Intel NUC 4" x 4" micro-PC - $299 shipped (1.8ghz i3, motherboard, case, PSU)

[Kaido]

i3

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-D34010WY...ds=haswell+nuc

and i5 nuc

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-D54250WY...=IGXJGRJD25RCW

now in stock directly from amazon (although VERY limited supply).

Still going to wait for the i5 to drop to its actual MSRP (360ish)

Nice! Provided I get the i5 Haswell NUC in this week, I'll give it a review. It's getting a 480gb SSD & 16GB RAM, so it should be a pretty nice rig! I hope the HD5000 works out for my application so that I can dump my old Dells, haha!

 

[Pheran]

8GB RAM (single stick)

Why would you use a single stick? I'm assuming these are dual channel, in which case that will kill the memory bandwidth.

 

[Kaido]

Why would you use a single stick? I'm assuming these are dual channel, in which case that will kill the memory bandwidth.

If you're doing a basic build (i.e. for your wife), you can save $80 on the budget by not upgrading to the full 16gb, which may never be used to that capacity in daily use. 8GB + SSD is a pretty nice combination for speed & usability (if virtual memory is used, the SSD is a pretty snappy rollover unit). Plus, by going with a single 8gb stick, you can upgrade it later to 16gb as budget allows, so in a few years if you want to keep it relevant, you're not stuck with having to buy a full kit because you purchased 2x4GB for 8GB initially.

In addition, there is nearly zero performance difference in using a single stick vs. dual channel. If you're really into performance, it adds 1 or 2 FPS at most, but if you're buying a NUC, you're obviously not using it for high-end gaming because it only has integrated graphics, so the point is fairly moot. A small test for fun reading:

http://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/1fcs77/discussion_ram_single_vs_dual_channel_speed/

 

[Kaido]

i3

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-D34010WY...ds=haswell+nuc

and i5 nuc

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-D54250WY...=IGXJGRJD25RCW

now in stock directly from amazon (although VERY limited supply).

Still going to wait for the i5 to drop to its actual MSRP (360ish)

The i5 was showing $399 yesterday and is out of stock today, but the price has dropped to $382.99 shipped if you order anyway:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F3F38O2

The i3 is $299 shipped and is ready for delivery today. Very nice!

 

[Pheran]

In addition, there is nearly zero performance difference in using a single stick vs. dual channel. If you're really into performance, it adds 1 or 2 FPS at most, but if you're buying a NUC, you're obviously not using it for high-end gaming because it only has integrated graphics, so the point is fairly moot. A small test for fun reading:

http://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/1fcs77/discussion_ram_single_vs_dual_channel_speed/

Interesting, but I'm a bit concerned that the article you linked to is about a PC using a dedicated GPU. The NUC has to use this memory for its GPU as well, so I wonder if the bandwidth makes more difference in that scenario. For HTPC use, I can't see needing more than 8G anyway, so I'm just planning to get 2x4G.

 

[Kaido]

Interesting, but I'm a bit concerned that the article you linked to is about a PC using a dedicated GPU. The NUC has to use this memory for its GPU as well, so I wonder if the bandwidth makes more difference in that scenario. For HTPC use, I can't see needing more than 8G anyway, so I'm just planning to get 2x4G.

It'd be worth a test. I have a ton of memory lying around here if you want a specific benchmark run on single vs. dual-channel.

The nice thing though is that for $160 you can completely max out the NUC and never have to worry about upgrading again

 

[jaydee]

It'd be worth a test. I have a ton of memory lying around here if you want a specific benchmark run on single vs. dual-channel.

The nice thing though is that for $160 you can completely max out the NUC and never have to worry about upgrading again

I would be interested in x264 encoding benchmarks with single channel vs dual channel memory (using the IGP).

 

[RossMAN]

Right now, I would go with either an i5/i7 Haswell Brix, or the i5 Haswell NUC from Intel. 240gb SSD + 8GB RAM (single stick) + Windows 7. The Logitech MK320 is a great wireless keyboard & mouse combo (on sale for $29 periodically).

Thanks for the wealth of information including links, a few questions:

What are the primary differences and pros/cons between the Gigabyte Brix and Intel NUC? Since I'm a relative n00b to building systems I'm looking for easiest to work with. I also appreciate more versatility, even if that means I have to get my hands dirty and learn a few things.

Let's assume both Brix and NUC i5's are the same price at $399 each, which would you buy and why? Which is more powerful and more versatile?

If you need Wifi, this works on Windows 7 according to the Amazon notes:

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-6235AN-H.../dp/B007QXLIWI

I'm glad you mentioned the Wifi/BT adapter because I'd like at least:

1) best chipset
2) BT 4.0
3) whichever offers 802.11ac

I'm undecided between Windows 7 or 8, most likely I'll stick with 7 but I'd like a wireless card that works with both. What do you think of the Intel 6235 vs Intel 7260? Would both work in the Brix and NUC?

You will need Mini-HDMI to HDMI cable:

http://www.amazon.com/MarginMart-Inc...dp/B00104XCVO/

I'm going to combine monitor, video cables and sound into a single quote. She's currently using my Dell 2005FPW with soundbar and seems happy with it, heck I like it and want to reclaim it but that's another story. The soundbar is a pathetic 2w but it's only used for basic flash games and Youtube videos, nothing near audiophile territory.

VGA, DVI-D, S-Video, and RCA/Composite inputs

Is there a mini-HDMI to DVI cable that you would recommend? Amazon Prime preferred.

Seagate has a 4TB USB 3.0 external drive on sale for $149 if you need more storage:

http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Expans...dp/B00BFFQN3M/

Storage will be important because all our tens of thousands pictures are stored on her current and 2 former PC's, one of these days I'd like to reconcile them all onto a single hard drive (which will be backed up, of course). For the sake of reliability with important data you can never replace, is that the brand/model to go with? 98% of the the time the primary SSD with OS will be used, mostly basic MS Office stuff and that's it.

I recommend Genie9 for incremental local backup (free version available) and Macrium Reflect for image clones of the main drive. For cloud backup, I like Backblaze for $5 a month: (unlimited)

http://www.backblaze.com/

Thanks for the Genie/Macrium recommendation. As for online backup we plan on going with CrashPlan + hopefully they'll have another BF sale, I guess we'll find out in 2.5 weeks.

I mean, if you don't need to crunch with a quad-core and you don't need to game with a dedicated GPU, these are hard to beat for a desktop replacement. Fast, quiet, small, not horrifically expensive. Plus very very cool

We definitely don't need that kind of horsepower but I'd like to make this computer relatively quick, powerful and semi-future proof, so I'm looking for the Honda Civic LX of the small desktop world

If anyone else has suggestions, please feel free to chime in.

 

[Kaido]

Let's assume both Brix and NUC i5's are the same price at $399 each, which would you buy and why? Which is more powerful and more versatile?

Gigabyte has an i7 model (Intel is i3 or i5). Intel has an HD5000 model (Gigabyte only goes up to HD4400). So depends if you want a faster CPU or a faster GPU. Also, Gigabyte comes with a Wifi card, although I don't think it's the one you're looking for. The 7260 (dual-band 802.11ac + Bluetooth) is now supported under both Windows 7 and Windows 8, so you have your choice of operating systems. Here is the driver for Windows 7:

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=23329&lang=eng

As far as the monitor goes, DVI does not carry audio, so you'd need a separate sound solution. There is one analog audio port on the front, which means you'd either have to snake a 1/8" analog audio cable to the front of the NUC (not a big deal, depending on where you place it) or get an analog USB sound card for the rear to hide the wiring. I prefer USB to Analog for analog stereo because it's a digital interface that doesn't pickup internal computer noise (not a big deal on all systems), but the adapter is only $9:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16812186035

A quick search doesn't show any Mini-HDMI to DVI cables on Amazon, so you'd probably need to buy an adapter and then use a regular DVI cable. Alternatively, you could use a Mini-Displayport to DVI adapter: (do some research to make sure these work okay)

http://www.amazon.com/BlueRigger-Dis...dp/B007KB3VIU/

As far as storage goes, I've had really good luck with Toshiba's 2.5" bus-powered drives. They have the 2TB model on sale for $99, I have a ton of them at work: (the WD Passports have failed too many times no me)

http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-Canvio.../dp/B00ARJD56K

 

[jaydee]

Thanks for the wealth of information including links, a few questions:

What are the primary differences and pros/cons between the Gigabyte Brix and Intel NUC? Since I'm a relative n00b to building systems I'm looking for easiest to work with. I also appreciate more versatility, even if that means I have to get my hands dirty and learn a few things.

Let's assume both Brix and NUC i5's are the same price at $399 each, which would you buy and why? Which is more powerful and more versatile?
.
.
.

If anyone else has suggestions, please feel free to chime in.

Almost no difference. The Brix comes with a wifi/BT card, the NUC, you'll have to buy your own (~$30). The NUC has an IR port, the Brix does not. There's a slight variation in the dimensions, but really that's all there is different. If you NEED the IR port, get the NUC. If not, I'd shop based on price (taking into consideration, the Brix has a $30 wifi/BT card already). They have the same CPU choices for the i3 model (i3-4010U), and for i5, the NUC has i5-4250U and the Brix has i5-4200U. Only difference is the GPU is a little beefier in the NUC, but there's debate if the difference is decernable given the same TDP limit of 15W. Actually the base clock is higher in the 4200U, but they have the same turbo max clock, so probably no real difference there.

If you hang on another month or so, there's rumored to be a slightly taller, 2.5" HD capable Brix coming real soon, no doubt at a slightly higher price.

 

[RossMAN]

If you hang on another month or so, there's rumored to be a slightly taller, 2.5" HD capable Brix coming real soon, no doubt at a slightly higher price.

Thanks, I might wait and monitor Brix/NUC prices in the mean time.

 

[Kaido]

Thanks, I might wait and monitor Brix/NUC prices in the mean time.

1TB 2.5" drives are like $99 these days, so you can pack a lot of storage into a NUC if you wait for that taller one. You can also get a 960GB SSD for under $550 these days, so if you need a decent size plus crazy-fast speeds, it's available!

 

[jaydee]

I'm hoping to see some reviews comparing the i3-4250U and i5-4010U along with laptop benchmarks of the standard voltage i3 and i5 parts. Mostly interested in x264 handbrake encodes and 3D rendering.

 

[you2]

Does the brix use a different motherboard (and therefore have different feature set/relibability/performance) than the intel version s?

 

[finbarqs]

let me know how the transcoding is for plex! That's what it's gonna be: a plex transcoding machine!!! Kind of expensive, but I think worth it in the end if it does it's job: low powered (less than a light bulb!) but yet powerful to do 1080p @ 5.1 streams!!!

 

[Kaido]

Does the brix use a different motherboard (and therefore have different feature set/relibability/performance) than the intel version s?

I believe the NUC is a reference design, so I would imagine that Gigabyte builds their own boards. For example, the Haswell NUC from Intel has a Mini-HDMI port, whereas the Haswell NUC from Gigabyte has a full-sized HDMI port. I'm not sure if they just attach their own connectors & case to the Intel board or if they manufacture the board themselves and slap the CPU on.

 

[Kaido]

let me know how the transcoding is for plex! That's what it's gonna be: a plex transcoding machine!!! Kind of expensive, but I think worth it in the end if it does it's job: low powered (less than a light bulb!) but yet powerful to do 1080p @ 5.1 streams!!!

I'll give it a shot as soon as it arrives!

Also, now that the 802.11ac chip has Win7 drivers, I'm going with that instead, so I'll give it a try and make sure it's kosher IRL.

 

[Kaido]

Somewhat big news - Gigabyte has announced an AMD-based BRIX:

http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4748

It uses the AMD Richland Processor A8-5545M @ 1.7ghz to 2.7ghz. It is a quad-core. It also has Radeon HD 8510G graphics (AMD's version of an integrated GPU). I don't see an ETA or price yet.

 

[RossMAN]

Somewhat big news - Gigabyte has announced an AMD-based BRIX:

http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4748

It uses the AMD Richland Processor A8-5545M @ 1.7ghz to 2.7ghz. It is a quad-core. It also has Radeon HD 8510G graphics (AMD's version of an integrated GPU). I don't see an ETA or price yet.

Stupid question I noticed the VESA mount, how do you power on/off the computer without reaching behind the monitor every time?

 

[EliteRetard]

Stupid question I noticed the VESA mount, how do you power on/off the computer without reaching behind the monitor every time?

Power on USB/modem/other

 

[Pheran]

Stupid question I noticed the VESA mount, how do you power on/off the computer without reaching behind the monitor every time?

I don't know why you'd ever power off a computer that is this low power in the first place, just let it go to sleep mode and power up with a mouse click.

 

[RossMAN]

I don't know why you'd ever power off a computer that is this low power in the first place, just let it go to sleep mode and power up with a mouse click.

Good point and that's probably something we'd consider, low power + SSD =

 

[Kaido]

Available NUC models: (16 models available)

Intel: (6 models available)

Ivy Bridge: (4 models available)
1.1ghz Celeron (gray top) link
1.8ghz Core i3 (black top) link
1.8ghz Core i3 Thunderbolt (red top) link
1.8ghz Core i5 (black top) link

Haswell: (2 models available)
1.7ghz Core i3 (silver with black top) link
1.3ghz Core i5 (silver with black top) link

Gigabyte: Product Line List (all are black, except the Haswell model with the built-in projector, which is silver on the bottom & black on top) (10 models available)

Ivy Bridge: Press Release (4 models available)
1.8ghz Celeron link
1.8ghz Core i3 link
1.8ghz Core i5 link
2.0ghz Core i7 link

Haswell: Press release & Product Line Overview (5 models available)
1.4ghz Celeron link
1.7ghz Core i3 link
1.7ghz Core i3 with built-in Projector link
1.6ghz Core i5 link
1.8ghz Core i7 link

AMD: (1 model available)
1.7ghz AMD Richland link

Upcoming Models:
Intel NUC with 2.5" hard drive (estimated December 2013 release date) link
Gigabyte Brix II gaming NUC with Iris Pro graphics & 2.5" hard drive (estimated $499 - $599 barebones price) link

 

[Kaido]

Verge has an article about the Brix II: (low-end gaming model)

http://www.theverge.com/2013/9/11/4...-gaming-pc-is-smaller-than-an-xbox-controller

Gigabyte has a few different color choices available as well, apparently:

http://www.eteknix.com/gigabyte-unveils-iris-pro-5200-graphics-enabled-brix/

Tom's Hardware says that it may be released in December with the Iris Pro 5200 graphics and your choice of either 2.7ghz i5, 3.0ghz i5, or 3.2ghz i7, possibly with a desktop-grade CPU:

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/gigabyte-brix-pc-gaming-iris-pro-5200-haswell,24246.html

I'd imagine that the Intel 2.5" model will also have Iris Pro graphics, unless they decide to keep their 2.5" model as a "desktop" model with the old HD graphics and let Gigabyte making the "gaming" version. That might happen because the Intel Haswell NUC's do have the SATA connector & power for a standard hard drive (although the power may only be for a 2.5", not 3.5" drive), so it would be cheaper just to use the existing HD4400/HD5000 boards in a larger enclosure. As far as the graphics go, the Iris Pro is Intel's new integrated graphics solution and will offer a 2 to 3 times performance improvement over their last-gen Intel HD Graphics system:

http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/1/42...ntegrated-graphics-offer-double-or-triple-the

Intel has said the Iris Pro is the equivalent of a low to mid-range graphics cards, such as the GeForce GT 650M. Anandtech has a review of the Iris Pro 5200:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/

The new Mac laptops already have the Iris Pro graphics, with very nice results:

http://www.macworld.com/article/205...-boost-to-new-13-inch-retina-macbook-pro.html

More details at Notebook check, which says "the average performance of the Iris Pro is only about 15 percent behind the dedicated mid-range cards GeForce GT 650M and GT 750M". It also says that the "Iris Pro can be found on certain quad-core Haswell CPUs in the 47 Watt TDP range", although there is a 5100 & 5200 version available:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Iris-Pro-Graphics-5200.90965.0.html

Gizmodo has a bit more of a discussion on it:

http://gizmodo.com/intel-iris-integrated-graphics-are-finally-awesome-486483980

So this is pretty interesting...it will definitely open up the way for a basic Steam gaming box for your living room, without having to have a large desktop computer or special HTPC enclosure - just a tiny little Gamecube-sized box. I was also recently introduced to Pokki, which is a similar idea to Steam, but the concept is to take fun mobile apps (especially light gaming stuff like Angry Birds & Cut the Rope) & put it on the desktop. So basically "apps for the desktop". Throw in an Xbox 360 wireless controller or two and you've got a great kid's gaming/lighting gaming/party gaming system in addition to HTPC stuff like Plex:

http://www.pokki.com/

 

[Kaido]

let me know how the transcoding is for plex! That's what it's gonna be: a plex transcoding machine!!! Kind of expensive, but I think worth it in the end if it does it's job: low powered (less than a light bulb!) but yet powerful to do 1080p @ 5.1 streams!!!

Delivery date pushed out to the 19th. They obviously did not have them in stock