I went that route.

Yeah. That's a good breakdown.

I think I could probably knock out the WGU thing pretty quick, assuming my current BS would fulfill almost all of the general education pre-reqs.

I will also vouch for WGU. I also worked on a new degree there. They are fully accredited and have a very good reputation.

 

[torpid]

However there are quite a few jobs on the IT side that will require certs, mainly the high end ones. The low end certs show that you have the basic skills, mainly when applying for entry level jobs like help desk.

Right. The OP seemed to refer to "low end" ones such as A+.

 

[Harrod]

From my experience a degree is not required unless you want a senior position or a management position.

Certifications are good but experience is better.

This, also get an entry level job as soon as possible if you complete a ccna or something like that. I work with a someone that was able to pass the ccie written that can't troubleshoot their way out of a paper bag. The books and sims are great, but they don't really prepare you to troubleshoot much.

 

[KlokWyze]

It's all about demonstrability of what technologies you do understand and whatever that company is looking for. Certs look better than a degree, but having 1 certainly doesn't hurt. I'm surprised that you (OP) are still leaning towards the degree. They are a complete waste of money & time in the IT industry in general. It's simply not worth money, most importantly the time. Getting your foot in the door of some small IT company will benefit you greatly.

It's all about jumping on what is "hot". Document some system you setup and put it on your personal web site. Have a portfolio of projects to demonstrate to the potential employer that you know your shit.

Frankly, the #1 thing that employers truly want is a positive hardworking attitude. If you're honest about your skill level than they will like you even more. This honestly trumps everything else. The industry is filled with hotshots who are just lazy pieces of shit that don't help anyone but themselves. Employers don't realize that the "storage expert" they hired for $120K can simply not do what he promised until 4 or 5 months after being extorted for all that money, but by that time, they already jumped ship.

 

[mistercrabby]

Hey everybody. First post here!

I'm currently enrolled in a 2-year AAS program at a local community college in their "Computer Security and Network Technician" program. We're currently studying for our A+ cert, and next quarter we'll work on our Security+ cert. Later, we'll go for our Network+ cert. The program is a 5-quarter program, and I'm scheduled to be done in Fall of 2014.

tldr;tldr; How important is a 2-year technical degree in the IT field compared to just having industry standard certs?

Bacon, congratulations on your career change. I think you're doing the right thing by getting an associates and some certs. Perhaps its the school/program you should reconsider. Microsoft and Cisco networking are solid foundations. The combination will resonate with hiring managers.

What kind of work do you want to do specifically?

 

[Uhtrinity]

It's all about demonstrability of what technologies you do understand and whatever that company is looking for. Certs look better than a degree, but having 1 certainly doesn't hurt. I'm surprised that you (OP) are still leaning towards the degree. They are a complete waste of money & time in the IT industry in general. It's simply not worth money, most importantly the time. Getting your foot in the door of some small IT company will benefit you greatly.

It's all about jumping on what is "hot". Document some system you setup and put it on your personal web site. Have a portfolio of projects to demonstrate to the potential employer that you know your shit.

Frankly, the #1 thing that employers truly want is a positive hardworking attitude. If you're honest about your skill level than they will like you even more. This honestly trumps everything else. The industry is filled with hotshots who are just lazy pieces of shit that don't help anyone but themselves. Employers don't realize that the "storage expert" they hired for $120K can simply not do what he promised until 4 or 5 months after being extorted for all that money, but by that time, they already jumped ship.

Not sure I totally agree. From the 90's and into the mid 2000's this philosophy worked, but due to an excess of IT and CS workers the requirements started to go up, especially for people new to the field. One of the reasons entry level positions are posted with insane requirements or preferences and low salaries.

I agree on the hardworking attitude part, unfortunately that is hard to demonstrate until you actually have the job. Certs, Degrees, and experience get you past HR.

 

[zCypher]

My experience has been that education and certifications don't mean anything whatsoever if you are just trying to get an entry level helpdesk type job, as that is really low level and a lot of places hire just about anyone for those roles. Applying directly to higher level than entry, or moving from entry level to something higher, the education and certifications can make or break your progress really.

It's going to be a lot more difficult to go from no experience to non-entry level than it will to go from entry level to something more. It would probably be a good idea to have a clue as to what specific type of work or job you would like to get. For example, if you work for a telco you would probably be very well served by any certs from Cisco, Juniper, or Alcatel as a lot of their equipment is used by telcos. The lower level certifications you were talking about, I have never seen them mentioned in a job posting anywhere, ever. Internally at the telco I work for, I have seen CCNA mentioned as a job requirement. So I know for a fact that having CCNA would benefit an applicant. I actually don't know anyone who has CCNA certification even in tier2 network support, so for me that's a huge incentive to study for CCNA.

For you, you might not want CCNA depending on what type of role you are aiming for. Let's say you do want to work for an ISP/NOC/whatever where CCNA would be valuable, and assuming you did have to start at entry level helpdesk monkey to get your foot in the door - you would be the first person they choose when you apply for the higher level job, since most helpdesk monkeys are going to be much less qualified than you.

Whatever you decide, good luck. I'm sure you will do great.

 

[Comblues]

I like my AA Degree and it's worth some $95k to $160k plus mostly every day of the week day or night, rain or shine.

I digress, it's probably talking about my certs - CCNP or CCDP.

Lots of jobs say degree but use certs and experience more often than not.

That's my experience and my inbox runs over with job solicitations with my name on them.

Get experienced...

Get certified...

Get ahead...

Comblues

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Really? It's that important? Even though I have a 4-year degree already? Not related to the field, but it's a degree and shows that I'm not a loser.

I'm just painfully bored in class. If I self-teach my CCNA within the next 6 months, I'll have far surpassed what they're going to be teaching in the last 3 quarters of the program. I'll have to go into debt to pay for a class that I'll sit and be bored out of my mind in. It just sounds like such a waste of time and money =/

You already have a 4-year degree, so the 2-year degree normally wouldn't be terribly important. Your issue, I think, is the lack of experience and that IS more important the certifications. You can try to use the 2-year degree to get your foot in the door somewhere but if you can land an entry-level IT job without it, I say go for it.

Why not look into a program that will allow you to complete school more quickly if you already know the material?

http://www.wgu.edu/online_it_degrees/information_technology_degree_networks_admin

Here's Western Governors University and their Network Admin 4 year degree. Depending on how much you know and how quickly you work I'm sure you can do it quicker than that. You'd end up getting quite a few certs a long the way too.



Here's a link to all their IT degrees.

http://www.wgu.edu/online_it_degrees/bachelor_degree_programs


I would rather change programs than just give it all up based on a bad and painfully slow experience.

Good suggestion.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

In IT for companies less than 1000 employees experience counts far FAR more than certs.

Most IT managers have gotten burned by these idiots who do 1-2 week "bootcamps" and leave fully MS and cisco certified.




We will no longer hire based on certs as a the primary thing... IE 1 year of experience and fully cert'd out is worth less to us than 4 years of experience and no certs.


If you want to work for mega corporations as a button pusher then you will need to certs.


My suggestion... Work for a smaller company, get experience, then work on certs on the side.

 

[chedrz]

I'll throw my vote in on this as well. I don't venture on here and post much, but I think this is a topic I should chime in on since I'm currently interviewing people in a position similar to yourself.

While having a degree is good if you want to get to upper levels, I look for certs and, more importantly, the experience/knowledge to back up those certs first and foremost. Having a degree is great, but once you have a degree, you have it. You don't have to do any sort of work to maintain/renew that. Certs from CompTIA and Cisco have to be renewed every few years, so you're required to stay up-to-date on the technology in the field. I can't tell you how many people I've interviewed in the last few weeks who claimed to have systems/networking knowledge & certs and then simply couldn't back up that "knowledge" they claimed to possess.

If you decide to pursue some certifications, make sure you genuinely know what you're studying. Be prepared to answer real-world scenario questions about that knowledge. Be able to talk/think your way through the troubleshooting process. Maybe having a degree and additional critical thinking skills comes in handy here, I'm really not sure. But being able to say "I'm a CCNA/CCDA/CCNP/etc" and then backing up that statement with knowledge and some sort of application looks really, really good to potential employers.