Would be amzing if skymont has rocket lake ipc 😁View attachment 87283
8 wide skymont is wild lol, even if it's 2x4
Are we expecting a notable MT gains but less so for ST on Arrow Lake with way more performant E coresView attachment 87283
8 wide skymont is wild lol, even if it's 2x4
AFAIK both cores have large IPC gains but LNC fmax is low hence the mediocre ST bump.Are we expecting a notable MT gains but less so for ST on Arrow Lake with way more performant E cores
It's funny how Intel gets assisted for their part in global warming: https://submer.com/press/intel-coll...-the-path-to-immersion-cooling-for-1000w-tdp/
Absolutely no reason for them to dial back on their CPU core power consumption. In fact, this allows them to start making even more inefficient CPUs!
Coming soon to a water heater near you, the Intel Core iLovetoHeatyouUp 1000W! Making homes warm and cozy without letting waste heat go to waste!
I think it's a bit too soon to speculate on LNC's Fmax as we still dunno how performant 20A is. A clock regression may not be there at all.AFAIK both cores have large IPC gains but LNC fmax is low hence the mediocre ST bump.
It’s not all about node, sometimes new cores with higher IPC just can’t clock as highI think it's a bit too soon to speculate on LNC's Fmax as we still dunno how performant 20A is. A clock regression may not be there at all.
Without a serious performance per watt improvement it isn't going to move the needle for the DIY community. A margin of error percentage level of gaming advantage isn't going to do anything for sales to our crowd either. Of course there is the point that unless things change, it is really no big deal how 14th gen desktop performs. The desktop market is in a historic slump. OEMs love the new shiny to help sell their stuff, so that's its best chance to have any impact.
This launch is an object example of how erroneous the cheap power taking point can be. The terrible performance per watt for gaming is the death knell in most reviews.Don't think most people care about that tbh, esp if prices are alright. Though that's my "US-based" perspective, I think electricity elsewhere is way more expensive
Tbh, given that GRC is ~SKL IPC, it wouldn't be too out of left field to expect skymont to have CYPC IPC...Would be amzing if skymont has rocket lake ipc
Tbh I think that's a bit too hopeful. That's like 2 P-core generations worth of IPC increases, which would mean (for the P-cores to not look outright stupid in comparison to the E-cores) that the P-cores (LNC) should be ~2 P-core generations worth of IPC increases as well, which doesn't seem like it's happening....Skymont aims for alder lake ipc 💻😄😄 .. revenge of the e-cores is here lol
This is prob the best case scenario for Intel. Intel has had this recent trend where they release new archs with mid ST clocks and then boost them really high in the subsequent generation.AFAIK both cores have large IPC gains but LNC fmax is low hence the mediocre ST bump.
Tbh, didn't expect the power diff to be that high. Haven't looked at gaming power consumption figures in a while. That's mb.This launch is an object example of how erroneous the cheap power taking point can be. The terrible performance per watt for gaming is the death knell in most reviews.
Has Intel ever done that before?I think they were better just producing these primarily for OEMs and S.I.s. With none of the usual media blitz.
Eh. I think the DIY community would have bullied Intel harder for trying to hide it lol. And it would prob be justified tbh.but it would have greatly muted the effect on the DIY audience.
It would be a massive disappointment if the 8+32 die is still on N3B in late 2025. they should at least port it to N3P.The only problem is that it also required a new die/node update, which doesn't sound like it's happening with ARL-R (with the exclusion of the 8+32 die, but doubt this one die includes core level changes).
Don't think Intel is going to go through all the effort of porting it to N3P, which has different design rules than N3B IIRC, when it would be much easier for them to just expand the 8+16 die, IMO.It would be a massive disappointment if the 8+32 die is still on N3B in late 2025. they should at least port it to N3P.
What makes you think ARL-R will still be on N3B? I don’t think there’s been any information on this since it’s still 2 years away. If they’re sticking with TSMC I’d imagine they’d at least move to another flavor of N3. If they’re doing an internal node it’d likely be 18A.This is prob the best case scenario for Intel. Intel has had this recent trend where they release new archs with mid ST clocks and then boost them really high in the subsequent generation.
The only problem is that it also required a new die/node update, which doesn't sound like it's happening with ARL-R (with the exclusion of the 8+32 die, but doubt this one die includes core level changes).
It seems like you’re going off of MLID’s data but his accuracy 2 years out is pretty bad. I wouldn’t read too much into it.Don't think Intel is going to go through all the effort of porting it to N3P, which has different design rules than N3B IIRC, when it would be much easier for them to just expand the 8+16 die, IMO.
The naming of "ARL-R" really makes it seem like it's the same dies across the stack with one new die being added which is just tweaking the old die with a longer ringstop and more cores lol.
Nah, Raichu was also talking about the 8+32 ARL die launching a year after the OG ARL lineup.It seems like you’re going off of MLID’s data but his accuracy 2 years out is pretty bad. I wouldn’t read too much into it.
The word "refresh".What makes you think ARL-R will still be on N3B? I don’t think there’s been any information on this since it’s still 2 years away. If they’re sticking with TSMC I’d imagine they’d at least move to another flavor of N3. If they’re doing an internal node it’d likely be 18A.
It’s probably going to play out similar to ADL -> RPL if I had to guess.
I agree, just not in this instance.Tbh, didn't expect the power diff to be that high. Haven't looked at gaming power consumption figures in a while. That's mb.
The cheap power talking point is a legitimate talking point though.
Citation needed. AMD, and in particular Zen 3 has consistently dominated retail since release from all indications. Be it weekly Mind Factory stats, top 10 on Amazon and Newegg, or the recent Techpowerup poll.There's a reason the 12900k still sold pretty well in comparison to vanilla Zen 3, despite being disproportionately power hungry.
This amounts to splitting hairs. Your original reply to me was over my comment concerning performance per watt needing to be a massive improvement to move the needle. All we have done here is circle back.The death knells in reviews aren't coming from the outright massive power consumption diff, but the fact that the 7800x3d is often beating the 14900k while consuming so much less power.
Don't recall. It would however, simply have numbered among the things Intel has been forced into doing, that they have never done before.Has Intel ever done that before?
Only the detractors that always rake them over the coals regardless, would have tried to make it a big issue. The tech press would have approached it differently IMO. That would have helped control the narrative. Even keeping the 13th gen designation would have helped. They laid off over 10K in marketing and advertising; are the chickens coming home to roost?Eh. I think the DIY community would have bullied Intel harder for trying to hide it lol. And it would prob be justified tbh.
Suppose we’ll see. If it remains on N3B there’s literally nothing to refresh for the lower core count SKUs. What’s going to be improved? The Skylake & Alder Lake refreshes were only possible because they controlled the node and even in those instances it didn’t really work.The word "refresh".
If it doesn't have a new codename, then I doubt it's going to change much. Even RPL had a new codename lol.
And Intel 18A "ARL" is Panther Lake... which doesn't appear to be a full lineup.
Mindfactory has AMD dominating Intel even if AMD released a pile of poop. Just like the Japanese market favors Intel, at least from what I hear.Be it weekly Mind Factory stats,
Right now the 12900kf is 38th and the 5950x is... 35th.top 10 on Amazon and Newegg,
No idea what that isor the recent Techpowerup poll.
I don't find the distinction of power consumption vs perf splitting hairs, especially when with 12th gen it's shown that higher power consumption is often excused in regards to higher perf.This amounts to splitting hairs.
I've already said I misremembered RPL's original power consumption in gaming difference, and that's my bad. I don't know what else you want me to do, get on my knees? 🤣Your original reply to me was over my comment concerning performance per watt needing to be a massive improvement to move the needle. All we have done here is circle back.
Wouldn't be necessaryDon't recall. It would however, simply have numbered among the things Intel has been forced into doing, that they have never done before.
I expect the overall decision to come from a select few higherups, not from the numerous lower level employees they laid offOnly the detractors that always rake them over the coals regardless, would have tried to make it a big issue. The tech press would have approached it differently IMO. That would have helped control the narrative. Even keeping the 13th gen designation would have helped. They laid off over 10K in marketing and advertising; are the chickens coming home to roost?
There was no alder lake refreshSuppose we’ll see. If it remains on N3B there’s literally nothing to refresh for the lower core count SKUs. What’s going to be improved? The Skylake & Alder Lake refreshes were only possible because they controlled the node and even in those instances it didn’t really work.
Why would they purposely clock ARL-S less than is possible to make headroom available for a refresh when it’s already barely keeping its head above water in ST perf?
Yesn'tI surmised you would be overly argumentative for your own entertainment purposes. You do you bruh.
Jeezus christ, you want me to SS it? Is it so deep that you couldn't take my word on it?1. Since you failed to provide citation.
Errr?2. Are relying on hearsay as a debating tactic.
Hold up, I admitted I was wrong, and explained what I thought originally. You disagreed with that as well (by claiming ADL did not sell nearly as well, or wasn't received very well, bcuz of higher power consumption) and are now trying to say I'm moving goal posts? Blud, don't respond to that point at all if you want to say now I'm moving goal posts, not after you already started responding to the other point I was talking about...And 3. Employed the moving the goalpost fallacy
Can't wait for the readers polls to start.I as always, instead of fruitlessly debating ad nauseum, leave it to the reader to decide.
How generous of you.I yield the floor, you can have the last word.
... You mean exactly what I said here :BTW, here is their brief article about that TPU poll showing Intel getting merked in retail among their readers -
?The death knells in reviews aren't coming from the outright massive power consumption diff, but the fact that the 7800x3d is often beating the 14900k while consuming so much less power.
No one here is trying to put lipstick on this "pig" other than perhaps for the 14700k, which reviews were much more positive about. This is pretty much making mountains out of molehills.Those trying to put lipstick on this pig are wasting their time and energy IMhumbleO.
Literally all your other suggestions would have likely hurt Intel's street cred just as muchand it further hurts Intel's street cred with the DIY/retail crowd.
Just going to add this one time in support of Dapunisher.Yesn't
Jeezus christ, you want me to SS it? Is it so deep that you couldn't take my word on it?
View attachment 87490
View attachment 87491
Errr?
Hold up, I admitted I was wrong, and explained what I thought originally. You disagreed with that as well (by claiming ADL did not sell nearly as well, or wasn't received very well, bcuz of higher power consumption) and are now trying to say I'm moving goal posts? Blud, don't respond to that point at all if you want to say now I'm moving goal posts, not after you already started responding to the other point I was talking about...
Can't wait for the readers polls to start.
How generous of you.
... You mean exactly what I said here :
?
No one here is trying to put lipstick on this "pig" other than perhaps for the 14700k, which reviews were much more positive about. This is pretty much making mountains out of molehills.
Literally all your other suggestions would have likely hurt Intel's street cred just as much