Intel going after 2018 iPhone foundry deal

[jpiniero]

http://asia.nikkei.com/Business/AC/Intel-aims-to-challenge-TSMC-over-Apple-chip-orders-by-2018

Sounds like Intel is the main challenger to TSMC on the 2018 Ax contract. Be pretty sweet if that happened, Ax on Intel's 10 nm would be quite awesome really. Maybe too awesome...

Article says Apple contributed $4B revenue to TSMC in 2015 so it's not like it's a small deal.

 

[VirtualLarry]

If you can't beat em, join em?

 

[FIVR]

This will settle who truly has the best process. Apple have always shown themselves willing to pays for the best, and won't forget to charge for it when the final product arrives later. If intel's "process advantage" exists, it will be in the 2018 iPhone. For the first time ever.

 

[Madpacket]

This makes sense after hearing about the ARM/Intel joint development thingy. Interesting. Intel could use a boost like this.

 

[Elixer]

This will settle who truly has the best process. Apple have always shown themselves willing to pays for the best, and won't forget to charge for it when the final product arrives later. If intel's "process advantage" exists, it will be in the 2018 iPhone. For the first time ever.

No, Apple goes to those who can offer it the biggest deal.
They really don't care who is best. Look at how hard they are trying to squeeze their suppliers, and now, the suppliers are fighting back.

 

[Sheep221]

This will settle who truly has the best process. Apple have always shown themselves willing to pays for the best, and won't forget to charge for it when the final product arrives later. If intel's "process advantage" exists, it will be in the 2018 iPhone. For the first time ever.

Sorry this is not true even remotely, apple buys everything very cheap and sells as very expensive. You are always getting less for your money when you go with apple and no amount of digital lifestyle brainwashing will change that. I mean where people even learn that stuff? Last time Apple was technologically superior was in 1984 with their Mac and even that was built using foreign technology not patent protected at the time.

 

[daxzy]

I sense fanboism on both sides of the isle.

Apple looks for the best product per value. Obviously they aren't going to shell out 50% more money for a measly 10% energy efficiency bonus or something on a similar vein. To say Apple just gets the cheapest crap is just misleading. Last I checked, for phones, their individual components compare to high end Android devices.

 

[Nothingness]

Sorry this is not true even remotely, apple buys everything very cheap and sells as very expensive. You are always getting less for your money when you go with apple and no amount of digital lifestyle brainwashing will change that. I mean where people even learn that stuff? Last time Apple was technologically superior was in 1984 with their Mac and even that was built using foreign technology not patent protected at the time.

I disagree: Apple CPU is undeniably the best in its category.

 

[Spartak]

I disagree: Apple CPU is undeniably the best in its category.

It's the only thing left the iphone got going for it right now...

 

[ShintaiDK]

First Intel got modems, now they get chips. It wont be long before being a Intel custom foundry partner is a mandatory one to sell high end parts.

 

[VirtualLarry]

First Intel got modems

I thought that Intel was so horrible at modems, that they had to fab their 28nm one at TSMC, and they never really figured out how to integrate the analog parts of the modems into their 14nm process. I mean, they cancelled Sophia because of that, didn't they? Because they failed at modems?

 

[ShintaiDK]

I thought that Intel was so horrible at modems, that they had to fab their 28nm one at TSMC, and they never really figured out how to integrate the analog parts of the modems into their 14nm process. I mean, they cancelled Sophia because of that, didn't they? Because they failed at modems?

Sofia was everything about cost.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-chip-order-from-apple-first-major-mobile-win
http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/07/11/intel-could-see-15b-boost-from-apple-iphone-7-modem-orders

the modem in question is the XMM 7360

 

[kpkp]

It wouldn't make more sense for them to reenter the ARM market and directly compete with Qualcomm, the margins would be better? Maybe this is just the first step of that process?

 

[ninaholic37]

This will settle who truly has the best process. Apple have always shown themselves willing to pays for the best, and won't forget to charge for it when the final product arrives later. If intel's "process advantage" exists, it will be in the 2018 iPhone. For the first time ever.

And this is why they outsource their manufacturing to China - lol.

 

[witeken]

I thought that Intel was so horrible at modems, that they had to fab their 28nm one at TSMC, and they never really figured out how to integrate the analog parts of the modems into their 14nm process. I mean, they cancelled Sophia because of that, didn't they? Because they failed at modems?

BS. Intel has a decent modem business and a great 14nm process. However, Intel knows that it won't be a big player at 4G, so they're focused on 5G. They will go to their own fabs when it makes sense.

 

[ShintaiDK]

It wouldn't make more sense for them to reenter the ARM market and directly compete with Qualcomm, the margins would be better? Maybe this is just the first step of that process?

Qualcomms SoC business is in huge trouble as an example. And why compete with companies willing to take a loss on the SoC if they can sell a better device. Foundry is where the money is, unless you sell the complete device and earn the big bucks. Not to mention the complete lack of loyalty in those devices. They all change over night of something better comes along. But they all need a foundry no matter what.

 

[ShintaiDK]

And this is why they outsource their manufacturing to China - lol.

That is the best in the world in those volumes. Where else had you imagined it to be? USA? Europe? Japan? Ye, funny one.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Last I checked, for phones, their individual components compare to high end Android devices.

Nope. The SoC and storage capability is better in an iPhone, but the screen quality, amount of RAM, form factor and camera quality lags even cheaper Android devices (especially the screens).

 

[NTMBK]

First Intel got modems, now they get chips. It wont be long before being a Intel custom foundry partner is a mandatory one to sell high end parts.

Has an Intel modem actually made it into a single iPhone yet? Isn't that more about getting increased leverage over Qualcomm?

 

[kpkp]

Qualcomms SoC business is in huge trouble as an example. And why compete with companies willing to take a loss on the SoC if they can sell a better device. Foundry is where the money is, unless you sell the complete device and earn the big bucks. Not to mention the complete lack of loyalty in those devices. They all change over night of something better comes along. But they all need a foundry no matter what.

Of course Qualcomm is doing worse then a few years back, as they should, it perfectly mirrors their products. By making their own SoC (it could even be with ARM cores since they are arguably the best at the moment) Intel would make sure the foundry has business, they would sell their own modems... A SoC like the Kirin 955 with Intel modem and build in Intel foundry would easily compete for the flagships.

But if the argument is that foundry makes money and chips don't, then they should start manufacturing AMD and Nvidia too

 

[HiroThreading]

Great news for Intel, I'm sure.

I wonder if Apple will split the construction of the A11 (?) between Intel and TSMC like they do now between Samsung and TSMC.

No, Apple goes to those who can offer it the biggest deal.
They really don't care who is best. Look at how hard they are trying to squeeze their suppliers, and now, the suppliers are fighting back.

Not for its SoCs and camera lenses.

The other parts -- which are basically commodities -- yea sure.

Nope. The SoC and storage capability is better in an iPhone, but the screen quality, amount of RAM, form factor and camera quality lags even cheaper Android devices (especially the screens).

Screen quality: The iPhone 6s is about to be replaced, yet it still has one of the best displays on the market. I'll also take it any day over Samsung's AMOLED displays. Furthermore, I find the pursuit of putting 2560x1440 screens into 5" devices to be a good definition of stupidity.

RAM: iOS is aggressive in its RAM compression, so the A9's 2GB allocation is fine. I think the better question would be: why does Android (especially with TouchWiz) continue to lag and stutter when it has twice the RAM as iOS?

Form factor: Subjective.

Camera quality: Again, the 6s is about to be replaced. Upon its release, it had perhaps the best camera in its class -- only rivalled, and slightly bested, by the Galaxy S7. The iPhone 6s Plus with OIS is still remains as one of the best equipped smartphones when it comes to shooting photos and video.

 

[Ajay]

The last time Apple an Intel had talks, they fell apart over price. There would have to be a compelling reason for Apple to use Intel. Perhaps Intel has finally come up with a deal that offers Apple sufficient advantages to win them over? Or, they could be taking risk on prices hoping to win over Apple with the quality of their operation and vendor support. Interesting times.

 

[jpiniero]

The last time Apple an Intel had talks, they fell apart over price. There would have to be a compelling reason for Apple to use Intel. Perhaps Intel has finally come up with a deal that offers Apple sufficient advantages to win them over? Or, they could be taking risk on prices hoping to win over Apple with the quality of their operation and vendor support. Interesting times.

I think the issue was more that Intel wanted Apple to switch iPad to x86 as part of the deal, and Apple obviously said no.

 

[Roland00Address]

Has an Intel modem actually made it into a single iPhone yet? Isn't that more about getting increased leverage over Qualcomm?

Starting in the next month or so we will be seeing intel in the upcoming iphone 7. Now CDMA based networks (verizon, sprint) will still be using qualcomm due to all these patents that qualcomm has involving CDMA (Qualcomm was the developer / originator for almost everything related to CDMA). Now how much of these GSM / LTE base iphone market will Intel get is uncertain, for we do not know if Apple will use some Qualcomm at the same time for these GSM / LTE based market or if Intel will get all of this market.

Pretty much Apple has kept its options open by design for having more flexibility will prevent shortages but also give you more leverage when negotiating prices with intel and qualcomm.

 

[Sheep221]

I disagree: Apple CPU is undeniably the best in its category.

Well ofc they are better than unbranded chinese crap but still, the recent bending issues of iphones are serious quality problem for any $30 phone let alone the one sold for $650. As I said they are not bad per se, but Apple does rip off anyone of money it's basic fact. If they are selling Mac pro for $4000 with 6 core Xeon and 16 gigs of RAM, which is cost of 2 standalone rigs from other manufacturers with 8-10 core CPU and over 32 gigs of RAM I don't see why anyone would opt for Apple's offering in technical sense.