Intel Skylake / Kaby Lake

[Burpo]

At stock.. I7 6700K vs I5 6400, Witcher III..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JN1xhE2XZfk

Try that with an I3..

 

[FlanK3r]

Sorry, if already posted:
SKL breaks 7GHz at 4V:
http://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/Extreme-Overclocking-Skylake-702566-GHz

This got John Lam, maybe month ago what I know (I saw it at wall of FB amd its also at hwbot.org)
Only voltage is not correct, its bug of CPUZ Ussually for these clock you need around 1.85-1.95V.

 

[Aikouka]

At stock.. I7 6700K vs I5 6400, Witcher III..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JN1xhE2XZfk

Try that with an I3..

Hm... what I find interesting is that the i5 is pretty much in parity with the i7, but the difference is that any background activity (programs running) may hamper the i5 performance. I've debated updating to Skylake a few times, and I figured I'd just get an i5, but that makes me wonder whether I should get an i7. It'd be interesting to see what differences I'd see in "normal use" with all of my programs running in the background.

Although, the i7 is way overpriced right now, so there's no way I'm paying $350-400 for a chip that should be $300-330 based upon previous generation pricing. To note, the box price on Intel's Ark is no different between the 4770k and the 6700k.

 

[sze5003]

Hm... what I find interesting is that the i5 is pretty much in parity with the i7, but the difference is that any background activity (programs running) may hamper the i5 performance. I've debated updating to Skylake a few times, and I figured I'd just get an i5, but that makes me wonder whether I should get an i7. It'd be interesting to see what differences I'd see in "normal use" with all of my programs running in the background.

Although, the i7 is way overpriced right now, so there's no way I'm paying $350-400 for a chip that should be $300-330 based upon previous generation pricing. To note, the box price on Intel's Ark is no different between the 4770k and the 6700k.

When I was going to do a rebuild of my desktop I thought about this too. Instead I ended up getting a xps 15 laptop with the i7 6700hq. I was debating between the i5 or i7 and figured if I'm going to be running VM or doing android builds, the i7 is going to benefit me more.

Guess I'll upgrade my desktop later. So far it's been running great even though I don't do as much gaming on it anymore.

 

[Dresdenboy]

This got John Lam, maybe month ago what I know (I saw it at wall of FB amd its also at hwbot.org)
Only voltage is not correct, its bug of CPUZ Ussually for these clock you need around 1.85-1.95V.

I thought so, also asked F. Piednoel about the voltage (just got no answer yet).

Hm... what I find interesting is that the i5 is pretty much in parity with the i7, but the difference is that any background activity (programs running) may hamper the i5 performance. I've debated updating to Skylake a few times, and I figured I'd just get an i5, but that makes me wonder whether I should get an i7. It'd be interesting to see what differences I'd see in "normal use" with all of my programs running in the background.

The Witcher could have a very efficient compute job management, as it also has to run smooth on 8x 1.6 GHz 2-wide CPUs.

I'm not aware of such multitasking tests, but here is one:
http://www.pcgameshardware.de/CPU-Hardware-154106/Specials/CPU-Multitasking-Test-1075340/
The first diagram contains results of both an i7 (with SMT off and on) and a i5. Ivy Bridge still, but this should be fine for this analysis. You can switch between Crysis 3 and Skyrim. So as long as there don't run any compute heavy background tasks, there was not much of a difference with SMT in these tests.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Hm... what I find interesting is that the i5 is pretty much in parity with the i7, but the difference is that any background activity (programs running) may hamper the i5 performance. I've debated updating to Skylake a few times, and I figured I'd just get an i5, but that makes me wonder whether I should get an i7. It'd be interesting to see what differences I'd see in "normal use" with all of my programs running in the background.

Although, the i7 is way overpriced right now, so there's no way I'm paying $350-400 for a chip that should be $300-330 based upon previous generation pricing. To note, the box price on Intel's Ark is no different between the 4770k and the 6700k.

Could be that the gpu is limiting. It is only a 970. I dont know how much difference hyperthreading makes, but since the clockspeed is quite a bit lower on the i5, I would expect more difference, unless it is gpu limited.

Edit: Dont want to get this argument started again, but I am of the old school that believes in turning off background tasks if running a demanding program. I just cant imagine why one would want to run other cpu demanding tasks when playing a game like W3.

 

[LTC8K6]

Hm... what I find interesting is that the i5 is pretty much in parity with the i7, but the difference is that any background activity (programs running) may hamper the i5 performance. I've debated updating to Skylake a few times, and I figured I'd just get an i5, but that makes me wonder whether I should get an i7. It'd be interesting to see what differences I'd see in "normal use" with all of my programs running in the background.

Although, the i7 is way overpriced right now, so there's no way I'm paying $350-400 for a chip that should be $300-330 based upon previous generation pricing. To note, the box price on Intel's Ark is no different between the 4770k and the 6700k.

Something like a 1231-V3 is much cheaper for Haswell 4C/8T duty, or a 1230-V5 or 1240-V5 for Skylake 4C/8T duty...most of the performance for a lot less money.

Not sure why the Skylake Xeons are 80w vs 65W, though?

 

[Sweepr]

- Second Skylake-U GT3e design win comes from NEC.

- Not exactly Skylake but still a great deal:

VAIO Z Canvas Signature Edition 2 in 1 PC, 256GB SSD
$997.00 (was $2,199.00) - save $1,202.00
12.3-inch WQXGA+ 2560 x 1704 IPS touchscreen
Intel Core i7-4770HQ
8GB memory/256GB SSD
Windows 10 Pro

www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/...)(2459594)(TnL5HPStwNw-x7rxUO9ZJ5dK5.UiDe95GA

Very inovative device - 4C/8T Haswell GT3e (Iris Pro 5200) inside a 12.3'' convertible, for less $ than a 128GB Surface Pro 4 (Core m3) + Type Cover. Now we need an updated Iris Pro 580 model.

 

[FlanK3r]

Dresdenboy:

There he wrote about VID chip, but its 100% clear the voltage cant be higher than 2V. More means big risk of damage. I killed FX chip with high voltage with LN2 (2.1V in 1M Superpi)

 

[Sweepr]

- Apparently there is a microcode update that prevents BCLK overclocking, but it's up to Intel partners to incorporate it in their motherboard BIOSes or not?

”Intel regularly issues updates for our processors which our partners voluntarily incorporate into their BIOS,” an Intel spokesman said. “The latest update provided to partners includes, among other things, code that aligns with the position that we do not recommend overclocking processors that have not been designed to do so. Additionally, Intel does not warranty the operation of the processor beyond its specifications.”

Intel’s microcode update apparently hasn’t been issued yet, but it’ll likely be given out to motherboard vendors who will integrate the update into BIOS updates. That probably means those who are using the exploit now could keep rolling it—if they never update the BIOS.

www.pcworld.com/article/3031255/har...ocking-party-by-closing-skylake-loophole.html

If you want Skylake BCLK overclocking, better not update your BIOS. BTW don't ASRock MBs feature Dual BIOS?


- $100 off all Surface Pro 4 models @ Microsoft Store.

www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/en_US/pdp/Surface-Pro-4/productID.325711500

 

[nvgpu]

Intel will include the latest microcode update with the latest production batches of Skylake to fix the Skylake complex workload bug & to stop overclocking of non-K SKUs, in the end there's no difference, you won't be able to overclock either even if you don't update your UEFI BIOS.

 

[nvgpu]

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/do...a-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-7-8-1-10-15-40-

Latest Intel 20.19.15.4380 beta driver.

 

[Dufus]

- Apparently there is a microcode update that prevents BCLK overclocking, but it's up to Intel partners to incorporate it in their motherboard BIOSes or not?

I thought crashtech had already succumbed to this with microcode ver 0x76 and once done rolling back didn't help?

Be aware Windows is a vector for microcode updates and with W10's forced updates it would be a fairly easy path for Intel to take.

Very inovative device - 4C/8T Haswell GT3e (Iris Pro 5200) inside a 12.3'' convertible

The mind boggles.

 

[Phynaz]

I didn't think Intel would lock this down. Do people still remark CPUs?

 

[VirtualLarry]

I didn't think Intel would lock this down. Do people still remark CPUs?

Happens all the time on ebay, generally ES chips get marked with production code numbers.

But I don't think the CPUID string can be faked.

 

[skipsneeky2]

Any good benchmark comparisons between the G1820,G3258 and the G4400 in lightweight gaming?WOT benches if possible?

The guy i mentioned i was configuring a build for may just have been optimistic about his budget,i know cause his wife went off on him when i talked to him on the phone about the $1,000 configuration i had for him lol.

I know the G1820 worked out quite well for my wifes build but it was extremely budget oriented.WOT gaming rig and Facebook it just excels with zero complaints so far with my ssd in there.

 

[Sweepr]

Eurogamer once again highlighting the importance of choosing the right memory kit for Skylake:

...In fact, we're currently running tests on just how far the classic Core i5 2500K can be pushed and how competitive it is with modern processors five years after its release - and let's just say that our overclocked 4.44GHz Skylake i3 is worryingly close to besting the 2500K overclocked to 4.6GHz, even when the older chip is combined with the fastest memory we could give it.

...So is there a way around Intel's lockdown on overclocked non-K chips? Well, conceivably, you could buy the required Z170 motherboard now, install the current BIOS update and leave it like that - Intel or the board manufacturer cannot force you to update the BIOS. However, it is likely that new motherboard launches will come with the locked-down BIOS, and there will be no downgrade option. The only question mark now concerns what happens if you downgrade an overclock-compatible board back to the older BIOS. Does something of the update remain on the board or in the OS that keeps the lock in effect? We're talking to board specialists about this and will report back when we can.

As things stand, we always knew that the cheap overclocking party would come to an end at some point, but we should highlight is that Intel has always sanctioned memory overclocking on its top-tier chipsets. We have observed that all Intel chips produce higher in-game frame-rates when paired with faster RAM - indeed, our most recent tests have highlighted that you're holding back your overclock if you don't scale up memory frequency accordingly. The bottom line is this: while one overclocking vector is being shut down, it is still possible to get better performance from locked chips - and as you can see from the video below, a Core i3 6100 running at stock frequencies with relatively fast DDR4 but still match an older generation Core i5 quad running with base-level DDR3.

www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalf...-to-shut-down-locked-skylake-cpu-overclocking


Vaio Z (flip) available for pre-order (US)

An impeccable laptop for those who strive for innovative mastery and limitless mobility.

Windows 10 Pro
Microsoft Signature Edition
Luxury Performance & Mobility
13.3 inch WQHD 2560x1440 Touchscreen Display
Intel® Core™ i7 processor and Intel® Iris™ Graphics 550

http://us.vaio.com

Awesome showcase for 28W Skylake-U GT3e (Iris 550), too bad it's so expensive.

 

[VirtualLarry]

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/do...a-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-7-8-1-10-15-40-

Latest Intel 20.19.15.4380 beta driver.

Good news: Didn't BSOD on me, upon install or reboot. Bad news: Still doesn't re-sync HDMI audio when my 24" Westinghouse goes into sleep mode, and I move the mouse to wake it up.

Even turning the monitor off, then turning it back on, and changing the default audio device to SPDIF, then back to the HDMI, doesn't work.

The VU meter on the Playback Devices screen moves, as if the driver is working, but there's no sound from the monitor.

As always, my NV GT740 1GB GDDR5 card works flawlessly.

Edit: Honestly, it's this sort of thing that will absolutely hobble Intel's Skylake NUCs and 5x5 / "STX" platforms.
If they can't get their iGPU drivers correct, then those platforms are worthless, since they lack the possibility of adding an AMD / NV dGPU to them.

 

[ShintaiDK]

No issue with my NUC and Samsung TV

Also you forget the mobo.

 

[Aikouka]

Dont want to get this argument started again, but I am of the old school that believes in turning off background tasks if running a demanding program. I just cant imagine why one would want to run other cpu demanding tasks when playing a game like W3.

I agree with you. I don't usually keep incredibly taxing things running, but I do keep a lot of little things running in the background on my machine. It just worried me a bit when I saw that the i5-6600 sat there between 95-100% almost the entire time. I figured that anything eating into the processing time could reduce the framerate where the i7-6700 seemed to have plenty of leeway.

Part of the reason why I'm looking into this is encoding. I used to use QuickSync, but it was very buggy in Windows 10. If I tried to use QuickSync and play a game, it would BSOD about half the time. I tried a driver update, but that just made QuickSync disappear (note: I was using the multi-GPU option with a fake monitor). So, I switched to x264, which is rather slow (about 1.5 hours for a 2-pass encode), and it really hampers my ability to use the PC. I was considering using RipBot instead of Handbrake as RipBot has the ability to do distributed encoding. If I replaced my desktop, that would free up an i7-4770k and my Gaming HTPC is an i5-4650.

Something like a 1231-V3 is much cheaper for Haswell 4C/8T duty, or a 1230-V5 or 1240-V5 for Skylake 4C/8T duty...most of the performance for a lot less money.

Not sure why the Skylake Xeons are 80w vs 65W, though?

Hm, I took a look into those. The biggest issue seems to be the fact that Intel locked down Xeons so they no longer function on consumer chipsets, and there's really only one consumer C230 board from ASUS. It's actually not a bad board, but you can spend about $30 less on a similar Z170 board. It also looks like the 3.3GHz Xeon is a good option, but it is 700MHz slower than the i7-6700k.

All in all, I ended up getting in on two deals. B&H Photo had a deal where you paid full price for an i5-6600k (~$270) and you got a free motherboard (worth about $120) with it. Also, Amazon had the i7-6700k on sale yesterday for $365. It's not great, but it's far better than $400-410!

 

[LTC8K6]

Someone needs to experiment with a Xeon on a regular board. I suspect it won't recognize it, but can't find an example of someone trying it.

Asus' Xeon gaming board accepts the regular chips.

 

[mikk]

No issue with my NUC and Samsung TV

Also you forget the mobo.

Maybe his NV GT740 was active in system manager when he tried on iGPU. There may be some issues with Nvidia.

 

[crashtech]

I thought crashtech had already succumbed to this with microcode ver 0x76 and once done rolling back didn't help?

Some users just assume that if I could screw up by testing out the latest BIOS, that I somehow wouldn't know enough to flash it back to one I knew worked. Maybe I deserve that characterization, but for those who think better of me, I would caution against counting on BCLK OC for now. I got a good deal on an X99 system, selling off my Skylake stuff.

 

[ShintaiDK]

I thought crashtech had already succumbed to this with microcode ver 0x76 and once done rolling back didn't help?

It depends if he can roll back BIOS far enough for a new microcode.

Be aware Windows is a vector for microcode updates and with W10's forced updates it would be a fairly easy path for Intel to take.

Intel and AMD have nothing to say in this (unfortunately). Its MS that decides when and what microcode to provide. And trust me, they are very far behind with 1 year or more in average. Windows 10 microcode files are dated 30-10-2015 (1511 release). But the actual content is a lot older and dated 2014.

I never understood why MS wouldn't just update Intel and AMD microcode faster instead of people having to mainly rely on BIOS updates. Take the Skylake AVX2/FMA3 bug. I bet 95% of Skylake users are still having this bug due to missing BIOS update.

Microsoft isn't holding back on drivers for example.

 

[Aikouka]

Someone needs to experiment with a Xeon on a regular board. I suspect it won't recognize it, but can't find an example of someone trying it.

Asus' Xeon gaming board accepts the regular chips.

Honestly, I had no idea that Intel had locked it out until I read a review on Newegg where someone was complaining about it. In his case, he bought a normal Z170 board and a Xeon, but was unable to get them to work together. At that time, I don't think ASUS had their C230 board out, or it wasn't in the US yet, so he would've had to go with one of the server boards.