News Intel 2Q24 Financial Results

Page 24 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Joe NYC

Platinum Member
Jun 26, 2021
2,463
3,347
106
So there's another possibility.

Maybe Intel committed to buy x number of wafers from TSMC, but losing market share to AMD means that they need to cut back on their internal sourcing to be able to hit the order commitment to TSMC. In that case, killing 20A which was dual sourced made perfect sense since they already had the designs done for TSMC and they could save money to boot.

It would have to be N3B for N3B, which could be lower than anticipated demand for other uses of N3B (Lunar Lake, Arrow Lake big die)
 

desrever

Member
Nov 6, 2021
167
445
106
They probably booked those TSMC wafers for their GPUs and AI chips which they originally had big plans for.
ARL was probably going to be all 20A originally and only ported to N3B after the timeline slips and GPU cuts.
 

Nothingness

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2013
3,030
1,971
136
They just bought the Nuvia team, why would they buy yet another CPU design team just to make ARM CPUs (and start over from scratch)? Without an x86 license and their existing designs the team is significantly less valuable. If Intel is serious about selling them off to raise cash they should include the license.
Because they could work on multiple overlapping iterations of their Arm core. And that would help weaken x86 which has lived way too long.
 

Doug S

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2020
2,701
4,583
136
I think AMD would approve of an x86 license transfer to Qualcomm. Competing against one x86 CPU design company is easier than competing against many ARM CPU design companies.

Why do you think AMD would have any say in the matter? AMD's only real contribution is AMD64, and those patents are expired now. Even if they did have that ability, I think the FTC would have something to say about that if AMD was refusing such a transfer because they wanted to give themselves a monopoly on x86.
 
Reactions: TESKATLIPOKA

Joe NYC

Platinum Member
Jun 26, 2021
2,463
3,347
106
Why do you think AMD would have any say in the matter? AMD's only real contribution is AMD64, and those patents are expired now. Even if they did have that ability, I think the FTC would have something to say about that if AMD was refusing such a transfer because they wanted to give themselves a monopoly on x86.

As long as Intel is still an operating company, and near monopoly in client, the government is not going to approve merging it into another near monopoly (QCOM).

I think the only way this could be approved is if Intel was about to go under.
 

gdansk

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2011
2,837
4,220
136
Why do you think AMD would have any say in the matter? AMD's only real contribution is AMD64, and those patents are expired now. Even if they did have that ability, I think the FTC would have something to say about that if AMD was refusing such a transfer because they wanted to give themselves a monopoly on x86.
By that same virtue ARMv7 patents expire next year.
But the perpetual intellectual property merchants will still get their fees.

The only basis for AMD and Intel to still be a duopoly is intellectual property maximalism.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
15,106
5,664
136
Why do you think AMD would have any say in the matter? AMD's only real contribution is AMD64, and those patents are expired now. Even if they did have that ability, I think the FTC would have something to say about that if AMD was refusing such a transfer because they wanted to give themselves a monopoly on x86.

Part of Intel's agreement with AMD was that if AMD were to get bought or go bankrupt, they would forfeit the x86 license. But the opposite applies too.
 

Doug S

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2020
2,701
4,583
136
As long as Intel is still an operating company, and near monopoly in client, the government is not going to approve merging it into another near monopoly (QCOM).

I think the only way this could be approved is if Intel was about to go under.

Intel has a near monopoly in PC client, and Qualcomm has almost no share in PC client. Qualcomm's monopoly in is cellular modems/chipsets, where Intel has zero share. They don't care so much about two monopolies merging if they are monopolies in separate domains, so long as the monopoly in one can't be leveraged to maintain/increase the monopoly in the other.

I don't see how Qualcomm taking over Intel's PC business would hurt the competitiveness of the PC industry (ARM PCs will still be able to be made by Nvidia, Mediatek, etc.) or help their monopoly in cellular modems or Android SoCs.

I don't think this would be good for consumers, but it wouldn't be bad. It isn't as though Intel hasn't acted like a monopolist, and the government would have to chase to leash them to some extent by putting conditions on the merger that would seek to improve competition. Maybe they'd be required to spin off their ARM design efforts if they wanted to take over Intel's x86 design. Maybe they'd be barred from integrating cellular modems into their PC chips for a period of years (not that I think that could ever be a successful market, but just in case) Maybe they'd be barred from offering x86 SoCs for Android (another "just in case" to prevent them from owning some sort of hypothetical x86 Windows "Dex" type market)
 

Doug S

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2020
2,701
4,583
136
Part of Intel's agreement with AMD was that if AMD were to get bought or go bankrupt, they would forfeit the x86 license. But the opposite applies too.

Do we know the opposite applies for sure, or are people just assuming it? I don't see why Intel would have agreed to that clause, other than hubris "we will never go bankrupt so we'll throw them a bone and put that clause in for laughs".
 

gdansk

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2011
2,837
4,220
136
Do we know the opposite applies for sure, or are people just assuming it? I don't see why Intel would have agreed to that clause, other than hubris "we will never go bankrupt so we'll throw them a bone and put that clause in for laughs".
Intel didn't put it in. AMD would have when they licensed AMD64 to Intel.
If they did an ex-Intel could still make x86 chips but it's a limited market.
 
Last edited:

Thunder 57

Platinum Member
Aug 19, 2007
2,954
4,480
136
Intel didn't put it in. AMD would have when they licensed AMD64 to Intel.
If they did an ex-Intel could still make x86 chips but it's a limited market.

That sounds plausible. Is it public knowledge though?
 

gdansk

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2011
2,837
4,220
136
That sounds plausible. Is it public knowledge though?
No, as far as I know the only public knowledge about x86 cross-licensing is from court cases.

Intel and AMD slowly bought up all the companies/product lines depending on cross-licensing agreements with Intel. Except IBM. But IBM instead sold* off their fabs rendering their license moot.

* actually they paid GloFo to take them. Relevant to Intel's future?
 
Reactions: coercitiv

Thibsie

Senior member
Apr 25, 2017
856
964
136
No, as far as I know the only public knowledge about x86 cross-licensing is from court cases.

Intel and AMD slowly bought up all the companies/product lines depending on cross-licensing agreements with Intel. Except IBM. But IBM instead sold* off their fabs rendering their license moot.

* actually they paid GloFo to take them. Relevant to Intel's future?
Via still has one, don't they ?
 

zeropride

Junior Member
Aug 27, 2024
7
2
36
I guess reading is a bit passe. Try post #515 http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=threads/intel-2q24-financial-results.2621083/post-41290987 above.

When you're screaming for cash. don't tell me "Intel has nothing to worry about".

Intel is still auto bought everywhere. Until that changes they are fine. They have the whole foundry arm they can sell off if they need to. Foundries are not a requirement to make money.

Unless AMD flip 90% of client and server, Intel is fine. They don't deserve a bailout but the US gov def loves Intel so they will get it.
 

jdubs03

Senior member
Oct 1, 2013
683
307
136
Seems reasonable to post us here because I don’t think it fits well anywhere else.
Kind of lines up with what Patrick Moorhead was saying.

(Paywalled unfortunately but that’s Bloomberg)
- Intel Is Exploring Sale of Part of Stake in Mobileye

 

DZero

Member
Jun 20, 2024
87
47
51
VIA/Zhaoxin, but yes they do.
They can buy Intel's E core division. That is very competent and VIA needs a competent processor.
Another company would be DM&P Electronics. They are still alive and Intel's E cores could bring back to the game.
 

Joe NYC

Platinum Member
Jun 26, 2021
2,463
3,347
106
Last edited:

DZero

Member
Jun 20, 2024
87
47
51
I sincerely doubt that the US government would let Intel sell chunks of themselves to a Chinese company.
Agreed about VIA, but isn't DM&P Electronics Taiwanese (aka, ally of USA)? Also having a new competitor in x86 using E cores would allow to not let it abandoned.
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |