iPhone 5S/5C thread

[jpeyton]

At that point (iOS 10?), Apple will likely require 64-bit, which means iPhone 5C.

You mean 5S.

 

[Eug]

Yep. Thx. Post corrected.

 

[Bman123]

A couple people I know pre ordered the 5c at t mobile. I tried to tell them the 5s is wotyh the extra money but you already know no one listens when it congress to phones they just look at the price

 

[Eug]

Aside from price, nothing is wrong with the 5C, but both the 5C and 5S are expensive... I too prefer the 5S, even in terms of "value" but the bottom line is that the 5S is $100 more expensive, or $120 more expensive here in Canada.

Our pricing is $599 for the 16 GB 5C, but $719 for the 16 GB 5S.

 

[shady28]

Here are my thoughts on the iPhone 5C:

...

The 5C is not for me. It isn't for many people in this forum either. I would rather have a sleek black or the occasional white phone. I don't think the 5C is for grown men period. Women will eat it up. The affluent Asian market will eat it up. It is for the market that wants to be different from the rest.

What we can all learn from this is the following: The media gets it wrong when it comes to Apple ALL of the time. Even I ate it up, thinking Apple would release a cheaper version of the iPhone. Has Apple EVER done anything like this? ...

Whether that leads them to a downward spiral or they continue to gobble up 70% of the smartphone profits while only having 10% marketshare remains to be seen.

I agree with your basic sentiment but you're missing a few things here.

#1 : I don't really care what color my iPhone is. It's always black after I put it in a case. A lot of other people will realize this as well.

#2 : The vast majority of people buying an new iPhone in the US don't know and don't care what it cost. It is either 0, $99, or $199 on contract, same as an Android phone.

- The only reason to complain about iPhone prices if if you are buying one used for a no contract plan. iPhones have very good resale value. Most do not see this as a negative to purchasing a new model on contract.

#3 : Unlike when every other new iPhone has come out, the previous - gen hardware is being upgraded. ie, the 4S was not upgraded when the 5 came out. The 4 was not upgraded when the 4S came out. In fact, they had their capacities downgraded.

With the 5C you get :

- Better battery life
- Addtional 4G LTE frequencies


I think you are right that many will see the 5C as a "cute" phone for teenagers and women. I personally see it as a way to save a couple Benjamins.

The 800 pound gorilla in the corner is not this new hardware. It's IOS 7.

.

 

[scannall]

I'm looking forward to the review of the 5s. Between the new processor and iOS7, I'm thinking there are bigger things in store for it than just a phone.

 

[Crono]

I'm looking forward to the review of the 5s. Between the new processor and iOS7, I'm thinking there are bigger things in store for it than just a phone.

I'm thinking there will be some companion device features between it and the iWatch when it releases, probably health and fitness related functions. Which might be really good.

 

[sweenish]

I already hate having a two year old phone at the end of my contract. A three year old phone would be unbearable.

 

[desura]

Aside from price, nothing is wrong with the 5C, but both the 5C and 5S are expensive... I too prefer the 5S, even in terms of "value" but the bottom line is that the 5S is $100 more expensive, or $120 more expensive here in Canada.

Our pricing is $599 for the 16 GB 5C, but $719 for the 16 GB 5S.

Most people will see it as "twice as expensive" even though in reality it's more like "10% more expensive" when you factor in the total 2 year cost.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

I like everything about the 5S, except the screen. If they had bumped it up even to 4.3-4.5", I would have stayed put in Apple's camp.

As it stands, I will likely migrate to WP8.1 when Nokia/MSFT put out their next batch of phones. Really liking what Nokia does on the hardware side of things, and WP is a beautiful OS...albeit lacking in apps.

 

[bearxor]

I like everything about the 5S, except the screen. If they had bumped it up even to 4.3-4.5", I would have stayed put in Apple's camp.

As it stands, I will likely migrate to WP8.1 when Nokia/MSFT put out their next batch of phones. Really liking what Nokia does on the hardware side of things, and WP is a beautiful OS...albeit lacking in apps.

If Microsoft can get it's act together in the next year with regards to Windows Phone, I'll probably switch to the 1020 successor.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

If Microsoft can get it's act together in the next year with regards to Windows Phone, I'll probably switch to the 1020 successor.

They have no excuses not to execute at a breakneck pace next year to bring the feature set of the OS up to parity.

 

[pantsaregood]

This is an honest question, not an attack on Apple:

What is the purpose of the iPhone 5C, exactly? It is colorful - that's nice, but unextraordinary. I was under the impression that it was supposed to compete with high-quality, cheap phones in emerging markets (such as the Lumia 520 and LG Optimus L9), but the pricing doesn't reflect that at all.

Unlocked Nokia Lumia 520 sells at $175.
Unlocked LG Optimus L9 sells at $250.
Unlocked Apple iPhone 4S sells at $450.
Unlocked Apple iPhone 5C sells at $550.

I don't really see how that's going to compete in emerging markets, and Apple is starting to run out of time: Windows Phone is starting to grab up market share in emerging markets (on the back of the Lumia 520), and Android is already sitting at >70% share in most of those. I recall that Windows Phone recently broke 20% market share in Thailand, Vietnam, and Indonesia, and it is apparently doing quite well in Latin America. It has outsold iOS for three consecutive quarters in India, but it still only sits at ~5% market share there.

Does Apple have any interest in these markets? Oh well, at least they're unmatched in getting updates out to everyone. My Lumia 920 still hasn't received GDR2 because AT&T is relaxing.

 

[Eug]

The analysts gave you the impression the 5C was supposed to be the low cost phone for emerging markets. It turns out they were completely wrong. The 5C is just a cheaper-to-manufacture replacement for the now mid-tier 5, with a few minor improvements and nice colours.

The 4S is $450, but still not really a cheap phone. So, in essence, Apple hasn't really changed its sales model yet significantly. They have a mid-priced phone, a high priced phone, and a very high priced phone, which is the exactly the same as previous years.

I do think Apple will eventually need to do something more about the mid-end but I guess they've decided that time is not now. However, I don't think they will touch the low end in the foreseeable future.

As for the Lumia 520 at $175, I suspect they are making almost zero profit off the thing. It's MS pushing the phone to gain market share. That's exactly the opposite of Apple's practices. Some estimates put the 5C and 5S margin at over 50%, which is crazy high. Yet people still pay it. In fact I will still pay it even though I know I'm getting ripped off.

BTW, the model I will likely get is CAD$819 off-contract. Ouch.

 

[bearxor]

I think Apple is really counting on their China deals this year to increase their market penetration.

 

[Eug]

I think Apple is really counting on their China deals this year to increase their market penetration.

Yep, as the carriers are subsidizing the iPhone there now with these new deals.

 

[lothar]

This is an honest question, not an attack on Apple:

What is the purpose of the iPhone 5C, exactly? It is colorful - that's nice, but unextraordinary. I was under the impression that it was supposed to compete with high-quality, cheap phones in emerging markets (such as the Lumia 520 and LG Optimus L9), but the pricing doesn't reflect that at all.

Unlocked Nokia Lumia 520 sells at $175.
Unlocked LG Optimus L9 sells at $250.
Unlocked Apple iPhone 4S sells at $450.
Unlocked Apple iPhone 5C sells at $550.

I don't really see how that's going to compete in emerging markets, and Apple is starting to run out of time: Windows Phone is starting to grab up market share in emerging markets (on the back of the Lumia 520), and Android is already sitting at >70% share in most of those. I recall that Windows Phone recently broke 20% market share in Thailand, Vietnam, and Indonesia, and it is apparently doing quite well in Latin America. It has outsold iOS for three consecutive quarters in India, but it still only sits at ~5% market share there.

Does Apple have any interest in these markets? Oh well, at least they're unmatched in getting updates out to everyone. My Lumia 920 still hasn't received GDR2 because AT&T is relaxing.

The purpose of the iPhone 5C is to increase their profit margin.
It wouldn't surprise me to see that Apple will probably earn a higher profit margin on the iPhone 5C(on a percentage basis) than on the iPhone 5S.

 

[lothar]

Yep, as the carriers are subsidizing the iPhone there now with these new deals.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...sidy-on-apple-s-new-iphones-analysts-say.html
But the Chinese carriers are subsidizing it less, and less.
That's basically equivalent to the US carriers raising the price by 15% from $199 to $230 while still requiring the same 2 year contract.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...-iphones-for-china-s-two-smaller-carrers.html

The iPhone 5C will be priced between 4,488 yuan and 5,288 yuan, Apple said on its website. Grinnan said he had anticipated the new devices would cost between 2,500 yuan and 3,000 yuan.
The iPhone 5S will cost between 5,288 yuan and 6,888 yuan.
Xiaomi’s newest handset costs 1,999 yuan. Lenovo’s flagship K900 IdeaPhone sells for 3,299 yuan.
“The iPhone will still be a premium product in China,” Anand Ramachandran, a Hong Kong-based analyst with Barclays Plc., wrote in a report yesterday.

 

[Eug]

The purpose of the iPhone 5C is to increase their profit margin.
It wouldn't surprise me to see that Apple will probably earn a higher profit margin on the iPhone 5C(on a percentage basis) than on the iPhone 5S.

The margin on the 5C is higher percentage-wise according to some assessments. However, the profit per unit sold is higher on the 5S (since it's priced higher).

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

All about profit margin. 5C costs less than 5 to manufacture, and with the new ad campaign will probably sell more units to boot. Win-win for Apple.

5C has nothing to do with emerging markets, phone is way too expensive off contract.

 

[Crono]

AnandTech reviews are up for both devices.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7340/the-iphone-5c-review

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7335/the-iphone-5s-review

It looks like the 5c is pretty much what we expected, a iPhone 5 with a slightly larger battery in a colorful shell, but the 5s has the processor and camera improvements that make it worth considering for anyone upgrading from a 5 or earlier.

 

[foghorn67]

Embargo lifted!

 

[Ns1]

AnandTech reviews are up for both devices.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7340/the-iphone-5c-review

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7335/the-iphone-5s-review

It looks like the 5c is pretty much what we expected, a iPhone 5 with a slightly larger battery in a colorful shell, but the 5s has the processor and camera improvements that make it worth considering for anyone upgrading from a 5 or earlier.

holy shit that 5s review is a beast.

 

[lothar]

AnandTech reviews are up for both devices.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7340/the-iphone-5c-review

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7335/the-iphone-5s-review

It looks like the 5c is pretty much what we expected, a iPhone 5 with a slightly larger battery in a colorful shell, but the 5s has the processor and camera improvements that make it worth considering for anyone upgrading from a 5 or earlier.

I don't understand why Anandtech can't use the same phones in battery tests.
One moment you see them comparing the iPhone to top of the line Android showing that it loses, and the other moment the phone they were comparing it to in the next chart magically disappears. This is eerily similar to when Brian was conducting battery test on the HTC One and then all of a sudden HTC One got first place in LTE tests while comparing it to 2 year old phones.

All in all, the performance gains were much more than I expected.
Battery improvement over the iPhone 5 was a complete disappointment, despite the increased battery capacity. Not sure if that Motion chip is the culprit or iOS 7.
The iPhone 5S seems like a very worthwhile upgrade based on this review.
If you buy an iPhone 5C however, all you're doing at this point is wasting your money and padding Apple's pocket.

 

[Eug]

Anand sez:

"Granted we're comparing across platforms/browsers here, but the 5s as a platform does extremely well in Intel's favorite benchmark. The 5c by comparison performs a lot more like what we'd expect from a smartphone platform. The iPhone 5s is in a league of its own here. While I don't expect performance equalling the Atom Z3770 across the board, the fact that Apple is getting this close (with two fewer cores at that) is a testament to the work done in Cupertino."