Intel's 14nm+ actually gave no discernible ipc improvements, mobile or desktop.
The sole reason the mobile chips do better on benches is their ability to stay within their TDP envelope while boosting to higher clocks for longer periods.
PC Games Hardware was able to find out from its own sources that the subject matter, that the Core i7-7740K and i5-7640K actually should appear, but not as a timely Ryzen counter-attack and also not as Kaby Lake-S. Rather, it is the 112-Watt chips with code names Kaby Lake-X, which are to appear to Gamescom for the new high-end platform with base 2066. These are the same S-Dies, in which only the GPUs are deactivated and the TDPs are raised. The heat spreader is not soldering to Intel, but is based on its "thermal interface material". However, the Intel i7-7740K does not want to spend more than 4.5 GHz on its current state - the i7-7740K has a 100 MHz increased basistakt compared to the i7-7700K, but needs the same 4.5 GHz turbo .
It doesn't look like there is much more clock headroom for Intel desktop chips with the 14nm process.
KL-X is not expected to have much of a clock boost, and it's TDP at 112W would seem to be a further indication that it's at the limit.
Post 224.
Intel's best HEDT offerings are based on Broadwell arch and first gen 14nm process. Raven Ridge will have to compete with Kaby Lake Refresh-U/Coffee Lake built on a third generation 14nm process. 14nm+ already gave huge improvements in notebooks, and I think 14nm++ will continue that.
I don't see much more in the way of clocks, though.Here is what he said.
I really think you've confused the context of the post. He was responding to someone asserting that Raven Ridge will provide meaningful competition in the mobile/laptop market and using the fact that Zen apparently matches or beats the efficiency of Broadwell HEDT to indicate performance/watt leadership in the mobile/laptop segment. Arachnotronic's point is that the comparisons to Broadwell HEDT is misleading, as it is an older design on an less refined 14mm node. On the other hand, we've already seen large gains in low tdp performance improvement thanks to 14nm+. He asserts that we can expect similar gains with 14nm++ in the lower TDP space. I think that is a reasonable assertion.
Should he be required to defend against something he did not say?And he can defend himself.
It's hard to discuss something 3rd party...Should he be required to defend against something he did not say?
As always, the maximum clocks are just one aspect – the processor can only maintain the specified maximum values if it does not surpass the TDP. Looking at the Core i7-7500U, this is only the case for single-threading applications, where we can see the maximum 3.5 GHz all the time. The clocks will drop from initial 3.5 GHz to 3.2-3.3 GHz after 30 seconds in multi-core scenarios. All in all, we get a respectable 15 percent advantage over a Core i7-6500U in both scenarios.
I don't see much more in the way of clocks, though.
And he can defend himself.
It's hard to discuss something 3rd party...
We got about 200mhz with the KL mobile chips. They don't maintain the high clocks above that for very long.
I just can't see much more than that in any more refinements of 14nm. We've already had the big refinement, imo.
Notebook check:
As always, the maximum clocks are just one aspect – the processor can only maintain the specified maximum values if it does not surpass the TDP. Looking at the Core i7-7500U, this is only the case for single-threading applications, where we can see the maximum 3.5 GHz all the time. The clocks will drop from initial 3.5 GHz to 3.2-3.3 GHz after 30 seconds in multi-core scenarios. All in all, we get a respectable 15 percent advantage over a Core i7-6500U in both scenarios.
Defend? Were you accusing him of something? This is a discussion regarding CPUs. You said something inaccurate, and I wanted to clarify it.
You mean you think I said something inaccurate...that's your opinion.
Let's stay on topic and refrain from discussing our opinions as if they were facts.
I don't think we will get much more clock out of Intel's 14nm, mobile or desktop.
I believe we have already seen the big refinement.
Accuse? What are you on about?
People defend and support their statements on discussion boards. Or not.
Accusations are rarely tolerated, as they would be personal.
You have asked me to defend myself, but I don't think you have accused me of anything except being confused.
Well, let's not forget Naples. That's going to hit Intel below the beltline, too.
I wonder is SKL-X will be priced more competitively when it comes out. Could be a win-win for everyone (of course, Intel HEDT motherboards also usually start out on the expensive side). Still, hard to see Intel coming down to AMD pricing levels for 6 or 8 core CPUs.
They cut Q6600 price by half when AMD was still competitive.Intel doesn't cut prices on existing products, not even when they're being discontinued.
I think they are going to have to do something now. Maybe go 8/8/10/12.
Still pretty stunned there hasn't been any recent Skylake-X "leaks".
It's hard to discuss something 3rd party...
We got about 200mhz with the KL mobile chips. They don't maintain the high clocks above that for very long.
I just can't see much more than that in any more refinements of 14nm. We've already had the big refinement, imo.
Notebook check:
Still pretty stunned there hasn't been any recent Skylake-X "leaks".
We got better than 200MHz to get 10-15% gain in real world. KBL mobile reviews still indicate that it can't always maintain all core Turbo. If they increase all core and max Turbo by another 200MHz while increasing real world consistency, well get another 10-15%.
The question is: What happens to mobile chips after it reaches thermal-related clock speed limits like desktop chips?
Actually, they cut it down to mid $500s and then half again to around $275, IIRC.They cut Q6600 price by half when AMD was still competitive.
Releasing info about SKL-X means much info about their server line being released. I guess they want to keep that a secret.
I'm not all too familiar with this. Could you explain it in simpler terms?
I remember the days of Nehalem. Amazing stuff.If you are not up to date with Intel platforms, the upcoming server chip based on Skylake is supposed to be the biggest change in what they call since - Nehalem. Nehalem on serverside brought huge performance, feature, and scability changes.
I am pretty sure they are well aware that the competitive landscape is more varied than ever. Also if you were keeping with tech news companies are just more secretive. The advancements are slowing down, so I figure they view every bit of gain as precious.