Intel AMD Agreement.

[III-V]

Money.

Intel is also required to support PCIe until... 2016 or 2017 I believe.

 

[ShintaiDK]

I'm still not sure why Intel didn't buy NVIDIA, AMD, or ImgTec to get its hands on some really good graphics IP and talent.

It makes no economic sense. AMD may never recover the value lost with ATI for example.

Also a company like nVidia would be impossible to integrate into Intel. It was hard enough for AMD to get ATI without massive employee fleeing and huge amounts of company culture issues. And nVidia and Intel is like oil and water on that level.

 

[AnandThenMan]

It makes no economic sense. AMD may never recover the value lost with ATI for example.

Also a company like nVidia would be impossible to integrate into Intel. It was hard enough for AMD to get ATI without massive employee fleeing and huge amounts of company culture issues. And nVidia and Intel is like oil and water on that level.

AMD would likely be dead without ATI, Intel and Nvidia would work out just fine sans Jen-Hsun Huang who would understandably not want to see his company run by someone else.

You also have zero evidence of any culture clash, laughable post.

 

[mrmt]

AMD would likely be dead without ATI, Intel and Nvidia would work out just fine sans Jen-Hsun Huang who would understandably not want to see his company run by someone else.

Shareholders would be far better with AMD dead but 6 billion in their purse than with AMD alive today, and worth of only 2 billion.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Pure nonsense. That would mean missing out on the sine wave stock which I've taken advantage of for years.

 

[mrmt]

Pure nonsense. That would mean missing out on the sine wave stock which I've taken advantage of for years.

At the expense of other shareholders?

 

[videogames101]

At the expense of other shareholders?

thats how the market works

 

[mrmt]

thats how the market works

No, that's not how it works. Stick to apple stock or Intel stock or you would earned a lot in stock added value or dividends. If you did the same with AMD and you would got burnt. Nobody would suggest that closing down these two companies some time in the past would have been a better value for its shareholders, but we can safely say that for AMD. If AMD instead of struggling on the market until 2013 had closed down and gave away 6 billion for its shareholders, they would be far better than owning AMD stock now.

AMD destroyed shareholder value, it didn't generate positive inflows in a log time, let alone profits or dividends, it is a bottomless pit in terms of shareholder's money. That's not the stock market works.

 

[positivedoppler]

Anyone have news or speculation regarding their x86 agreement or we're going to continue going down that rabbit hole of AMD stock price and business.

 

[Lonyo]

There is no x86 agreement. x86 patents are dead and gone. Anyone can make an x86 chip.

It's a cross licensing agreement for relevant extensions and x86-64 patents.

http://opencores.org/project,zet86

Sure, it's part semantics, but every year we advance in time, is another year of patents which cease to be, and more things drop out of the Intel-AMD agreement and older x86 extensions can be used by anyone who wants to.

 

[mrmt]

thats how the market works

There is no x86 agreement. x86 patents are dead and gone. Anyone can make an x86 chip.

You can't build a modern x86 processor without the patents (SSEx, AVXx, for example.

 

[AnandThenMan]

No, that's not how it works. Stick to apple stock or Intel stock or you would earned a lot in stock added value or dividends. If you did the same with AMD and you would got burnt. Nobody would suggest that closing down these two companies some time in the past would have been a better value for its shareholders, but we can safely say that for AMD. If AMD instead of struggling on the market until 2013 had closed down and gave away 6 billion for its shareholders, they would be far better than owning AMD stock now.

AMD destroyed shareholder value, it didn't generate positive inflows in a log time, let alone profits or dividends, it is a bottomless pit in terms of shareholder's money. That's not the stock market works.

This is all just flat out wrong.

 

[mrmt]

This is all just flat out wrong.

Enlighten us.

 

[AnandThenMan]

You're talking all in theory, I actually buy and sell AMD shares and make money. Don't care one single bit about value of the company or anything else.

 

[Arachnotronic]

You're talking all in theory, I actually buy and sell AMD shares and make money. Don't care one single bit about value of the company or anything else.

So you've traded AMD in the past to make a quick buck here and there. Nothing wrong with that, but mrmt is talking about AMD from the perspective of an investor, and everything mrmt said with respect to AMD failing to deliver value from a fundamental business perspective is spot on.

 

[AnandThenMan]

How many investors do we have on this forum, for any company?

 

[Idontcare]

How many investors do we have on this forum, for any company?

Relevance?

You are the one who interjected themselves into the middle of a dialogue regarding apples, denouncing said apples because you are in the oranges business.

Only now you are being made aware of the fact your conversation about oranges has nothing to do with said prior conversation about apples...and your rebuttal to this "egg in face" moment is to side-step with a "but nobody is interested in apples anyways, so let's get back to me and talking about my oranges"? :\

The least you could do is cede the point that mrmt was, and still is, deftly making in regards to the financial consequences that AMD's business decisions have had on AMD's shareholders (not to be conflated with speculators).

Nearly 40% of AMD's shareholders are institutional shareholders, they don't get the luxury of buying and selling as the stock pops and dives over time.

Its great that you've profited at their expense, and those retirees are left holding a more and more empty bag on every dip. I suppose that is something to be proud of.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Its great that you've profited at their expense, and those retirees are left holding a more and more empty bag on every dip. I suppose that is something to be proud of.

The entire stock market is based on winners and losers. Are you proud of Intel profiting at the expense of AMD and other companies? No? Well that's how the free market works.

 

[Xpage]

You can't build a modern x86 processor without the patents (SSEx, AVXx, for example.

True although last I checked not too many people use AVX and intel is helping that disuse through their market fragmentation schemes. SSE should be expiring in 2016 if it is on a 15 year patent, then by 2019 you can get through SSE3, though by that time I would hope AVX usage becomes more common

 

[mrmt]

True although last I checked not too many people use AVX and intel is helping that disuse through their market fragmentation schemes. SSE should be expiring in 2016 if it is on a 15 year patent, then by 2019 you can get through SSE3, though by that time I would hope AVX usage becomes more common

IIRC The patents are 20 years, but there are more patents than those, for example, all the visualization extensions, QPI, FSB.... it's simply not possible to develop a modern x86 processor without those.

 

[mrmt]

The entire stock market is based on winners and losers.

Not the entire stock market. Do you think the main reason for AMD to sell stocks on the marker is to keep the ball running on the casino, or is there a more fundamental activity taking place? The fundamental reason companies go to that market is to finance their development, and the market is that big because it is a very efficient way to get financing, and investors are usually quite happy with what they are able to scoop on the market.

For this kind of guy, the investors who actually is there to finance a company, AMD is a very bad business proposition.

 

[nenforcer]

Intel has recently partnered with a couple of Chinese ARM SoC vendors (RockChip, Allwinner) by giving them Sofia x86 Tablet SoC chips to help them get a foothold in the massive Chinese marketplace.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-...th-china-s-rockchip-on-chips-for-tablets.html

The desktop PC market has been shrinking by quite a bit as even some companies in the US are having their employees use their phones in a dock at work to run just the necessary applications.

The growth of tablet and smartphones (ARM) has only been increasing and Intel has to make sure it has a foothold in the worlds largest market (China) and there is no better way to do that than with homegrown Chinese companies.

AMD has already announced their next generation x86 chip "Zen" so there is no doubt they will renew the agreement. There is still to much money to be made as a lower performing lower cost alternative to Intel and Intel needs AMD to avoid the antitrust issues.

 

[mrmt]

There is still to much money to be made as a lower performing lower cost alternative to Intel and Intel needs AMD to avoid the antitrust issues.

That business model is already dead, because Atom ate AMD's bacon on the bottom end. No matter what AMD throws at it they just can't match the cost structure of Bay Trail and Cherry Trail.

What really forces AMD to stick with x86 is their "semi-custom" business. They can't manufacture console APUs without an agreement, and they can't develop others x86 "semi-custom" without a license.

As for anti-trust issue... this is a non-issue by now. It would be the same as of saying that Microsoft wasn't a monopoly in the beginning of the 2000's because of Linux (*burst into laugh*). Intel has almost all the profitable markets for themselves, excepts for a few niches now occupied by the cat cores. If authorities were to do something, they would have done long ago.

 

[USER8000]

This thread went a predictable way.

 

[AnandThenMan]

What really forces AMD to stick with x86 is their "semi-custom" business. They can't manufacture console APUs without an agreement, and they can't develop others x86 "semi-custom" without a license.

Intel can't do x86 processors without an AMD64 license. That's why we will see the cross licensing continue for the foreseeable future.