Interesting Census paradox

[shira]

According to the federal government, any information you disclose on the Census form cannot be revealed to law enforcement:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gRgnT7g-zoAKvFhJ0GE3J71ly_jQD9E81PA80

On the other hand, 13 USC Sec. 221 - the federal law on the Census - stipulates that it is a misdemeanor - a crime punishable by a mandatory $5000 fine - to refuse to complete the census.

Now, suppose someone writes the following response for each question:

"This question is intentionally not being answered."

(Note that this is very different from simply refusing to turn in a Census form.)

Now, on what basis could that individual be arrested, indicted, and convicted, as those "answers" cannot be revealed to law enforcement?

 

[Amused]

According to the federal government, any information you disclose on the Census form cannot be revealed to law enforcement:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gRgnT7g-zoAKvFhJ0GE3J71ly_jQD9E81PA80

On the other hand, 13 USC Sec. 221 - the federal law on the Census - stipulates that it is a misdemeanor - a crime punishable by a mandatory $5000 fine - to refuse to complete the census.

Now, suppose someone writes the following response for each question:

"This question is intentionally not being answered."

(Note that this is very different from simply refusing to turn in a Census form.)

Now, on what basis could that individual be arrested, indicted, and convicted, as those "answers" cannot be revealed to law enforcement?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the ONLY answer you are obligated to give is the number of people in the household, right?

All the other new, intrusive questions are not mandatory, right?

 

[JSt0rm]

they will be shipped off to obama's gayafication camps for reeducation.

 

[werepossum]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the ONLY answer you are obligated to give is the number of people in the household, right?

All the other new, intrusive questions are not mandatory, right?

Judge Napolitano said on Fox that although the questions are not mandatory, there is a $100 fine for not answering each of them.

 

[HannibalX]

The Fed says that the information collected won't be used or shared with any other agency, unless they change their minds and say it's OK, which they have done in the past.

The Fed says the data will be stored in a secure computer system that unlike the IRS, FBI and various other Federal agencies, is impervious to hackers or angry employees stealing data - unless of course it isn't.

Article 1, Section 2 of the Constitution states:

[An] Enumeration shall be made within three Years after the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States, and within every subsequent Term of ten Years, in such Manner as they shall by Law direct.

The only question I will be answering is: How many people are living in your dwelling?

 

[Patranus]

Judge Napolitano said on Fox that although the questions are not mandatory, there is a $100 fine for not answering each of them.

I would like to see the federal government actually follow through on that one.
(aside from answering number of people)

 

[werepossum]

I would like to see the federal government actually follow through on that one.
(aside from answering number of people)

LOL Maybe, but I'll be following orders like a good little serf.

 

[boomerang]

Is there a question about race?

Is there a short census form and a long census form? Seems like in the past there were both. Some got one, some the other.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Is there a question about race?

Is there a short census form and a long census form? Seems like in the past there were both. Some got one, some the other.

There's no more short and long form. Now everyone gets the census (first link below). Over the next 10 years random people will get the American Community Survey (second link below). At first it will be about half the people, and eventually everyone will receive one.

http://2010.census.gov/2010census/how/interactive-form.php

http://www.census.gov/acs/www/Downloads/ACS-1%28info%29%282010%29%20Stateside%20English_web.pdf

 

[boomerang]

There's no more short and long form. Now everyone gets the census (first link below). Over the next 10 years random people will get the American Community Survey (second link below). At first it will be about half the people, and eventually everyone will receive one.

http://2010.census.gov/2010census/how/interactive-form.php

http://www.census.gov/acs/www/Downloads/ACS-1(info)(2010) Stateside English_web.pdf

Thanks

I resent the race question. How will we ever be equal if we still categorize each other?

I'm going to have serious issues with that long form.

 

[bob4432]

Judge Napolitano said on Fox that although the questions are not mandatory, there is a $100 fine for not answering each of them.

fuck napolitano :twisted:

 

[Jaskalas]

fuck napolitano :twisted:

As any Judge would he's merely telling you the law as (I assume) Congress wrote it. Maybe you should say fuck them instead.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Thanks

I resent the race question. How will we ever be equal if we still categorize each other?

I'm going to have serious issues with that long form.

Those that benefit from additional funding/programs that are based on race are not interested in equality. Only what they can get for being classified according to their race.

 

[Dissipate]

My Census forms are going into the paper shredder, the same place my last Jury Duty notice went.

 

[bob4432]

As any Judge would he's merely telling you the law as (I assume) Congress wrote it. Maybe you should say fuck them instead.

had a tourettes moment, just saw napolitano and thought of janet, retracting my "fuck napolitano" comment

 

[Patranus]

As any Judge would he's merely telling you the law as (I assume) Congress wrote it. Maybe you should say fuck them instead.

And what gives congress the authority to write such a law?

I see the part about a census for 'enumeration' but nothing else.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Thanks

I resent the race question. How will we ever be equal if we still categorize each other?

I'm going to have serious issues with that long form.

Yup. Already decided I'll fill out the basic census info, but 90% of the ACS gets returned with a 'I refuse to answer' message attached.

 

[nonlnear]

Thanks

I resent the race question. How will we ever be equal if we still categorize each other?

I'm going to have serious issues with that long form.

After reading and rereading the official definition of race backwards, forwards, cross-referencing with the other historical legal meanings of the term I have come to the conclusion that the current definitionis a convoluted way of saying "fill in whatever you want as long as you have a bona fide way to back it up":

The Census Bureau collects race data in accordance with guidelines provided by the U.S. Office of Management and Budget and these data are based on self-identification. The racial categories included in the census questionnaire generally reflect a social definition of race recognized in this country, and not an attempt to define race biologically, anthropologically or genetically. People may choose to report more than one race to indicate their racial mixture, such as “American Indian and White.” People who identify their origin as Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish may be of any race.

Of course the census bureau can't say that directly because that would delegitimize the question, but it's all there for anyone to see. It is NOT based on biology, anthropology, or genetics. Think about what that REALLY means. It is an entirely social construct - which is an inherently useless legal construct. To a judge that means "we the legislature can't come up with a coherent definition but - wink wink - you know what we mean, right?"

Given the lack of statutory definition and my personal contempt for "social constructs" I am forced to defer to the scientific consensus that my origins are in Africa. Sure some people might call me "white" but I have no use for such ignorant labels. I am, after all, post racial.

Choose African. It's the only answer that parses with a truly well-defined read of the legalese. Sure it requires the question to be parsed in a manner that amounts to reductio ad absurdum, but if the shoe fits...

 

[waggy]

they were talking about some fo the questions on the census form. They were questions like "how many bathrooms does your house have?" etc. now what does that have to do with what the census is?

 

[TruePaige]

Damn it people, fill out the American Community Survey, sometimes you go off on tangents and I'm not even sure what you are bitching about anymore.

 

[nonlnear]

...
Now, suppose someone writes the following response for each question:

"This question is intentionally not being answered."

Now, on what basis could that individual be arrested, indicted, and convicted, as those "answers" cannot be revealed to law enforcement?

data != metadata. It is only the answers you provide that can not be revealed. Any facts about the interview that the interviewer records are not your responses per se, and thus they are not protected.

 

[Patranus]

they were talking about some fo the questions on the census form. They were questions like "how many bathrooms does your house have?" etc. now what does that have to do with what the census is?

So you can get yours, haven't you seen or heard the commercials that are on TV/radio?

 

[Throckmorton]

I'm glad all you right wingers aren't answering the census. I don't want you counted anyway because you aren't true Americans.

 

[Patranus]

I'm glad all you right wingers aren't answering the census. I don't want you counted anyway because you aren't true Americans.

I think you missed the part where the "right wingers" are answering the number of people in the household just not the rest.

 

[ericlp]

Hmmm, I've never filled one out in my life. I file it in that big round thing next to the REST of the Junk Mail I get... It's called the Trash Can...