Intelligent design

Siva

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2001
5,472
0
71
Bush said something like intelligent design should be taught in schools along with evolution. I don't really think this is a P&N thread because I just want a general expression of ideas and don't want to get too much into the politics of the issue. I would just like to know what people think of intelligent design, no flames.
 

JohnCU

Banned
Dec 9, 2000
16,528
4
0
The environment does not adapt to allow it's inhabitants to survive, the inhabitants adapt to the environment. Survival of the fittest.

Things are the way they are because that's how we evolved.
 

imported_Pablo

Diamond Member
Jan 20, 2002
3,714
1
0
I find it hard to believe that all this happened by chance, and evolved from lesser forms, but I have a hard time believing in religion sometimes too...
 

brunswickite

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2002
6,386
1
0
I accidently picked "its a valid scientific theory", I meant to pick "its a religious viewpoint"
 

JohnCU

Banned
Dec 9, 2000
16,528
4
0
I mean, you hear all this stuff about, "well if the charge on an electron was 1.6E-19 instead of 1.61E-19" or whatever it is, we wouldn't exist. Well, we might exist, just not as we are now. We might be better. We evolved around that because that's what was available.
 
Jan 18, 2001
14,465
1
0
a theory should be able to explain existing data and predict future data. I am not sure how ID does either.
 

JohnCU

Banned
Dec 9, 2000
16,528
4
0
Note that ID is not considered a scientific theory. It's just creationism in a different form.
 

Siva

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2001
5,472
0
71
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Note that ID is not considered a scientific theory. It's just creationism in a different form.

It is not considered a scientific theory by the majority of the scientific community. But that doesn't mean that there aren't people who do consider it that way, as the poll has established.
 

Byte

Platinum Member
Mar 8, 2000
2,877
6
81
Its the reason why homosaps cant reproduce...wait what were we talking about again?
 

kitkat22

Golden Member
Feb 10, 2005
1,464
1,331
136
Intelligent design is a religious viewpoint just from the fact it cannot be proven or disproven by science. There is no testable alternative hypothesis so in the scientific world it just can't be done. I do think it would be a pratical thing to teach in schools, but it can't be included with Biology because it isn't science. It needs to be discussed because I think it would help reduce bigotry if taught correctly and it allow students to think (if that's possible) if religion is right for them or not.
 

JohnCU

Banned
Dec 9, 2000
16,528
4
0
Originally posted by: Siva
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Note that ID is not considered a scientific theory. It's just creationism in a different form.

It is not considered a scientific theory by the majority of the scientific community. But that doesn't mean that there aren't people who do consider it that way, as the poll has established.

I was just noting that the National Academy of Science says it's not a scientific theory.
 

akubi

Diamond Member
Apr 19, 2005
4,392
1
0
Originally posted by: Siva
Bush said something like intelligent design should be taught in schools along with evolution. I don't really think this is a P&N thread because I just want a general expression of ideas and don't want to get too much into the politics of the issue. I would just like to know what people think of intelligent design, no flames.

I think it's hogwash.

thanks for asking.
 

Siva

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2001
5,472
0
71
Originally posted by: cscpianoman
Intelligent design is a religious viewpoint just from the fact it cannot be proven or disproven by science. There is no testable alternative hypothesis so in the scientific world it just can't be done. I do think it would be a pratical thing to teach in schools, but it can't be included with Biology because it isn't science. It needs to be discussed because I think it would help reduce bigotry if taught correctly and it allow students to think (if that's possible) if religion is right for them or not.

So then all religions should be taught in school or just intelligent design? There are plenty of religions in which intelligent design would be impossible. It really only goes along with the big players, Christianity/Judaism/Islam.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
ID does it backwarsds, it starts as a "fact" and then the people who belive in it try to use science to justify their predetermant fact. That is not science.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
59,239
13,843
136
It might be able to become a scientific theory if they put more thought and effort into it, and actually treat it as a scientific theory and not just an alternative to current prevailing theories, and possibly a way to sneak creationism into the science class.
 

DougK62

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2001
8,035
6
81
Your third question needs to be more specific. Taught in which class in school? I definitely think it should be brought up, just not in a science course.

 

Siva

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2001
5,472
0
71
Originally posted by: DougK62
Your third question needs to be more specific. Taught in which class in school? I definitely think it should be brought up, just not in a science course.

I don't think it does need to be more specific than that. The only religion I ever learned in public school was the kind that fit into a historical context, (I.E. the crusades). Then if its a religion why would it be taught, there is no history to intelligent design. If its a science then should it be taught?
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
Intelligent Design is a conclusion first, "find the proof later" idea, and thus its not considered science. Why can't those ultra-fundamentalists just give ID a break; if you actually have to resort to science to back your beliefs, and not your faith, then what is the point of being religious then?
 

imported_ArtVandalay

Senior member
Jul 19, 2005
694
0
0
Originally posted by: StrangerGuy
Why can't those ultra-fundamentalists just give ID a break

Because their hero is in the oval office and they know it's now or never. They have 3.5 more years to damage the country as much as possible and they're not wasting any time
 

GeneValgene

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2002
3,884
0
76
Originally posted by: JohnCU
The environment does not adapt to allow it's inhabitants to survive, the inhabitants adapt to the environment. Survival of the fittest.

Things are the way they are because that's how we evolved.

survival of the fittest isn't necessarily a sufficient explanation for macro evolution. evidence points to macro evolution often occurring in 'bursts' in a short amount of time. this theory is often referred to as punctuated equilibrium, bursts of change followed by long periods of little or no change- this better describes the evidence than a purely gradual darwinian natural selection. a proponent of this idea is stephen jay gould of harvard, who is one of the most prominent biologists in the world today (and also a staunch critic of intelligent design). here's an article from gould Evolution of Life on Earth

however, i wouldn't say all of intelligent design is all crock. i woudl suggest william dembski's The Design Inference : Eliminating Chance through Small Probabilities (Cambridge Studies in Probability, Induction and Decision Theory) . he is a mathematician who is one of the leading voices in the intelligent design movement.

-edit-
yes, it is true that dembski is no biologist, and his writings are more mathematical and philosphical. just wanted to point sources to both sides. dembski readings are interesting, and if anything can spur discussion. michael behe attempts to make the case from a biological perspective - although his works are oft criticized by his peers.

i just encourage people to keep an open mind. although evolutionary change is a fact, people blindly assume darwinian natural selection as the only driver of macro evolution, when in fact, there are other newer and more probable theories. as i pointed out above gould has a lot of good writings, and he debunks a lot of the creationism/intelligent design arguments.
 

DainBramaged

Lifer
Jun 19, 2003
23,448
40
91
I don't care whether or not you think it is a P&N issue, this thread has already turned into a religion/intelligent design bashing thread. The fact is, neither macro evolution nor intelligent design can be proven or tested. Why bother even having these threads since all they ever do is just make people mad without ever changing anybodies opinion. :roll:
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |