Inexpensive directional WiFi antenna

[Yuriman]

Sorry for not dropping this in the networking section, but it's somewhat time critical and this section has more traffic. I'm having family fly in before Monday and need to provide WiFi to a cabin on my property. It needs to be no narrower than perhaps 10°, reach ~200' through one exterior wall. I currently have a weak signal with the stock antennas on my RT-N66U using a macgyver parabolic aluminum reflector I made, but it's pretty sketchy.

I'd like a relatively inexpensive (let's call it $20-60) directional WiFi antenna. Ideally it will connect to the connector found on a WiFi router (RP-SMA?), and have its own stand or mount within a foot or two, though I can build one if necessary. If I can get one for closer to $20, I'll buy 2. Amazon Prime is preferable for keeping shipping costs under control, but I'm open to alternatives.

 

[Yuriman]

I should add, the antenna will probably need to be indoors. The router will sit in a windowsill, but I can't drill a hole to the outside, or guarantee the window will remain open, so I'm thinking a nice parabolic is out. I don't know if I could reasonably set a small yagi type in the window, or if it would be too big (never used one personally), but I don't know if the cheap 14dbi directional antennas on Amazon are any good.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

I would consider the Ubiquiti Nanostation Loco M2 for $50 shipped. It's a 2.4GHz, 150mbps 60° directional access point with a range of up to 15km+. It plugs into your router via ethernet cable, and can be mounted indoors or outdoors.

 

[Yuriman]

Looks good. Compared to this, for example?

http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-AN...463137827&sr=1-1&keywords=directional+antenna

 

[Burpo]

The TP Link should work. I like their stuff & use it at my house without issue.

 

[mvbighead]

The TP Link should work. I like their stuff & use it at my house without issue.

I'd agree. I have a TPLink router that was nearly as good as a much more expensive Asus router (actually better because the Asus puked a day or two after receiving it).

 

[AnonymouseUser]

Looks good. Compared to this, for example?

http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-AN...463137827&sr=1-1&keywords=directional+antenna

My biggest concern with that is that you are replacing one omnidirectional antenna from the router with a directional antenna and pointing out from the house. That could affect your signal within the house opposite of the antenna. It's hard to say which would actually be better for the remote location without testing them side by side, but at least the Ubiquiti wouldn't affect your current router's performance.

 

[Yuriman]

The router has 3 antennas, and currently is only really expected to reach the cabin - we actually have two lines coming into the house, and another router on the other line. I have very little concern for covering in the main house with this one.

What do you think, between a single 14dbi directional antennas, and two 9dbi directional antennas?

http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-AN...463137827&sr=1-1&keywords=directional+antenna

vs

2x
http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-AN...463137827&sr=1-1&keywords=directional+antenna

EDIT: The Ubiquity has the advantage of not needing a pigtail, so I imagine the gain of the "8dbi" antenna will actually be a bit better than I'd expect, when compared with the TP-Link ones. How much signal loss might I expect with the ~3 foot cables included with the TP-Links?

EDIT: The TP-Link antennas are 30 degree, vs 60 for the Ubiquity.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

What do you think, between a single 14dbi directional antennas, and two 9dbi directional antennas?

The single 14dbi antenna costs $2 more than the access point, and in that case I would definitely do the AP. A single 9bi antenna is clearly the cheapest option, if it works. Two 9dbi antennas cost $10 less than the AP so again, I would do the AP.

Just to be clear, this Ubiquiti AP is designed to be used as a pair to bridge two locations up to 15km apart (example). One will work over shorter distances, though. Worst case scenario is that you'll need two, but given the short range you are attempting to cover one should be enough. Another option is the Ubiquiti Picostation which uses an omnidirectional antenna and has a range of 500m (example), but is more expensive.

EDIT: When bridged, you would need a router at the receiving location as well to provide wireless to local devices.

 

[Yuriman]

The single 14dbi antenna costs $2 more than the access point, and in that case I would definitely do the AP. A single 9bi antenna is clearly the cheapest option, if it works. Two 9dbi antennas cost $10 less than the AP so again, I would do the AP.

Just to be clear, this Ubiquiti AP is designed to be used as a pair to bridge two locations up to 15km apart (example). One will work over shorter distances, though. Worst case scenario is that you'll need two, but given the short range you are attempting to cover one should be enough. Another option is the Ubiquiti Picostation which uses an omnidirectional antenna and has a range of 500m (example), but is more expensive.

EDIT: When bridged, you would need a router at the receiving location as well to provide wireless to local devices.

I accept that the access point may be the best solution, but I'd like to know why you think so. The TP-Link antennas are 30 degree, vs 60 for the Ubiquiti, (on paper) have higher gain, and I could potentially have increased throughput with a pair of the TP-Links. What are the clear advantages of the AP?

 

[AnonymouseUser]

The Ubiquity has the advantage of not needing a pigtail, so I imagine the gain of the "8dbi" antenna will actually be a bit better than I'd expect, when compared with the TP-Link ones. How much signal loss might I expect with the ~3 foot cables included with the TP-Links?

I have no idea about the signal loss from the cables, but I do know you can simple use an ethernet cable to extend the length of the connection between the Ubiquiti AP and the router, so you can place it outdoors much easier and farther from the house (if desired) than the other antennas. You can also mount the AP much higher outdoors if needed.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

What are the clear advantages of the AP?

Mounting location, as I mentioned in the previous reply.

 

[Yuriman]

It's probably the more flexible solution in the long-term, but for now, I can't mount it outside. It's going to sit next to the router, which already as LOS to the cottage. However, so long as it's going to be sufficient to use iPads and such with decent signal strength ~150' from the AP, it seems like the best solution.

 

[JackMDS]

No Antenna in the word would solve this problem being directly on a Consumer Wireless Router.

What ever would be gained with the Antenna's hi dbi would be lost on a Long Coax.

The solution is the along the line of the Ubiquiti NanoStation (as posted above).

Or if you are so Desperate that the few $$$ is so important.

Get something like this Install it out side protect in some Plastic box from the rain connect with CAT5e/6 to the Asus and configure as an Access Point.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAFS3W43878

Using Wireless Routers (or Modem/Wireless Router) as a Switch with an Access Point - http://www.ezlan.net/router_AP.html

------------------------------

The issue is simple Propagation. WIFI is much much better in Obstruction free enviroment than going through walls.

Output of standard WIFI is about 33mW. Antennas do not Amplify the signal. High gain Antenna simply concentrate the same Flimsy Signal in a Narrow beam. Once its hit the wall it does not matter much which Antenna it came from.

Yeah I know in the USA these days word and Wishful thinking "Trumps" reality but Science is Science.

 

[Yuriman]

I went ahead and placed an order for the Ubiquiti unit, but I'm open to discussing this further, to gain a better understanding.

No Antenna in the word would solve this problem being directly on a Consumer Wireless Router.

What ever would be gained with the Antenna's hi dbi would be lost on a Long Coax.

The solution is the along the line of the Ubiquiti NanoStation (as posted above).

What exactly is considered "long" in this type of antenna? The cable included with the TP-Link antennas is 100cm, and as I've said before in this thread, the antenna will be mounted next to the router, in a window with line-of-sight to the cabin. Drilling a hole to feed a cable outside is not an option. Any ideas on what the approximate signal loss would be with that length of cable?

Or if you are so Desperate that the few $$$ is so important.

Get something like this Install it out side protect in some Plastic box from the rain connect with CAT5e/6 to the Asus and configure as an Access Point.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAFS3W43878

Running a wire across the lawn is not an option, as I said earlier in this thread. In the future, circumstances might change, but for now the antenna needs to be where the router is.

I really only need the signal to be strong enough to connect small devices like iPads, laptops and phones around 150 feet from the source, through a single exterior wall.

The issue is simple Propagation. WIFI is much much better in Obstruction free enviroment than going through walls.

Output of standard WIFI is about 33mW. Antennas do not Amplify the signal. High gain Antenna simply concentrate the same Flimsy Signal in a Narrow beam. Once its hit the wall it does not matter much which Antenna it came from.

Yeah I know in the USA these days word and Wishful thinking "Trumps" reality but Science is Science.

I'm aware that walls hurt signal, but I can't run a cable to the cabin, and the walls aren't going anywhere. What I need is the best solution to throw a signal to the cabin, that can effectively penetrate one exterior wall. It's wishful thinking to change the circumstances I have.

What is the output of the Ubiquiti unit? I picked through the data sheet, and was unable to find how many mW it's rated for.

I believe my RT-N66U is set to 200mW right now, but that only helps with router -> client, and not client -> router. I already have a weak signal at the cabin with a home-made parabolic reflector behind the stock omni antennas.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

What is the output of the Ubiquiti unit? I picked through the data sheet, and was unable to find how many mW it's rated for.

200mW according to OpenWRT wiki.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

Also, the rt-n66u has 3.5 dbi antennas, and the Nanostation LocoM2 has an 8dbi antenna.

 

[myocardia]

I believe my RT-N66U is set to 200mW right now, but that only helps with router -> client, and not client -> router. I already have a weak signal at the cabin with a home-made parabolic reflector behind the stock omni antennas.

In that case, you're gonna need a second Ubiquiti NanoStation, along with a decent wireless router. The second NanoStation, plus the new router, go inside the cabin. The phones/tablets/laptops then only need to broadcast to and receive their signals from the router that is inside the cabin. In this scenario, the NanoStations only communicate with each other, from my understanding.*

edit: *In addition to each of them communicating with the one router to which each of them is connected.

 

[Yuriman]

In that case, you're gonna need a second Ubiquiti NanoStation, along with a decent wireless router. The second NanoStation, plus the new router, go inside the cabin. The phones/tablets/laptops then only need to broadcast to and receive their signals from the router that is inside the cabin. In this scenario, the NanoStations only communicate with each other, from my understanding.*

edit: *In addition to each of them communicating with the one router to which each of them is connected.

Well, isn't that the point of an antenna with higher gain?

Increasing broadcast power helps with transmission from router to client, but a higher gain antenna helps with both.

That's why the 200mW output of the Asus router, combined with a 30 degree 14dbi antenna sounded like a good alternative to the Ubiquiti which apparently has the same broadcast power but an 8dbi 60 degree antenna. Both would be placed in the same location, so the wildcard here is whether the 100cm pigtail will cause more signal loss than the (supposedly) narrower and higher gain antenna would add.

 

[JackMDS]

In Wireless signal Signal to Noise Ratio (SNR) is just important as Output Power.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal-to-noise_ratio

A clean 100mW signal would perform many times better than 200mW "Crappy" Signal.

I do not know the Default output of the Asus and how you set your, but I'll give you an Example from years a go.

The Linksys WRT-54G, that started the DD-WRT Revolution could be overclocked to 200mW output. However, any configuration above 60-80 mW (depends on the individual unit) resulted in a too crappy Signal.

Almost all entry level WIFI hardware do not support reading of SNR, that is the reason why Windows and other OSs do not provide in theior reading any reference to it, they can not measure SNR.

The signal's "Bars" are very "crappy" indication to the signal and whatever noise (internal and external) combined.
---------------------

Ubiquiti Networks actualy makes point of it.

https://www.ubnt.com/broadband/technology/

-------------------------

Well, isn't that the point of an antenna with higher gain?

The point is Not to extend Crappy Signal through walls.

The Point is that with Clean signal and transmission uisng high dbi unidirectional Antenna in both sides and configure them with GPS to See eye to eye, outdoor transmission can be extend to few Miles.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

Ubiquiti Networks actualy makes point of it.

https://www.ubnt.com/broadband/technology/

Agreed, but let's not confuse the issue. airPRISM is not included in the Nanostation LocoM2, or most of their products, as best I can tell. It seems to be exclusive to their WISP equipment. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Yuriman]

So, the LocoM2 came in, and I have it configured. So far, I can't say I'm impressed.

Today the weather is good, so I'd have a fair signal with the other router (Veggies) anyway, but I suppose the litmus test will be when it rains or is foggy.

EDIT: FWIW, the Ubiquiti unit is actually more favorably positioned than the Asus router right now, too.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

I don't know what to say except that others who have complained online about short range have made some configuration changes and gotten satisfactory results. Some changes include making sure airMAX is disabled, enable ack auto timeout, disable MIMO (2x2). You may even have a stud blocking the Loco, so try re-positioning it, and try lowering the output power a little.

Worst case scenario you could set it in the remote location as a Long range Wifi Client with local access point.