Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread

[Arkaign]

Anyway. I probably won’t be around much for the next 2 months due to a medical issue, but I hope to read the forum from time to time along with the reviews.

Hope your medical journey goes well mate 🤟. It seems like it should be an entertaining time to watch the leaks, reviews, and general mayhem of various people overly emotionally attached to one company or another freaking out 😂

 

[Zucker2k]

Hope your medical journey goes well mate 🤟. It seems like it should be an entertaining time to watch the leaks, reviews, and general mayhem of various people overly emotionally attached to one company or another freaking out 😂

Aye, aye!

 

[igor_kavinski]

To me he's just saying, "No more Itanium, okay?". And yes I know that Itanium is dead, but Gelsinger doesn't want to oversee the introduction of another uarch family with capabilities that will go broadly-unsupported by developers.

Not to mention Larrabee...

 

[DrMrLordX]

Not to mention Larrabee...

Larrabee paid some dividends for awhile until 10nm killed Phi. Let's be honest, Phi still wasn't competitive with dGPU-based accelerators in the long run. It did have its day in the sun, though. I will agree with you though on the whole "hey let's give Phi a version of AVX-512 we won't necessarily replicate entirely in our server CPUs".

In fact I would say that AVX-512 is turning into more of a fiasco for Intel than Phi ever did.

 

[lobz]

Now, if I'm allowed a cherry on top this holiday season, may we have leading edge marketing as well?

With Gelsinger talking like a kid when in the mood, probably not - but first and1 foremost, certainly not with Ryan Shrout.

Doesn't matter... when they have something really good, let them say what they want 😆

 

[igor_kavinski]

In fact I would say that AVX-512 is turning into more of a fiasco for Intel than Phi ever did.

Automatic Core Specialization for AVX-512 Applications (kit.edu)

Must be embarrassing when people outside Intel are telling them how to fix their issues with AVX-512 power consumption.

 

[Mopetar]

SMT only helps throughput if you have more work than your existing cores can handle. How often is someone pegging all six cores in an iPhone?

For Macs it may be worth it, and maybe we'll see it on the Mac Pro, but for phones it is IMHO a ridiculous idea.

Apple does have one advantage in that they control the software which means their SMT can be crafted a little more carefully. If they could find parts of their software that don't mind being preempted for other threads and aren't reliant on memory then those would be perfect to fit into an SMT-capable processor that can intelligently assign threads of that type.

Does Apple need that much resource utilization? Probably not, but they could certainly make it work.

 

[Joe NYC]

5% gaming performance loss in Windows 11

Benchmarked: Do Windows 11’s Security Features Really Hobble Gaming Performance?

How much do they hurt, and how to opt out.

www.tomshardware.com

 

[moinmoin]

Maybe Microsoft wants to match Steam Desk in gaming performance. /s

 

[coercitiv]

From APISAK on Twitter:

 

[lobz]

@coercitiv I take it all back. Taken from a Pat Gelsinger interview "We're not 80-ish percent share because we don't satisfy the customers and satisfy the market and enable the partners as well," Gelsinger said. "And yeah, AMD has done a solid job over the last couple of years. We won't dismiss them of the good work that they've done, but that's over with Alder Lake and Sapphire Rapids."

He is no different from the ones before. That is kind of sad.

 

[uzzi38]

I can understand why Intel would feel confident about Alder Lake, because it has quite a few workloads where it just flies through, and in those it doesn't it's still very comparable.

But SPR? Sorry but it's gonna be smushed before the end of the year by Genoa. That's frankly not a competition.

 

[coercitiv]

I take it all back. Taken from a Pat Gelsinger interview [...]

Yeah I saw that too recently and was quite disappointed as well. We're back to unsubstantiated promises, not even an official demo of capabilities for ADL. Sure, some around here may argue we know ADL is strong, but AFAIK that's exclusively based on leaks. They could have at least waited for the launch demos.

That CRN article is sponsored. I don't have a problem when they use this type of channel for lobbying or putting out messages about corporate strategy, but to pay money so you can claim performance leadership looks really bad in my book. Why not use high profile publications and go through "real-world" interviews to showcase your confidence instead?

Overall I like ADL, I'm VERY curious about SPR. That being said, Intel PR and marketing are still stuck in the dinosaur era.

 

[biostud]

@coercitiv I take it all back. Taken from a Pat Gelsinger interview "We're not 80-ish percent share because we don't satisfy the customers and satisfy the market and enable the partners as well," Gelsinger said. "And yeah, AMD has done a solid job over the last couple of years. We won't dismiss them of the good work that they've done, but that's over with Alder Lake and Sapphire Rapids."

He is no different from the ones before. That is kind of sad.

Do you think he'll bring back the performance/watt measure as the most important aspect of a CPU as some of his predecessors too?

 

[moinmoin]

But SPR? Sorry but it's gonna be smushed before the end of the year by Genoa. That's frankly not a competition.

Milan-based Trento seems to make it look very bad already (unless it's all on Xe), from an article comparing Aurora (which uses SPR) with Frontier (which uses Trento):
"“Aurora” is burning twice as much electricity to deliver slightly less performance than “Frontier”. And at $1 per watt per year to keep a supercomputer running, it could cost close to $60 million a year power “Aurora”, which adds up to close to $240 million over four years. At only 29 megawatts, you are talking only $116 million for “Frontier”. “Aurora” better be damned efficient computationally to pay that heavy power bill, which is only driven in part by having 50 percent more GPUs to deliver slightly less raw performance a year later than “Frontier”."

First Look At Oak Ridge’s “Frontier” Exascaler, Contrasted To Argonne’s “Aurora”

The fiscal year of the federal government in the United States ends on September 30, and whether we all knew it or not, the US Department of Energy had a

www.nextplatform.com

Why not use high profile publications and go through "real-world" interviews to showcase your confidence instead?

👍

Do you think he'll bring back the performance/watt measure as the most important aspect of a CPU as some of his predecessors too?

He'll have to at some point (see above).

 

[Asterox]

From APISAK on Twitter:

View attachment 51026

Same story, as the recent Sisoft Sandra Prewiev or show quickly and fast delete.

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"Original Puget score is now as expected disappeared".It would be useful, if the i7-12700K scores could be directly compared.

PugetBench List

Build your own computer, workstation, mini pc, or server at Puget Custom Computers.

www.pugetsystems.com

Adobe Premiere Pro: 11th Gen Intel Core vs AMD Ryzen 5000 Series

Earlier this month, Intel announced the initial launch of their new 11th Gen Intel Core desktop processors (code-named "Rocket Lake"). These new processors are marketed as having substantially better per-core performance compared to their previous 10th Gen Core models, but will that be enough...

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Adobe Photoshop: 11th Gen Intel Core vs AMD Ryzen 5000 Series

Earlier this month, Intel announced the initial launch of their new 11th Gen Intel Core desktop processors (code-named "Rocket Lake"). These new processors are marketed as having substantially better per-core performance compared to their previous 10th Gen Core models, but will that be enough...

www.pugetsystems.com

Adobe After Effects: 11th Gen Intel Core vs AMD Ryzen 5000 Series

Earlier this month, Intel announced the initial launch of their new 11th Gen Intel Core desktop processors (code-named "Rocket Lake"). These new processors are marketed as having substantially better per-core performance compared to their previous 10th Gen Core models, but will that be enough...

www.pugetsystems.com

 

[Ajay]

But SPR? Sorry but it's gonna be smushed before the end of the year by Genoa. That's frankly not a competition.

Obviously, customers will buy millions of them just to have AVX512 support. Integer maths is so 90s 😉.

 

[rainy]

@coercitiv I take it all back. Taken from a Pat Gelsinger interview "We're not 80-ish percent share because we don't satisfy the customers and satisfy the market and enable the partners as well," Gelsinger said. "And yeah, AMD has done a solid job over the last couple of years. We won't dismiss them of the good work that they've done, but that's over with Alder Lake and Sapphire Rapids."

He is no different from the ones before. That is kind of sad.

I think, it's a piece of the bigger problem: arrogance is an inherent part of Intel's culture and I can hardly imagine it will change in the near future.

Btw, a disaster called 10nm is a best proof of that.

 

[gdansk]

Alder Lake looks really good so far. I can understand the CEO's enthusiasm. If priced appropriately it could sell very well.

 

[Bouowmx]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1445758253405593607

The VRM config is 16-phase Vcore, 1 for graphics, 2 auxiliary (not FIVR).

Is Vcore statically partitioned for P and E cores or some different mechanism?

 

[Mopetar]

It would sell well even if it was a bit more lackluster than we're hoping for because there aren't enough alternatives to capitalize on an Intel blunder. AMD can pick up a little market share and maybe a few people switch over to ARM, but there just aren't enough resources in place for any company to take a massive bite out of Intel.

The only thing that changes is Intel's margins. They have plenty of room to drop prices if performance is t quite there, but if it does deliver they can see AMD's raise and decide to raise in turn.

 

[lobz]

Alder Lake looks really good so far. I can understand the CEO's enthusiasm. If priced appropriately it could sell very well.

There are huge gaps between enthusiasm, confidence and sheer arrogance.

 

[dmens]

There are huge gaps between enthusiasm, confidence and sheer arrogance.

Heh. Don't forget "delusion".

 

[biostud]

I think, it's a piece of the bigger problem: arrogance is an inherent part of Intel's culture and I can hardly imagine it will change in the near future.

Btw, a disaster called 10nm is a best proof of that.

It's called Intel 7

 

[uzzi38]

Obviously, customers will buy millions of them just to have AVX512 support. Integer maths is so 90s .

Genoa has AVX-512 as well

AMX is the new hotness now, didn't you know?