Intel Skylake / Kaby Lake

[witeken]

Finally I know where Intel's code names come from: Canada .

Playing around in Maps, there are plenty of lakes left. There's also a Tea Lake, of course. Also plenty of other animals (Giraffe, Camel).

https://www.google.nl/maps/place/Kaby+Lake/

https://www.google.nl/maps/place/Coffee+Lake/

 

[jpiniero]

You argument doesn't make sense because the GPU is from a different Gen. Also the manufacturing process is different. CPU should be different too. A different media engine is the least of the problem when the GPU core itself is different.

If I wasn't specific enough, It's seems pretty clear now that Intel's going to market the Kaby Refresh, Coffee Lake and Cannonlake all as 8th generation Core processors. The feature set, etc, pretty much need to be the same. Thus I don't think Cannonlake is Gen 10 IGP, it's 9.5.

 

[mikk]

Again, RTS is not official launch,

You have no clue. RTS is Intels term for a launch. It always was. Also for Kabylake.

 

[mikk]

If I wasn't specific enough, It's seems pretty clear now that Intel's going to market the Kaby Refresh, Coffee Lake and Cannonlake all as 8th generation Core processors. The feature set, etc, pretty much need to be the same. Thus I don't think Cannonlake is Gen 10 IGP, it's 9.5.

That means you are saying that Cannonlake will be build on 14nm and will also have Skylake cores rather than Cannonlake cores.....because Intel might call it 8th generation and need to be the same.


Are your really saying this?

 

[jpiniero]

That means you are saying that Cannonlake will be build on 14nm and will also have Skylake cores rather than Cannonlake cores.....because Intel might call it 8th generation and need to be the same.


Are your really saying this?

That's what it looks like now, yes. Well, on 10 nm.

 

[mikk]

That's what it looks like now, yes. Well, on 10 nm.

So you are saying Cannonlake is identical to Skylake?

 

[jpiniero]

So you are saying Cannonlake is identical to Skylake?

There might be some technical differences beyond the shrink (eg: the FIVR). But the core and featureset should pretty much otherwise be the same. That's what it seems like at least at the moment.

 

[mikk]

That's what it seems like at least at the moment.

To me it doesn't. CPU and GPU will be different.

 

[AtenRa]

You have no clue. RTS is Intels term for a launch. It always was. Also for Kabylake.

Im not talking about RTS launch, im talking official sales embargo lift dates (retail launch of the product, when we have the reviews and we can buy the actual product). Kabylake official sales embargo lift is Q1 2017 no matter if RTS is Q4 2016. Officially KBL Desktop havent been launched in the retail, sales embargo is not lifted yet, you cannot go to MicroCenter or any other big retailer and buy a KBL-S product in 2016 period.

 

[witeken]

Im not talking about RTS launch, im talking official sales embargo lift dates (retail launch of the product, when we have the reviews and we can buy the actual product). Kabylake official sales embargo lift is Q1 2017 no matter if RTS is Q4 2016. Officially KBL Desktop havent been launched in the retail, sales embargo is not lifted yet, you cannot go to MicroCenter or any other big retailer and buy a KBL-S product in 2016 period.

The RTS window runs until end of January, while KBL-S will launch at CES.

 

[Arachnotronic]

If I wasn't specific enough, It's seems pretty clear now that Intel's going to market the Kaby Refresh, Coffee Lake and Cannonlake all as 8th generation Core processors. The feature set, etc, pretty much need to be the same. Thus I don't think Cannonlake is Gen 10 IGP, it's 9.5.

Is it clear that CNL will be part of the 8th generation Core family? Benchlife says U KBL-R, CFL-U, CFL-H, CFL-S, and CFL-X will be the 8th gen Core.

 

[jpiniero]

Is it clear that CNL will be part of the 8th generation Core family? Benchlife says U KBL-R, CFL-U, CFL-H, CFL-S, and CFL-X will be the 8th gen Core.

What would they call it, 9th gen? You see what I mean.

 

[Dave2150]

What would they call it, 9th gen? You see what I mean.

They called Kabylake '7th' gen, despite no IPC increase (which we'd known about for months), so I expect they'll follow suit with subsequent steppings. Yawn!

 

[Arachnotronic]

They called Kabylake '7th' gen, despite no IPC increase (which we'd known about for months), so I expect they'll follow suit with subsequent steppings. Yawn!

If performance goes up, does it matter if it was attained through IPC or clock speed?

 

[Ajay]

If performance goes up, does it matter if it was attained through IPC or clock speed?

Not at all. Back in the glory days a 25% gain in clock speed was a perfectly nice bump in throughput

 

[Arachnotronic]

Not at all. Back in the glory days a 25% gain in clock speed was a perfectly nice bump in throughput

I agree with the sentiment that Intel should have been more aggressive in landing new architectures onto Kaby Lake and Coffee Lake, new process + new arch would be a more compelling improvement than just new process. I think Intel didn't plan on 10nm ending up as it did, and so they're just doing the best they can with the time they have.

Hopefully they are more prepared during the 10nm generation.

 

[frozentundra123456]

If performance goes up, does it matter if it was attained through IPC or clock speed?

Yea, cant believe some of the stuff being posted about this. It is like clockspeed suddenly doesnt matter somehow, and the only improvement that counts is IPC. Of course, it would be nice to see both clockspeed and IPC improvements, but "it is what it is".

KL is actually quite an improvement in mobile, similar to what we have seen with conventional tic/tock generations. That said, Intel sure does seem to be struggling since 14nm.

 

[witeken]

Kaby Lake Systems With Intel Optane SSDs Coming Soon

Lenovo's announcement today of a new generation of ThinkPads based on Intel's Kaby Lake platform includes brief but tantalizing mention of Optane, Intel's brand for devices using the 3D XPoint non-volatile memory technology they co-developed with Micron. Lenovo's new ThinkPads and competing high-end Kaby Lake systems will likely be the first appearance of 3D XPoint memory in the consumer PC market.

Several of Lenovo's newly announced ThinkPads will offer 16GB Optane SSDs in M.2 2242 form factor paired with hard drives as an alternative to a using a single NVMe SSD with NAND flash memory (usually TLC NAND, with a portion used as SLC cache). The new Intel Optane devices mentioned by Lenovo are most likely the codenamed Stony Beach NVMe PCIe 3 x2 drives that were featured in roadmap leaked back in July. More recent leaks have indicated that these will be branded as the Intel Optane Memory 8000p series, with a 32GB capacity in addition to the 16GB Lenovo will be using. Since Intel's 3D XPoint memory is being manufactured as a two-layer 128Gb (16GB) die, these Optane products will require just one or two dies and will have no trouble fitting on to a short M.2 2242 card alongside a controller chip.

Doesn't mention when the Optane ones will become available. Intel has said they're sampling in Q4, just like Purley btw, and Purley won't launch until mid-year. Use as SSHD also bit disappointing, since coupling this with an HDD that simply isn't a good way to show off Optane's supposed speed. But given the costs of the new memory probably just not much else to do. (The use if 128GBit dies is only a few years behind NAND, so not using them as 128GB SSDs could be Lenovos own decision or simply because cost is too high because of yields.)

But at least it's finally entering the market, huzzay.

Edit: http://www.computerworld.com/articl...veals-3d-xpoint-memory-quantx.html#tk.rss_all

 

[CakeMonster]

I'm wondering whether to get 2x16Gb or 4x8Gb sticks of DDR4. I'm on SL and right now I'm perfectly fine with 4c8t for my use (gaming), and I would prefer easier OC and better stability with fewer sticks. So I do NOT need HEDT with >4c or 4ch RAM at the moment.

Does anyone have any informed guess on when a >4c platform with KL or the following generation will arrive and whether that is likely to feature more than 2ch DDR4? So I can make a better informed decision on what to plan for and when I would have to ditch the RAM for a new set to keep up?

TLDR: Gamer, fine with 4c8t now, is it likely I would need 4ch RAM in the next couple of years for my use and that such a platform will arrive?

 

[witeken]

Would Apple's A10 chip be able to reach 7GHz, for all its praise it got at launch ?

https://www.techpowerup.com/229007/intel-core-i7-7700k-cracks-7-ghz-bench-stable-overclock

 

[Lodix]

Would Apple's A10 chip be able to reach 7GHz, for all its praise it got at launch ?

https://www.techpowerup.com/229007/intel-core-i7-7700k-cracks-7-ghz-bench-stable-overclock

It is always delightful watching you trying to throw shit to everyone but Intel whenever there is an occasion even if it is just a rumour and not something official...

Apple A10 is a 5W TDP SOC ( CPU+GPU+a lot of other things) designed for phones. This CPU alone must be drawing well over 200W and heating up so much it will not live for too long. Not a remotely fair comparison at all.

 

[John Carmack]

Kaby Lake Systems With Intel Optane SSDs Coming Soon



Doesn't mention when the Optane ones will become available. Intel has said they're sampling in Q4, just like Purley btw, and Purley won't launch until mid-year. Use as SSHD also bit disappointing, since coupling this with an HDD that simply isn't a good way to show off Optane's supposed speed. But given the costs of the new memory probably just not much else to do. (The use if 128GBit dies is only a few years behind NAND, so not using them as 128GB SSDs could be Lenovos own decision or simply because cost is too high because of yields.)

But at least it's finally entering the market, huzzay.

Edit: http://www.computerworld.com/articl...veals-3d-xpoint-memory-quantx.html#tk.rss_all

I was so hyped when Intel hyped up this new SSD tech one and a half years ago (1000x faster this, 1000x greater that, higher density, blah, blah) but in the time since, they've basically gone into radio silence and told us nothing about the technology other than to simultaneously confirm and deny that it's phase change memory. The greater performance wasn't what interested me but the greater endurance did.

Now this news (which really just echoes some of the scraps of info leaking out recently) that one of the first products will be using miniscule 16GB m.2 cards is seriously disappointing. How do you go from hyping 1TB in a single m.2 card to 16GB?

This whole thing so far has been as underwhelming as the Kaby Lake CPU's.

 

[witeken]

simultaneously confirm and deny that it's phase change memory.

It is PCM.

 

[John Carmack]

It is PCM.

Is it? I distinctly remember numerous members of the tech press asking Intel point blank if it was PCM but each time Intel refused to say but of course if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, smells like a duck...

 

[witeken]

Is it? I distinctly remember numerous members of the tech press asking Intel point blank if it was PCM but each time Intel refused to say but of course if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, smells like a duck...

http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1328682