Insurance Company Profits

[manlymatt83]

I've been reading that a lot of people support the public option because large insurance companies "rake in billions of dollars of profit each year". So you're telling me that even though not everyone is required to have health insurance, so people who don't get sick and are less likely to use the insurance don't maintain a plan, that there are still billions of dollars of profit per year?

This moveon video:

http://pol.moveon.org/insuranc...90-7971826-1GQv3Ex&t=2

was really interesting. But I just find it hard to believe that the insurance companies are really ripping people off that much. I read somewhere that insurance companies only make about 2-3% profit per year.

 

[imported_inspire]

Cliffs:

Originally posted by: manlymatt83
I read somewhere that insurance companies only make about 2-3% profit per year.

I'd find numbers, but I don't feel like - I'll wait to see what you guys have as a I grab my lawn chair and Heineken.

 

[ohnoes]

I don't think its their low profit margins that people see as ripping them off. Its more of the way they operate and the overall healthcare system.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: ohnoes

I don't think its their low profit margins that people see as ripping them off. Its more of the way they operate and the overall healthcare system.

Their profit numbers don't include their execs' megabuck salaries, bonuses and golden parachutes, and they don't include the millions they're spending in lobbying and PR hype such as "town hall meetings" to defeat real, reliable public health care.

They are living fat off the deaths and suffering of their paying customers whose claims they reject.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: ohnoes
I don't think its their low profit margins that people see as ripping them off. Its more of the way they operate and the overall healthcare system.

Even if they were more efficient and not-for-profit, they would still constitute a large of amount of unnecessary and wasteful paper pushing.

Originally posted by: Harvey
Their profit numbers don't include their execs' megabuck salaries, bonuses and golden parachutes, and they don't include the millions they're spending in lobbying and PR hype such as "town hall meetings" to defeat real, reliable public health care.

Good point. Many self-proclaimed "non-profit" companies are actually very much for-profit companies for their stakeholders--the CEOs and other executives.

 

[shadow9d9]

Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

That is a flat out lie. YOU LIE.

 

[alchemize]

Well, if profits were $1, then $10, then yah profits went up 1000%. Shadow is a pretty dishonest poster so it doesn't surprise me that he would twist statistics.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: alchemize
Well, if profits were $1, then $10, then yah profits went up 1000%. Shadow is a pretty dishonest poster so it doesn't surprise me that he would twist statistics.

Big numbers and incorrect math are long the tool of the idiot.

 

[rchiu]

$1 profit for the health insurance industry is $1 too much.

Health insurance is a perfect example of an industry where free market is a bad business model.

On one hand, you want to have big, strong health insurance company so that they have
1) Stronger financials to pay the claims
2) Wider customer pool to spread the risk

On the other hand, a big, strong health insurance company makes the market uncompetitive and since profit is perfectly correlated with screwing customer, customers get screw big time when there is no choice with an uncompetitive market.

What value does insurance company provides anyway? Nothing much really, just processing paper work and pass money from one hand to another. They don't even need to have good financial people to manage the money, most insurance company have standard investment into least risky assets.

This is perfect industry for government to handle because
1) Gov. excels in paperwork handling
2) Consolidate customer base to spread risk
3) Super strong financial backing
4) Eliminate one layer/added cost in healthcare
5) Single source to hand in your claim, single source of coverage rules, no confusion and reduced complexity.
6) No conflict of interest (ie, profit by screwing customers)
7) Strong position for gov. to negotiate cost with providers.

Yeah bunch of people, lobbyist is gonna lost their job. But this will be offset by people gov. need to hire to handle health insurance. Of course, the benefit is dependant of how the gov. runs the program, and if the gov can run it well. Yeah it's a big assumption, but the benefit is worth a try.

 

[Uhtrinity]

80% goes to medical costs and 20% goes to admin, salaries, bonuses, and shareholders. Depends on how you define profit.

 

[alchemize]

There's far, far, far more profit to be made in squeezing doctors and hospitals than denying claims. Something people with no business sense and a political agenda won't get.

When I was in IT in health insurance, ALL the projects we worked on were a) driving new business b) medical management/Medicare c) improving claim processing/member processing/admin costs d) dealing with audits. Not once did we "find ways" to deny new claims, in fact getting claims to "first pass" through EDI was huge.

Our government is so heavily influenced by lobbyists, that if for some reason we go to single payer, then the doctors/hospitals will be getting the windfall. Costs won't come down, that's not the way our government works. Costs never go down.

As it stands, I don't really have problems with the bill in congress, other than it's just more unnecessary government debt for my grandchildren.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: rchiu


This is perfect industry for government to handle because
1) Gov. excels in paperwork handling
2) Consolidate customer base to spread risk
3) Super strong financial backing
4) Eliminate one layer/added cost in healthcare
5) Single source to hand in your claim, single source of coverage rules, no confusion and reduced complexity.
6) No conflict of interest (ie, profit by screwing customers)
7) Strong position for gov. to negotiate cost with providers.

ARe you shittin' me? The government excels in increasing paperwork workload. Take a look at the Cash for Clunkers program to see how well they are handling paperwork. Jesus H Christ, you can't be that ignorant.

Strong financial Backing? Who is backing it - we are or more specifically the Chinese are by buying our treasury bonds. They won't do it forever.

Eliminate a layer??? Have you seen the latest flowchart on the government plan? It adds over 50 layers!!!

No conflict of interest? you mean that the government who collects taxes from the populace to pay for their mandate won't have a conflict of interest in serving the medical care of the populace? Of course they will! And it will do nothing but drive up costs.

Negotiate? Oh, you meant mandate.


This list is just mindnumbingly stupid.

 

[Schadenfroh]

ARe you shittin' me? The government excels in increasing paperwork workload. Take a look at the Cash for Clunkers program to see how well they are handling paperwork. Jesus H Christ, you can't be that ignorant.

I interned for Army R&D. The government is the king of paperwork. I must have filled out like 100 pages a month and waited in line to submit said paperwork for hours only to have some of it require revision. As a matter of fact, the government IS mostly paperwork.

 

[Slick5150]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

That is a flat out lie. YOU LIE.

Going to republican etiquette training camp?

 

[Darthvoy]

I don't care how much money they make. They are free to do as they wish. However, the actions they take in order to to get those proftis is what bothers me.

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: rchiu


This is perfect industry for government to handle because
1) Gov. excels in paperwork handling
2) Consolidate customer base to spread risk
3) Super strong financial backing
4) Eliminate one layer/added cost in healthcare
5) Single source to hand in your claim, single source of coverage rules, no confusion and reduced complexity.
6) No conflict of interest (ie, profit by screwing customers)
7) Strong position for gov. to negotiate cost with providers.

ARe you shittin' me? The government excels in increasing paperwork workload. Take a look at the Cash for Clunkers program to see how well they are handling paperwork. Jesus H Christ, you can't be that ignorant.

Strong financial Backing? Who is backing it - we are or more specifically the Chinese are by buying our treasury bonds. They won't do it forever.

Eliminate a layer??? Have you seen the latest flowchart on the government plan? It adds over 50 layers!!!

No conflict of interest? you mean that the government who collects taxes from the populace to pay for their mandate won't have a conflict of interest in serving the medical care of the populace? Of course they will! And it will do nothing but drive up costs.

Negotiate? Oh, you meant mandate.


This list is just mindnumbingly stupid.

Heh, yeah mindnumbingly stupid if you ignore that US is paying 16+% of it's world #1 GDP in healthcare with the current "free market" system, and the next highest spender is good 5% point less, many with with single payer system with consolidated health insurance that's either gov. ran or ran by non-profit driven entities.

Everyone can shoot their mouth on the Internet but only few can back it up with actual facts.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh

ARe you shittin' me? The government excels in increasing paperwork workload. Take a look at the Cash for Clunkers program to see how well they are handling paperwork. Jesus H Christ, you can't be that ignorant.

I interned for Army R&D. The government is the king of paperwork. I must have filled out like 100 pages a month and waited in line to submit said paperwork for hours only to have some of it require revision. As a matter of fact, the government IS mostly paperwork.

it took 3 weeks for me to get a phone setup as a new employee...

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

That is a flat out lie. YOU LIE.

We all know you silently wrote "You lie, boy"

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: ohnoes

I don't think its their low profit margins that people see as ripping them off. Its more of the way they operate and the overall healthcare system.

Their profit numbers don't include their execs' megabuck salaries, bonuses and golden parachutes, and they don't include the millions they're spending in lobbying and PR hype such as "town hall meetings" to defeat real, reliable public health care.

They are living fat off the deaths and suffering of their paying customers whose claims they reject.

Who's the one spreading propaganda?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: alchemize
Well, if profits were $1, then $10, then yah profits went up 1000%. Shadow is a pretty dishonest poster so it doesn't surprise me that he would twist statistics.

Big words and math are long the tool of the idiot.

:roll:

 

[Modelworks]

The root of the problem is health care for profit. I think someone has to be morally bankrupt to say you can die because you don't pay me enough. I think doctors and other people that work in the industry deserve to be payed but corporations that make money off charging people for a right to live are evil. Some things should be done non profit and health care is one of them. Companies like drug companies that charge extremely high prices so they can rake in the money should be regulated.

Insurance companies are not what they once were, they have become just like stock brokers , they negotiate with the corporations to get a lower price . One person pays one fee while someone else may pay something different for the exact same service, that is hardly fair. If retail stores started a policy where depending on what mood the cashier was in, you paid a different price for the same items, people would be outraged.

 

[Double Trouble]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: ohnoes

I don't think its their low profit margins that people see as ripping them off. Its more of the way they operate and the overall healthcare system.

Their profit numbers don't include their execs' megabuck salaries, bonuses and golden parachutes, and they don't include the millions they're spending in lobbying and PR hype such as "town hall meetings" to defeat real, reliable public health care.

Ok, lets see some facts to back that up. Lets see some info on those "megabuck salaries" that show the salaries for insurance company execs are any different than those for any other large corporations. The insurance companies lobby and PR just like every other industry does. Further, even if you were to factor in "megabuck salaries" and other such nonsense, the reality is that it's still not a meaningful slice of the overall health care system costs. I'm no big fan of insurance companies (health or otherwise), but trying to make the insurance industry the bogeyman and pretending it's the source of the problem diverts from real rational analysis and trying to get reform done.

 

[Double Trouble]

Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

Complete bullshit. Go look up some actual numbers for the top 10 or top 15 health insurance companies and show us how their profits went up 1000% in 5 years. Fail.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Their profits have gone up 1000% in 5 years while covering less people... go watch the former head of Cigna's interviews.

That is a flat out lie. YOU LIE.

RACIST!!!! :|