Intel Skylake / Kaby Lake

[kimmel]

Don't you think its already silly that a dedicated CPU manufacturer with a CPU costing $300 is competing against a newly formed group that's not even the main focus of the company and the chips that probably cost $30 and has 1/3 TDP and power use?

iPhone is around 2/3'rds of Apples massive revenue. The certainly aren't short of resources or motivation of where to spend that revenue. Why is anyone shocked that their chips improve rather quickly?

What's silly is underestimating Apple's boatload of money.

 

[mikk]

SKL 15W GT2 is not faster than Carrizo at 15W in games.

It is faster.

 

[AtenRa]

It is faster.

HP Pavilion 15-ab052ng with AMD A10-8700P (R6 iGPU with 384sp)

Price = 499 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-Pavilion-15-ab052ng-Notebook-Review.152289.0.html

vs


HP ProBook 430 G3 with Intel Skylake Core i5 6200U (HD 520 iGPU)

Price = 629 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-ProBook-430-G3-Notebook-Review.154359.0.html

A few Games (both on dual Channel 1600MHz memory)

Bioshock Infinity - 1366x768 Medium
A10-8700P = 32,3
Core i5 6200U = 30

FIFA 16 - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 33,7
Core i5 6200U = 39,7


World Of Warships - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 38,7
Core i5 6200U = 47

Metal Grea Solid V - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 32
Core i5 6200U = 28,2

Dirt Rally - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 25,5
Core i5 6200U = 25,7


Seams to me they are equals, one is faster in some games and the other is faster in other games.

And the fact that the Carrizo has more than one generation of manufacturing node disadvantage (28nm Gate First planar HDL vs 14nm Gate Last FF) is really telling and an eye opener.

 

[mikk]

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-Pavilion-15-ab052ng-Notebook-Review.152289.0.html

This is way slower than Broadwell-U: http://www.notebookcheck.net/Acer-Aspire-V3-371-Notebook-Review.135831.0.html


I call it nonsense. There was a 10% gap between BDW and Carrizo, no way Carrizo is as fast as Skylake.

 

[AtenRa]

This is way slower than Broadwell-U: http://www.notebookcheck.net/Acer-Aspire-V3-371-Notebook-Review.135831.0.html


I call it nonsense. There was a 10% gap between BDW and Carrizo, no way Carrizo is as fast as Skylake.

What are you talking about ???

From your link of the Core i5 5200U and the one i used of the Core i5 6200U,

A few games, (both dual channel)

Bioshock - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 24,2
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 30

Tomb Rider - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 30,4
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 39,4

F1 2014- 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 37
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 51

Grid Autosport - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 37
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 43,7

 

[Abwx]

I call it nonsense. There was a 10% gap between BDW and Carrizo, no way Carrizo is as fast as Skylake.

GPU wise Carrizo is faster than SKL with Irispro let alone if compared with SKL s mainstream GPUs.

If you didnt notice the SKL laptop linked by Atenra consume as much as the Carrizo one, if not more, when only the IGPUs are used, yet it has a 13"3 screen while the Carrizo has a 15"6, this say that SKL consume more power in thoses tests than Carrizo.

FTR Carrizo GPU has better perf/Watt than Irispro, as for BDW being 10% below Carrizo it s total non sense, it can be at this level only with bigger amounts of TDP...

 

[ShintaiDK]

Are you sure the 8700P used is 15W? It uses 61-66W under load. While the 6200U uses 26-32W. The Broadwell used 28-32W.

 

[Sweepr]

GPU wise Carrizo is faster than SKL with Irispro let alone if compared with SKL s mainstream GPUs.

15W Skylake-U GT3e almost matches reference platform 35W FX-8800P @ 3DMark 11 and this benchmark favours AMD. In actual notebooks at the same TDP it's a massacre.

Carrizo barely matches GT2, Iris is far better. I know the truth hurts. AMD's graphics performance advantage is gone in mobile, and the CPU gap keeps increasing.

Keep making up numbers though, it's entertaining.

 

[AtenRa]

Are you sure the 8700P used is 15W? It uses 61-66W under load. While the 6200U uses 26-32W. The Broadwell used 28-32W.

HP Pavilion 15-ab052ng has a dGPU as well, thus the higher power usage in the laptop review.

But, i have only used the R6 iGPU results vs the SKL 6200U.

 

[frozentundra123456]

IDK, both look pretty pathetic to me. Does anybody really want to play old games at 768P? I also wonder how long one could play on either before throttling set in.

 

[AtenRa]

Carrizo barely matches GT2, Iris is far better.

As i have explained above, the SKL GT3e has double the die size of the iGPU found on the Carrizo AND eDRAM.

Its like saying that R9 390 is way faster than GTX 960. Yes it is but its also double the die size and memory bandwidth.

 

[Abwx]

Are you sure the 8700P used is 15W? It uses 61-66W under load. While the 6200U uses 26-32W. The Broadwell used 28-32W.

This is with the dGPU, they published another review of this laptop with the IGP as only GPU.

There s a review of an Acer that point to a 15W brick wall limited Carrizo without any boost if we are to compare the scores with the HP s, likewise you can find some very rare strictly 15W limited Intel based laptops, you ll see that the scores are quite different from the usual ones that use boosted CPUs.

As for power measurements these are currently difficult to sort out because the review do not say everything.

The "problem"comes from the power circuitry that feed the laptops with both the PSU and the battery if more power is needed.
This can be better witnessed in high power laptops where at full power the battery get slightly discharged;

So measuring the power at the wall is no more accurate, only mean to have relevant figure is to find reviews with laptops being below 30W with average screens, this way we are more or less sure that the chip is limited to a strict 15W.

From those reviews we can easily deduce that Carrizo is slightly more efficient than Beema and that Intel s APUs are no better than the latter, that s the current state of efficency for the big designs..

 

[dahorns]

HP Pavilion 15-ab052ng with AMD A10-8700P (R6 iGPU with 384sp)

Price = 499 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-Pavilion-15-ab052ng-Notebook-Review.152289.0.html

vs


HP ProBook 430 G3 with Intel Skylake Core i5 6200U (HD 520 iGPU)

Price = 629 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-ProBook-430-G3-Notebook-Review.154359.0.html

A few Games (both on dual Channel 1600MHz memory)

Bioshock Infinity - 1366x768 Medium
A10-8700P = 32,3
Core i5 6200U = 30

FIFA 16 - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 33,7
Core i5 6200U = 39,7


World Of Warships - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 38,7
Core i5 6200U = 47

Metal Grea Solid V - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 32
Core i5 6200U = 28,2

Dirt Rally - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 25,5
Core i5 6200U = 25,7


Seams to me they are equals, one is faster in some games and the other is faster in other games.

And the fact that the Carrizo has more than one generation of manufacturing node disadvantage (28nm Gate First planar HDL vs 14nm Gate Last FF) is really telling and an eye opener.

I'm confused where you are getting some of these scores from. Bioshock isn't listed in the HP ProBook review. And the scores for Fifa and Metal Gear Solid V appear to be from the 6200u with single channel memory. And you can see there is a vast difference between the single channel and dual channel scores, with the dual channel getting 30% to 50% better scores.

Finally... did you look at the battery life portion of the test? The 8700p laptop with 41 whr battery got literally half (or less than half) the battery life of the 6200u laptop with 44 whr battery. That difference is extremely large even accounting for the larger screen of the 8700p laptop. The review did mention that certain power saving features may not have been active yet for Windows 10. So maybe that explains part of it. Or maybe the dGPU doesn't shut off properly.

 

[Abwx]

15W Skylake-U GT3e almost matches reference platform 35W FX-8800P @ 3DMark 11 and this benchmark favours AMD. In actual notebooks at the same TDP it's a massacre.

Lol, give us a link of this "15W" marvel...

Here a 28W intel chip, how is it that it perform barely better than some "15W" chips..??.

http://www.notebookcheck.com/Test-Aldi-Medion-Akoya-E6418-Notebook.153037.0.html

http://www.notebookcheck.com/filead...a_E6418-MD99620/Medion_Akoya_E6418_Stress.jpg

28W but up to 35W actualy, lol, but it can be even worse than that :

http://www.notebookcheck.com/Test-Medion-Akoya-E6417-MD99248-Notebook.151742.0.html

http://www.notebookcheck.com/filead...417-MD99248/Medion_Akoya_E6417_stresstest.jpg

An advice, keep on doing some promotion of Intel products using marketing slides in your marketing dedicated threads if you want, but let the real technical matters to people who know what is a Watt and a Joule, to be clear i dont think that you are competent to discuss thoses matters.

 

[Sweepr]

An advice, keep on doing some promotion of Intel products using marketing slides in your marketing dedicated threads if you want, but let the real technical matters to people who know what is a Watt and a Joule, to be clear i dont think that you are competent to discuss thoses matters.

All I see is a bunch of Broadwell GT3 tests. Carrizo won't come close to 28W Skylake-U GT3e so all you can do is repost tests from older Intel chips. Sad, isn't it?

Talking about marketing, none of the retail Carrizo laptops out right now delivered the misleading Cinebench and 3DMark scores you were bragging about from AMD slides. You have a lot of damage control to do.

 

[AtenRa]

I'm confused where you are getting some of these scores from. Bioshock isn't listed in the HP ProBook review. And the scores for Fifa and Metal Gear Solid V appear to be from the 6200u with single channel memory. And you can see there is a vast difference between the single channel and dual channel scores, with the dual channel getting 30% to 50% better scores.

Both scores are with dual memory.

This one is the Carrizo R6 iGPU link, results are taken from the HP Pavilion 15-ab052ng with dual memory.

And here is the HD520 link. lots of results from the HP ProBook 430 G3
with the Core i5 6200U with dual Memory.

Finally... did you look at the battery life portion of the test? The 8700p laptop with 41 whr battery got literally half (or less than half) the battery life of the 6200u laptop with 44 whr battery. That difference is extremely large even accounting for the larger screen of the 8700p laptop. The review did mention that certain power saving features may not have been active yet for Windows 10. So maybe that explains part of it. Or maybe the dGPU doesn't shut off properly.

Well there is something wrong with the 15" model because the 17" model with the same 41Wh Battery has more than double the battery run-time in Idle.

 

[Enigmoid]

HP Pavilion 15-ab052ng with AMD A10-8700P (R6 iGPU with 384sp)

Price = 499 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-Pavilion-15-ab052ng-Notebook-Review.152289.0.html

vs


HP ProBook 430 G3 with Intel Skylake Core i5 6200U (HD 520 iGPU)

Price = 629 Euro

http://www.notebookcheck.net/HP-ProBook-430-G3-Notebook-Review.154359.0.html

A few Games (both on dual Channel 1600MHz memory)

Bioshock Infinity - 1366x768 Medium
A10-8700P = 32,3
Core i5 6200U = 30

FIFA 16 - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 33,7
Core i5 6200U = 39,7


World Of Warships - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 38,7
Core i5 6200U = 47

Metal Grea Solid V - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 32
Core i5 6200U = 28,2

Dirt Rally - 1366x768
A10-8700P = 25,5
Core i5 6200U = 25,7


Seams to me they are equals, one is faster in some games and the other is faster in other games.

And the fact that the Carrizo has more than one generation of manufacturing node disadvantage (28nm Gate First planar HDL vs 14nm Gate Last FF) is really telling and an eye opener.

Check the link again. The values from the table are using single channel RAM.

Look at the charts below.

IE

World of Warships - 69 fps vs. 47 fps singlechannel (carrizo 50).
Tomb raider - 50 vs 74 fps (carrizo 71).
Dirt Rally - 70 vs 113 fps (carrizo 94)

Your 6200U numbers are for singlechannel RAM.

 

[Abwx]

All I see is a bunch of Broadwell GT3 tests. Carrizo won't come close to 28W Skylake-U GT3e so all you can do is repost tests from older Intel chips. Sad, isn't it?

What s sad is that about all SKLs laptops use a dGPU, surely an aknowledgement of how great the iGPU must be...

I already pointed that the infos are still scarce, and that s why i used a BDW wich is not a less efficient APU than SKL, eventualy by a few %, or do you think that a miracle is possible even if using the same process.?.

Talking about marketing, none of the retail Carrizo laptops out right now delivered the misleading Cinebench and 3DMark scores you were bragging about from AMD slides. You have a lot of damage control to do.

The most powered laptop using a Carrizo is the HP with the chip set at 15W with boost up to 20W for 30-60s if the laptop is cold...

The HP score 2.32-2.36 in CB 11.5 , the Lenovo Ideapad 700 score 3.39 pts, iGPU wise the latter s scores are the following

Integrated Radeon R7 (Carrizo)

Ice Storm Standard Graphics 55596
Ice Storm Standard Physics 33782
Ice Storm Standard Score 48619

Cloud Gate Standard Graphics 7431
Cloud Gate Standard Physics 2943
Cloud Gate Standard Score 5550

Sky Diver Standard Graphics 5638
Sky Diver Standard Physics 4187
Sky Diver Standard Combined 3063
Sky Diver Standard Score 4962

Fire Strike Standard Graphics 1121
Fire Strike Standard Physics 4207
Fire Strike Standard Combined 536
Fire Strike Standard Score 1121


So you were talking of a massacre, guess what, it s right, and that s with Lenovo s previous drivers version..

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/ideapad-y700-15acz-review.783192/

 

[AtenRa]

What s sad is that about all SKLs laptops use a dGPU, surely an aknowledgement of how great the iGPU must be...

I already pointed that the infos are still scarce, and that s why i used a BDW wich is not a less efficient APU than SKL, eventualy by a few %, or do you think that a miracle is possible even if using the same process.?.




The most powered laptop using a Carrizo is the HP with the chip set at 15W with boost up to 20W for 30-60s if the laptop is cold...

The HP score 2.32-2.36 in CB 11.5 , the Lenovo Ideapad 700 score 3.39 pts, iGPU wise the latter s scores are the following

Integrated Radeon R7 (Carrizo)

Ice Storm Standard Graphics 55596
Ice Storm Standard Physics 33782
Ice Storm Standard Score 48619

Cloud Gate Standard Graphics 7431
Cloud Gate Standard Physics 2943
Cloud Gate Standard Score 5550

Sky Diver Standard Graphics 5638
Sky Diver Standard Physics 4187
Sky Diver Standard Combined 3063
Sky Diver Standard Score 4962

Fire Strike Standard Graphics 1121
Fire Strike Standard Physics 4207
Fire Strike Standard Combined 536
Fire Strike Standard Score 1121


So you were talking of a massacre, guess what, it s right, and that s with Lenovo s previous drivers version..

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/ideapad-y700-15acz-review.783192/

Those 3D Mark scores are at 35W TDP and with dual DDR-3L 1600MHz memory. Using 2133MHz memory will increase the performance further.

But even at 35W TDP and 1600MHz memory the Carrizo is faster in 3D Mark Fire Strike and Sky Diver than Desktop Core i3 6300 HD530 with memory at 1866MHz and higher TDP.

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/9192029

 

[mikk]

What are you talking about ???

From your link of the Core i5 5200U and the one i used of the Core i5 6200U,

A few games, (both dual channel)

Bioshock - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 24,2
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 30

Tomb Rider - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 30,4
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 39,4

F1 2014- 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 37
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 51

Grid Autosport - 1366x768 medium
Core i5 5200U HD5500 = 37
Core i5 6200U HD520 = 43,7

That means Skylake is faster. You have to agree.

Crysis 3
Carrizo 28 +43,3%
i5-5200U 19.6

Tomb Raider
Carrizo 37 +21,7%
i5-5200U 30.4

Bioshock Infinite
Carrizo 58.9 +36.6%
i5-5200U 43.13

Metro 2033 Last Light
Carrizo 23.1 +2,7%
i5-5200U 22.5

Thief
Carrizo 14.3 -30,6%
i5-5200U 20.6

Grid Autosport
Carrizo 32.2 -13%
i5-5200U 37

Sims 4
Carrizo 34.3 -17,1%
i5-5200U 41.4

Fifa 15
Carrizo 54.7 +49,5%
i5-5200U 36.6

F1 2014
Carrizo 33 -10,8%
i5-5200U 37

Call of Duty Warfare
Carrizo 32.2 -1%
i5-5200U 32.5

81,4/10= +8% Carrizo


http://www.notebookcheck.com/Carrizo-im-Test-Was-leistet-AMDs-A10-8700P.147092.0.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/Acer-Aspire-V3-371-Notebook-Review.135831.0.html



And Skylake is ~30% faster than Broadwell.

 

[Abwx]

Your 6200U numbers are for singlechannel RAM.

....................Let s look at this review...............

And yet :

In der folgenden Vergleichstabelle sind die 3D-Mark-Resultate des HP Rechners im Single- und Dual-Channel-Modus zu finden.

 

[Abwx]

That means Skylake is faster. You have to agree.

Crysis 3
Carrizo 28 +43,3%
i5-5200U 19.6

Tomb Raider
Carrizo 37 +21,7%
i5-5200U 30.4

Bioshock Infinite
Carrizo 58.9 +36.6%
i5-5200U 43.13

Metro 2033 Last Light
Carrizo 23.1 +2,7%
i5-5200U 22.5

Thief
Carrizo 14.3 -30,6%
i5-5200U 20.6

Grid Autosport
Carrizo 32.2 -13%
i5-5200U 37

Sims 4
Carrizo 34.3 -17,1%
i5-5200U 41.4

Fifa 15
Carrizo 54.7 +49,5%
i5-5200U 36.6

F1 2014
Carrizo 33 -10,8%
i5-5200U 37

Call of Duty Warfare
Carrizo 32.2 -1%
i5-5200U 32.5

81,4/10= +8% Carrizo


http://www.notebookcheck.com/Carrizo-im-Test-Was-leistet-AMDs-A10-8700P.147092.0.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/Acer-Aspire-V3-371-Notebook-Review.135831.0.html

I suggest that you check the power numbers before posting irrelevant datas, the 5200U linked throttle at over 18W , i let you imagine at how much it get when a little colder.

With 3.5W more dedicated to a GPU that is supposed to be in the 8W range you can increase its score by 20%....


I benefit from this post to point the intellectual dishonnesty of some people here who have no regard for the tests conditons and are trying to sell made up numbers like with this 5200U for instance.

And Skylake is ~30% faster than Broadwell.

That NBC statement is according to Intel claims, now find us thoses reviews where we can see those 30% in a genuine 15W vs 15W comparison....

 

[Abwx]

Those 3D Mark scores are at 35W TDP and with dual DDR-3L 1600MHz memory. Using 2133MHz memory will increase the performance further.

Nice catch, i didnt pay attention to this detail...

But even at 35W TDP and 1600MHz memory the Carrizo is faster in 3D Mark Fire Strike and Sky Diver than Desktop Core i3 6300 HD530 with memory at 1866MHz and higher TDP.

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/9192029

Yes, but if the i3 6300 is downgraded to 15W its GPU perfs will increase to the point of exceeding the ones of a 35W Carrizo according to our usual TDP experts....

 

[mikk]

I suggest that you check the power numbers before posting irrelevant datas, the 5200U linked throttle at over 18W , i let you imagine at how much it get when a little colder.

Irrelevant numbers because you don't like it. We are comparing benchmarks and you are trying to shift your goal post to other things. YOU started with benchmarks, I replied you with benchmarks. This is a 1:1 comparison.

There is not even a power test based on any of these game benchmarks, so how can you say it throttled. Furmark and 3dmark is irrelevant, we already know that AMD does better in 3dmark. Not to mention that Carrizo did use 8 watts more than the linked Broadwell device. Irrelevant for Skylake anyways.

 

[Enigmoid]

....................Let s look at this review...............

And yet :

Photo Caption: "The graphics performance increases if a second RAM module is added."

Obviously they added another RAM module.