Intel X-25M G2 TRIM Firmware RELEASED (02HA)

[glugglug]

From the threads on Intel's forums, it sounds like the most likely culprit is that Intel's TRIM implementation breaks when your partition is not 4KB aligned. If that is the case, those who partitioned & formatted their drives with the Win7 installer should be ok, but if you are upgrading from Vista or XP without erasing the drive first you will likely run into trouble. Also, if you used partition magic or ghost your alignment is likely to be incorrect and you could run into trouble.

Note: If you are using Intel Matrix Storage drivers, you aren't getting TRIM commands passed down to the drive, as those drivers don't support the command yet and just eat it. Only if you are using Microsoft AHCI drivers is the Win7 TRIM command getting forwarded to your drive.

Also, I don't think the drives are really getting bricked, but are getting screwed up partition maps that the installer doesn't know what to do with, HDDERASE wipes the partition map so you can start fresh.

* I am not an Intel employee. The above is my best guesses as to what is going on, and may be incorrect. YMMV.

 

[DBordello]

Does anybody have the intel firmware they would be willing to share?

I have a fresh drive and am looking to do a clean install of Windows 7. Ideally that will be safe.

Thanks.

 

[rcpratt]

I still have the firmware saved. PM me your email and I can send it to you.

 

[SteveGo]

I still have the firmware saved. PM me your email and I can send it to you.

Sent you a pm.

 

[Emulex]

why don't they just make a util to align your partition. shrink your current par by 100meg and make it like a real win7 install. doesn't seem that hard to do as long as you have some free space

 

[glugglug]

why don't they just make a util to align your partition. shrink your current par by 100meg and make it like a real win7 install. doesn't seem that hard to do as long as you have some free space

NTFS is not an open documented filesystem.
Before shrinking a partition you would need to ensure none of the blocks towards the end are in use, which may require some defragging even if you have plenty of space free. And obviously you can't move the partition while Windows is running. Note that there aren't any NTFS defraggers which run outside of Windows because it would be extremely risky as something could easily be missed trying to reorganize an undocumented filesystem without using the Windows APIs specifically for moving files around.

 

[jimhsu]

Intel drive does not do idle GC. Part of the reason is that its counterintuitive with faster performance=more idling. TRIM from what I can gather allows the OS to delete the files on the SSD when its instructed to be deleted, rather than just merely marking it as deleted.

According to most user reports, the Toolkit only takes about a second(few seconds) at most to clean. That's not what I'd call really noticeable...

The Toolkit is useful even to Win 7 users as currently the Intel drivers don't do auto TRIM: http://www.anandtech.com/stora...howdoc.aspx?i=3667&p=3

I.e. GC - unless I'm reading this wrong, this contradicts the claim that there is no idle GC. From what I remember, Intel drives do constant GC while Indilinx drives do idle GC ("GC" having different meanings in both contexts, and is different from TRIM). The GC talked about has nothing to do with either TRIM or block erasure.

The tool SCANS the filesystem for existing files, and tells the drive to trim all the space that does not have files.

Just to make sure I understand you, "trim" != TRIM. What is going on is that actual block erasure (setting all bits in TRIMmed blocks to 1) happens "some time" after TRIM is executed (the duration of "some time" being unknown), and the tool causes block erasure to happen now.

Hopefully that is somewhat more clear. Please correct if I made any mistakes.

 

[jimhsu]

From the threads on Intel's forums, it sounds like the most likely culprit is that Intel's TRIM implementation breaks when your partition is not 4KB aligned. If that is the case, those who partitioned & formatted their drives with the Win7 installer should be ok, but if you are upgrading from Vista or XP without erasing the drive first you will likely run into trouble. Also, if you used partition magic or ghost your alignment is likely to be incorrect and you could run into trouble.

Note: If you are using Intel Matrix Storage drivers, you aren't getting TRIM commands passed down to the drive, as those drivers don't support the command yet and just eat it. Only if you are using Microsoft AHCI drivers is the Win7 TRIM command getting forwarded to your drive.

Also, I don't think the drives are really getting bricked, but are getting screwed up partition maps that the installer doesn't know what to do with, HDDERASE wipes the partition map so you can start fresh.

* I am not an Intel employee. The above is my best guesses as to what is going on, and may be incorrect. YMMV.

Has anyone shown that HDDERASE on a "bricked" drive restores the drive to normal? That would seriously cut down on RMAs, assuming that the drive is usable after.

 

[Safe_Mode]

This is insane. No where on the internet can I download at least an older but stable firmware for my X18-M Gen 1 that I just bought yesterday. I have the 8610 firmware and no way in hell am I dumping my primary OS on it until it gets updated to at least 8820. Where the hell can I download it?

Why is it so impossible for Intel to post previous firmware releases like every other company on the planet? So there's a problem with TRIM on Gen 2 drives. Whooopdedo. Ain't got that. Any status on when they'll repost the firmware or should I just go back to Microcenter this weekend and dump this POS cause Intel *support* supports nothing right now. :/

 

[rcpratt]

Sorry for the delay SafeMode, but I do have the "02G9/8820" firmware on me, which I believe was the previous version, at least for the X25-M. If that will work for the X18-M G1 (actually, I just checked, it says it does), I'd be glad to send it to you, just PM me your email.

Filename: 080902G98820

NOTES:
- The Intel SATA SSD Firmware Update tool now supports X18-M
and X25-M 34nm products (silver case) as well as the X18-M
and X25-M 50nm products (black case).
- Please refer to the RELEASE NOTES also located on the
download page for the specific firmware fixes for each
product family for each release.

 

[taltamir]

Just to make sure I understand you, "trim" != TRIM. What is going on is that actual block erasure (setting all bits in TRIMmed blocks to 1) happens "some time" after TRIM is executed (the duration of "some time" being unknown), and the tool causes block erasure to happen now.

Hopefully that is somewhat more clear. Please correct if I made any mistakes.

You are wrong, the tool does NOT cause block erasure to happen now. the tool used TRIM (as you call it) to inform the drive of blacks that contain invalid data, block erasure happens "some time" later. just like if windows 7 itself used said command when you deleted a file. The reason you need the tool is that windows only initiates the command when you:
1. format a partition (entire partition gets TRIM command)
2. delete a file (its space gets TRIM command)

The tool is needed for:
1. files deleted before upgrading the firmware
2. deleting a partition (windows 7 does not trim its space in this case)
3. using windows vista or XP.

btw, I ran the tool and it took only a few seconds.

 

[exar333]

I still have the firmware saved. PM me your email and I can send it to you.

With rcpratt's help obtaining the new firmware, I successfully updated the firmware and am running with the TRIM enabled in Win7. This drive really flies!

 

[Elcs]

My 160 Gb X25-M is arriving on Monday with my copy of Windows 7... Aiming to install Windows 7 onto the SSD and use my two current HDD's as storage/other games.

Should I hold off installing Windows 7 until Intel fix their firmware or is it worth me just plowing on ahead with a Windows 7 install and worry about Intel's TRIM firmware later?

 

[Majic 7]

Elcs, if it was me I would wait. I flashed my 160 and then installed W7 and had no problems. But others did have problems with everything installed fresh. Some people did an update of their firmware on existing OS installs and had no problems and some ended up with a bricked drive. Maybe by Monday Intel will have an answer and you won't have to wait. There really doesn't seem to be a common denominator found yet and Intel is still recommending that you hold off until new firmware is available. With Intel's track record on firmware for the SSDs I don't know if I would take a chance installing and updating later. Don't think I could wait much more than a week or so myself. You don't really lose that much performance without trim and after a week I probably would install and wait for new firmware and wait a week or two on installing that.

 

[BaboonGuy]

My 160 Gb X25-M is arriving on Monday with my copy of Windows 7... Aiming to install Windows 7 onto the SSD and use my two current HDD's as storage/other games.

Should I hold off installing Windows 7 until Intel fix their firmware or is it worth me just plowing on ahead with a Windows 7 install and worry about Intel's TRIM firmware later?

I think you'll be fine. The firmware honestly worked fine for me... I had fresh installed Win7 on it, which sounds like what you'll be doing. Once its rereleased I'm sure Intel will have it working. Just don't put anything you don't have backed up on the drive.

 

[taltamir]

they found out it was a problem with the updater tool, not the firmware itself. on some system it can brick your drive.

I wonder if those people turned off AHCI before running the tool... my guess is that they didn't.

 

[pcslookout]

they found out it was a problem with the updater tool, not the firmware itself. on some system it can brick your drive.

I wonder if those people turned off AHCI before running the tool... my guess is that they didn't.

Sorry but your a day late.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2021141

 

[IntelUser2000]

I.e. GC - unless I'm reading this wrong, this contradicts the claim that there is no idle GC. From what I remember, Intel drives do constant GC while Indilinx drives do idle GC ("GC" having different meanings in both contexts, and is different from TRIM). The GC talked about has nothing to do with either TRIM or block erasure.

You mean the quote "Intel uses a couple of approaches to combat performance degradation over time. The first is a series of garbage collection algorithms that are constantly working to cleanse the drive of internal fragmentation." ?

You do not understand what "Garbage Collection" does. Everytime a flash memory needs to be logically "cleared", GC happens. If Indilinx drive only had "idle GC" it would mean if you kept using the drive without idle periods it would eventually reach a point where the drive would refuse more writes to the drive and wait for idle time to do GC again.

(and on previous Indilinx firmware revisions where idle GC didn't exist it would mean your SSD would be effectively having one write cycle lifespan LOL)

When the drive is logically(notice I have not said physically) "full", any incoming writes won't happen until the controller clears up the blocks needed to be written and that's where "Garbage Collection" comes in. Saying Intel drive does it "constantly" while Indilinx only does it at "idle" makes no sense at all.

 

[jimhsu]

You mean the quote "Intel uses a couple of approaches to combat performance degradation over time. The first is a series of garbage collection algorithms that are constantly working to cleanse the drive of internal fragmentation." ?

You do not understand what "Garbage Collection" does. Everytime a flash memory needs to be logically "cleared", GC happens. If Indilinx drive only had "idle GC" it would mean if you kept using the drive without idle periods it would eventually reach a point where the drive would refuse more writes to the drive and wait for idle time to do GC again.

(and on previous Indilinx firmware revisions where idle GC didn't exist it would mean your SSD would be effectively having one write cycle lifespan LOL)

When the drive is logically(notice I have not said physically) "full", any incoming writes won't happen until the controller clears up the blocks needed to be written and that's where "Garbage Collection" comes in. Saying Intel drive does it "constantly" while Indilinx only does it at "idle" makes no sense at all.

OK, that wasn't explained well. Here: http://hothardware.com/News/OCZ-and-Indilinx-Collaborate-On-New-SSD-Garbage-Collection-Scheme/

1. Sustained writes to the Vertex with no idle time eventually leads to a state which every block has been written to once.
2. There is a significant penalty to writes after that (I don't call this garbage collection - rather, I call it block clearing)
3. If the drive is now idle, a process called "garbage collection" takes place where unused blocks are pre-emptively cleared (before they are required to be cleared as per step 2). The drive is faster with writes as a result.

The Vertex before the "idle GC" firmware did not have step 3; hence all writes after a certain point required a corresponding block erasure, making the drive slow. Same thing happened with the Intel X25-M before the updated G1 firmware.

Unfortunately I don't have similar data for the Intel drive.

 

[Thor86]

I still have the firmware saved. PM me your email and I can send it to you.

Hi, sent you a PM as well. TIA!

 

[camara120]

Finally found the firmware here: http://drivers.mydrivers.com/download/319-127984-Intel-X18-M-X25-E-X25-M-1.4-/

 

[bigi]

Finally found the firmware here: http://drivers.mydrivers.com/download/319-127984-Intel-X18-M-X25-E-X25-M-1.4-/

Thanks. Downloaded and updated my SSD yesterday. All is fine.

 

[Brahma]

Note: If you are using Intel Matrix Storage drivers, you aren't getting TRIM commands passed down to the drive, as those drivers don't support the command yet and just eat it. Only if you are using Microsoft AHCI drivers is the Win7 TRIM command getting forwarded to your drive.

So if I am understanding this correctly, the following guy (rdhir) who says he

"HAD to use the Intel drivers to avoid intermittent freezing.

does not have TRIM support?

Source: http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3667&p=1&cp=15#comments

 

[ricardofreire]

I still have the firmware saved. PM me your email and I can send it to you.

Just sent you a PM, hope you save my day!

BTW, I'm running win7 32, so I understand I'm under no risk with this update. Is that right?

 

[camara120]

Just sent you a PM, hope you save my day!

BTW, I'm running win7 32, so I understand I'm under no risk with this update. Is that right?

According to all the stuff I read, the problems were with Windows 7 64bit. However, some people think the problem came from people who upgraded from one OS to another or had some other program format their hard drives. I did a clean install of Windows 7 and let it format my SSD. After the install, I used the firmware upgrade boot cd and my system works fine.

To verify TRIM is enabled, open a command prompt in administrator mode an type:

fsutil behavior query DisableDeleteNotify

and press Enter

If the result is “DisableDeleteNotify = 0″ then TRIM is enabled.