Intel's strategy is working...

toph99

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2000
5,505
0
0
in computer class today i saw the guy sitting across from me customizing a Dell P4 system, with a 1.5ghz P4 in it. i asked him what he was doing, and he said he was trying to talk his dad into buying him a P4. I then asked him why in the world he'd want that, and he said "because it's really fast. it runs at 1.5ghz." then i showed him the reviews here at Anandtech and at Tom's Hardware. now he's planning on a t'bird 1.2 ghz

just shows that those Intel marketing people aren't all that dumb...
 

DuneMaster

Member
Nov 11, 2000
120
0
0
you dont even need marketing. all people see are numbers. they know how to compare numbers. they know 1.5 is better than 1.2. therefore, p4 1.5ghz is better 1.2ghz. thats the sad truth, but remember - we are minority here.
 

xtreme2k

Diamond Member
Jun 3, 2000
3,078
0
0
most people will fall for the MHz trap

it is just like, there is a choice between 2 cars, one model is 2500cc one model is 3000cc, which one appears to be more powerful?

or like 2 different speakers, one can do 40w RMS, one can do 50w, which one must must be better?

same kinda stupid stuff
 

DuneMaster

Member
Nov 11, 2000
120
0
0
no, they are not idiots, they just dont know. if you cant fix your car, i wont call you an idiot just because you dont know how to do it. each one of us excels in something and for us on the board it's computers. for someone else, it might be math. sorry for the rant.
 

AmdEmAll

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2000
6,688
2
81
You know there gonna be fallin for that "PIV makes you download over the internet faster to!!" BS
 

Pastore

Diamond Member
Feb 9, 2000
9,728
0
76
DuneMaster is right, and the car example is perfect... If a person doesn't know, then it is not there fault, and they shouldn't be criticized for not knowing... The first think I tell someone who is trying to learn about hardware is, "Have you ever heard of anandtech? No? Ok, go to www.anandtech.com, it is awesome..."
 

Noriaki

Lifer
Jun 3, 2000
13,640
1
71
Good work Toph. People aren't all aware that a P4 1.5Ghz isn't the fastest thing around, we are the technically aware, that doesn't make them dumb...I barely know a gas pedal from a gas tank....do I feel dumb about it? No...I'm just not apt when it comes to cars.

You did the best you could to help educate the public on their computer choice. Good work
 

Stealth1024

Platinum Member
Aug 9, 2000
2,266
0
0
When can we expect AMD DDR T-Birds to start shipping? With the respective DDR memory and motherboards, they should stack up even better to the Intel P4.
 

Fandu

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,341
0
0
Announced and produced, late december. On store shelves mid January sometime.
 

Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
11,641
0
76
People who buy 2500$ systems without doing proper research are morons.

Likewise someone buying a car without doing proper research is an idiot as well.
 

MadMerc

Senior member
Feb 27, 2000
396
0
0
on the DDR tbird issue - here in the UK, they are being offered in prebuilt systems right now
 

Stealth1024

Platinum Member
Aug 9, 2000
2,266
0
0
With all this power what's wrong with a 900MHz T-Bird system? Is there really going to be a big difference if you step up to 1GHz or 1.2GHz or wait until DDR-SDRAM hits the market?
 

Priit

Golden Member
Nov 2, 2000
1,337
1
0
Cheapest SUN ist't much more expensive than computer with brand-new P4 processor... And SUN runs fast with every application, not just Quake3.

Just my $0.02
 

frankel

Junior Member
Nov 24, 2000
4
0
0
the hella Pee4 crap just won't sell that well, for it is "the battle style against power" as Tom depicts.

technology is NOT fashion show. just reminds me of Apple and 3dfx...

(my very first post on anand's forum. just a little retouching on the format of the text.)
 

Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
11,641
0
76
Priit, actually the Sun workstations in the low end(Ultra5/10's primairly) arent very fast.
A P4-1.5 GHz based workstation will surely be faster than a 360 MHz UltraSPARC-II based workstation.

CPU performance has never been Sun's stringest selling point.
 

Insomniac

Senior member
Oct 9, 1999
879
0
0
You also have to remember most people aren't constantly swapping out parts and upgrading. They just buy a computer and use it until they feel it is time to buy a new one. And in a world where your computer is obsolete before you get it, people assume the faster, the longer they can go before buying a new one.
 

OneEng

Senior member
Oct 25, 1999
585
0
0
Megahertz sells.....and so do those "Intel Inside" logo's; however, lower prices sell too!

In marketing there is a concept known as Good, Better, Best. Given the current state of affairs, AMD is squarely in the "Better" catagory. Given this scenario with pricing scaling linearly between the groups, consumers most often choose "Better" and save a little money. Some go the bargin side with "Good" while a few lean toward "Best".

Reality is that AMD's "Better" solution at 1.2Ghz is priced below Intels "Good" solution (PIII 1Ghz). This is a premo position for AMD to be in going into the holliday season.

The Celeron and Duron systems would have to be placed in a different catagory all together called "Value". Yes, cheep, but get the job done, line of thinking.

The bad thing for Intel is that right now, they can produce tons of PIII's, but only a relatively small amount of P4's. The introduction of P4 will only push the price that Intel can charge for PIII down and hurt their bottom line.

Faced with this delema, it is rumored that Intel will release a 1.3Ghz P4 to compete with AMD in the "Better" catagory.

Intel's strategy is full of holes and they know it. There is no marketing for P4, and a whole new flurry of PIII advertising. This further outlines the weakness in Intel's marketing plan. Remember the shortages last year of high end Intel parts? Imagine the same again next year.

Intel will be attempting another roll-over in their plants to get to P4 production. On the .18um process, every P4 made will take up the production capacity equivelent to 3 PIII's thus lowering Intel's production capability. In the middle of next year, Intel will attempt to roll out their .13um copper process in order to increase their production capacity back to where it was and raise speed ......more delays.

AMD on the other hand has .18um copper down cold. I speculate that their new core is simply a re-design of the layout of the previous core to take advantage of the copper interconnets along with a better branch prediction unit and a better cache pathway (I doubt the rumors about adding to the pipline since this would really be a tear up of the core where the other mods are auxillary functions).

According to some sources, this will result in a core that can scale to 2Ghz on .18um copper!

And Here is the link.
 

Rectalfier

Golden Member
Nov 21, 1999
1,589
0
0
Yes, people aren't stupid, people are ignorant. Ignorant to the fact that Intel's P4 isn't much faster than my $65 Duron700@900(No voltage increase, 950 doesnt post, too lazy to up voltage, anyways off topic). Ignorance is bliss, the people who buy P4 won't even realize it sucks because it's still hella faster than the 486 they are replacing.
 

Fandu

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,341
0
0
On the AMD Palomino issue. Palomino is simply a t-bird core with power requirement and heat output tweaks. There are no changes to the branch prediction or cacheing systems. Anand even posted this a few days ago people, old news.
 

Stephen24

Senior member
Jul 21, 2000
430
0
0
Not everyone has time to spend on their computer reading reviews. Don't call stupid, did you ever think they might actually have a life? Ya, hard for you to understand that.
 

Paladinexe

Senior member
Jul 18, 2000
307
0
0
Not everyone has the same priorities in their purchasing criteria. Most people buying computers are not overly concerned with speed being the ultimate entity.
Most want to use the internet and play some games. Most are not aware that faster systems will play games faster(?). They will never see the difference. They will never benchmark. If they are happy/content are they stupid or ignorant? Is an improvement that requires special testing to recognize really an improvement?

I have 5 computers ranging from a P 133 to a PIII 700E. I am satisfied with each for the tasks I ask of them. (2 are AMD)
 

PCResources

Banned
Oct 4, 2000
2,499
0
0
I agree with all Mhz only statements, usually that is what my customers ask me for, if i could get a 286 to run at 2Ghz, they would buy it. Of course, i tell my customers what to buy, i do not accept any deals that are not good for the customer, sometimes this makes me look as an assh)le, but i can live with that.

The point is, my customers are always satisfied, if they do not accept my conditions, i will recommend another store.

As for the P4, i know everyone hates it, some just because it's Intel and some because it uses RB.

However for some people, it will be a blessing, the high memory bandwidth will give some of them JDBC servers out ther the bandwidth they need.

I will still be recommending the Athlon to most of my customers though, pherhaps with DDR.

Patrick Palm

Am speaking for PC Resources
 

The Wildcard

Platinum Member
Oct 31, 1999
2,743
0
0
God knows an AMD Thunderbird is a helluva lot cheaper than an equivalent p3 or p4 chip running at the same speed, lol.
 
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