iPhone 7

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Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
I made some comments elsewhere saying that it's difficult to use the 4" iPhones is some ways partially because of default font sizes and formatting of some apps. Well it looks like they addressing that to a certain extent in iOS 10. I have 10.0.1 installed right now on my 5S and the look is quite different in certain parts.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
I made some comments elsewhere saying that it's difficult to use the 4" iPhones is some ways partially because of default font sizes and formatting of some apps. Well it looks like they addressing that to a certain extent in iOS 10. I have 10.0.1 installed right now on my 5S and the look is quite different in certain parts.

Yeah I installed it on my 6+ and find that I like some changes and not others. I do not like the new lock screen where it will unlock the phone and then make me press the home button to get to the home screen. I liked it jumping right in after I unlocked it. Though I like the notifications better now and the new look for the news etc quick access panel available from the lock screen that I don't know the correct name of.
 

gypsyman

Senior member
Jan 14, 2001
674
9
81
Unlocked 6S plus 32gb direct from Apple $649.00

Unlocked not an option yet on the 7 plus 32gb Apple preorder $769.00.

Is the 7 plus worth the extra $120? Better camera, better processor, but wow, $769 plus tax is a chunk of change.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
Unlocked 6S plus 32gb direct from Apple $649.00

Unlocked not an option yet on the 7 plus 32gb Apple preorder $769.00.

Is the 7 plus worth the extra $120? Better camera, better processor, but wow, $769 plus tax is a chunk of change.
For $120 you're getting 1 GB extra RAM, dual-lens camera with zoom, 40% speed boost, W1 chip, better water resistance. And it'll probably be worth $100+ more resale in a year or two. Seems like a no brainer to me. Get the 7 Plus, unless you must have that headphone jack.
 
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TheStu

Moderator<br>Mobile Devices & Gadgets
Moderator
Sep 15, 2004
12,089
45
91
For $120 you're getting 1 GB extra RAM, dual-lens camera with zoom, 40% speed boost, W1 chip, better water resistance. And it'll probably be worth $100+ more resale in a year or two. Seems like a no brainer to me. Get the 7 Plus, unless you must have that headphone jack.

I'm about 99.9% certain, based on the language on Apple's website, that the W1 chip is _only_ inside things like the AirPods, or the new Beats 3s. It's not a co-processor for BT, nor is it a successor. It's the SOC for the headphones that handles not just the pairing, but also dealing with all the sensors inside the AirPods for seamless playback over a mono or stereo connection. My understanding is that if you only have 1 AirPod in, it won't just give you that side of the stereo playback, it pipes both to the 1 Pod. Then, when you put the other one into your ear, it returns it to true stereo playback.

Also, look at Apple's official device compatibility list, there are some old devices on there that definitely wouldn't have a W1 chip. The cross talk pairing is largely handled via iCloud, and requires the latest OSes.

The rest of your points regarding the value of a a 7+ compared to a 6s+ are valid and correct. I'd add that the 7 series also has stereo speakers, (highly probable) low level internal improvements to the design (think the internal reinforcements from 6 to 6s), a little more battery life, and a better display.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
I'm about 99.9% certain, based on the language on Apple's website, that the W1 chip is _only_ inside things like the AirPods, or the new Beats 3s. It's not a co-processor for BT, nor is it a successor. It's the SOC for the headphones that handles not just the pairing, but also dealing with all the sensors inside the AirPods for seamless playback over a mono or stereo connection. My understanding is that if you only have 1 AirPod in, it won't just give you that side of the stereo playback, it pipes both to the 1 Pod. Then, when you put the other one into your ear, it returns it to true stereo playback.

Also, look at Apple's official device compatibility list, there are some old devices on there that definitely wouldn't have a W1 chip. The cross talk pairing is largely handled via iCloud, and requires the latest OSes.

The rest of your points regarding the value of a a 7+ compared to a 6s+ are valid and correct. I'd add that the 7 series also has stereo speakers, (highly probable) low level internal improvements to the design (think the internal reinforcements from 6 to 6s), a little more battery life, and a better display.
Yes, I stand corrected about W1. I misunderstood Phil's comments and thought that it was only iPhone 7 or Apple Watch 2 compatible for the most advanced features.

What makes this even more confusing is before iPhone 6 the phones aren't even Bluetooth 4.2 compatible.

So is W1 an SoC that implements Bluetooth 5 like functionality in a proprietary way but is compatible with Bluetooth 4.0 devices running iOS 10? Or is it just an uber low power implementation of Bluetooth 4.0? Something else?

Good point about the stereo speakers too, and wide gamut display, as well as battery life.
 
Last edited:

Tweak155

Lifer
Sep 23, 2003
11,448
262
126
Unlocked 6S plus 32gb direct from Apple $649.00

Unlocked not an option yet on the 7 plus 32gb Apple preorder $769.00.

Is the 7 plus worth the extra $120? Better camera, better processor, but wow, $769 plus tax is a chunk of change.

That sounds odd because the 32gb 6s is supposed to drop to $549.
 

TheStu

Moderator<br>Mobile Devices & Gadgets
Moderator
Sep 15, 2004
12,089
45
91
So is W1 an SoC that implements Bluetooth 5 like functionality in a proprietary way but is compatible with Bluetooth 4.0 devices running iOS 10? Or is it just an uber low power implementation of Bluetooth 4.0? Something else?

I think it's closer to a BT 5 draft spec sort of scenario, but since it's draft they can't officially support it. That and handling all the sensors.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
The reviews are out.

Summary:
Excellent features and superfast completely lagfree phones running 2.33 GHz A10, way more interesting under the hood than what the uninspiring iterative form factor would suggest, along with signficantly improved battery life. Very nice camera, partnered with an excellent wide gamut display. Zoom is nice and low light shots are noticeably better. No optical image stabilization with telephoto though. Superfast and convenient AirPod pairing, but AirPod sound quality not bad, but iCloud pairing extension with other devices in the home doesn't work reliably. Home button is really annoying. No headphone jack is also somewhat annoying, and included Lightning earpods aren't great. Jet Black is a bad idea because it collects fingerprints like mad and scratches immediately. iOS 10 is great update, a significant step up from iOS 9.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/13/12895574/walt-mossberg-iphone-7-plus-review

https://www.engadget.com/2016/09/13/iphone-7-and-7-plus-review/

http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/0...w-great-annual-upgrades-with-one-major-catch/



 
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Tweak155

Lifer
Sep 23, 2003
11,448
262
126
The home button was my main wonder / concern when I placed the phone order. But, the description in your last link is pretty good and doesn't sound all too terrible. Guess I'll find out soon enough!
 

Kazukian

Platinum Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,034
650
91
I think moving to a solid state home button is a great idea, will take a little time to get used to, but I like the idea.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
Mine!



Unlocked 128 GB Silver iPhone 7 Plus

BTW, I haven't gotten an email yet from Apple indicating it's shipped, but I now have it in my Apple Support Profile, complete with serial number. No Axxxx number listed, and I don't know how to look that up from the serial number.
 

Midwayman

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
5,723
325
126
I think moving to a solid state home button is a great idea, will take a little time to get used to, but I like the idea.

Me too. I use activator to turn my 6s home button into effectively a clickless home. Having it be 3d touch would be even better. I got too used to clickless button on android. The clicky home seems like obsolete tech to me.
 

StinkyPinky

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2002
6,829
875
126
I don't know who designs their CPUs, but they deserve a medal. Apple cpu's are beast mode in the last couple of years. I'm not really sure you would notice it in the real world but from a tech nerd point of view it almost makes me want to get one just for the sake of nerd power.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
I don't know who designs their CPUs, but they deserve a medal. Apple cpu's are beast mode in the last couple of years. I'm not really sure you would notice it in the real world but from a tech nerd point of view it almost makes me want to get one just for the sake of nerd power.
A little under a decade ago, Apple bought a small fabless chip design company called PA Semiconductor. Strangely enough, they designed PowerPC type chips, which was confusing for Apple watchers because Apple had already switched to Intel. Steve Jobs later clarified than Apple just wanted their design skills not PPC. It turns out some of the big wigs there already had ARM design experience and Apple started designing its own ARM chips. The first chip that resulted from this acquisition was the Apple A4, which was in the original iPad and my beloved iPhone 4.

And as they say, the rest is history.
 
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slashbinslashbash

Golden Member
Feb 29, 2004
1,945
8
81
Yeah wow that CPU performance, amazing. 2X-3X performance of Android competitors, on a Google branded benchmark. Incredible. Also outperforms Snapdragon 820 devices on Multicore Geekbench despite only 2 cores ever being active at the same time on A10. Have to believe that Anand was involved in the development of that chip.

Mossberg's description of the AirPods makes me realize that while they are probably not for me, they are cooler than I thought at first. The carrying case has a battery, and it can be charged separately, and if (for example) you were on a long phone call using the AirPods, you could take out one ear, drop it in the case for 20 minutes and it will charge back up to 60% of capacity, then switch out the other ear and do the same thing. That's pretty darn cool IMO, and shows that a lot of thinking went into the AirPods to make them as utilitarian as possible.

The dual-lens camera looks awesome (always pisses me off when I have a decent view from a building or something, and I pull out the iPhone camera and the wide-angle lens makes everything distant look tiny). I hope that they put it into a future 4.7" screen phone, as I do not think that I can daily carry a 5.5" phone. (Currently have a work-assigned Galaxy Note as my second phone, and it's ungainly, although the AMOLED screen is pretty great when it comes to dynamic range.) I don't know what it is about those sample photos, but they look truly fantastic to me. The depth of the purple on the jerseys.... also I think there may just be a bit more DOF/bokeh effect due to the f/1.8 lens. Also since the lens is f/1.8 I guess there is probably a knock-on effect to shutter speed, making photos even less subject to motion blur, beyond the help of the OIS. Whatever it is, something about those photos "pops" for me in a way that most smartphone photos don't. I wish that the article would clarify that those are straight out of the phone's Camera app and not post-enhanced in any way.

I'm also hoping they can get TrueTone in the next generation of iPhones. For now, I am pretty happy with my 6S.
 
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Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,752
1,285
126
Yeah wow that CPU performance, amazing. 2X-3X performance of Android competitors, on a Google branded benchmark. Incredible. Also outperforms Snapdragon 820 devices on Multicore Geekbench despite only 2 cores ever being active at the same time on A10. Have to believe that Anand was involved in the development of that chip.

Mossberg's description of the AirPods makes me realize that while they are probably not for me, they are cooler than I thought at first. The carrying case has a battery, and it can be charged separately, and if (for example) you were on a long phone call using the AirPods, you could take out one ear, drop it in the case for 20 minutes and it will charge back up to 60% of capacity, then switch out the other ear and do the same thing. That's pretty darn cool IMO, and shows that a lot of thinking went into the AirPods to make them as utilitarian as possible.

The dual-lens camera looks awesome (always pisses me off when I have a decent view from a building or something, and I pull out the iPhone camera and the wide-angle lens makes everything distant look tiny). I hope that they put it into a future 4.7" screen phone, as I do not think that I can daily carry a 5.5" phone. (Currently have a work-assigned Galaxy Note as my second phone, and it's ungainly, although the AMOLED screen is pretty great when it comes to dynamic range.) I don't know what it is about those sample photos, but they look truly fantastic to me. The depth of the purple on the jerseys.... also I think there may just be a bit more DOF/bokeh effect due to the f/1.8 lens. Also since the lens is f/1.8 I guess there is probably a knock-on effect to shutter speed, making photos even less subject to motion blur, beyond the help of the OIS. Whatever it is, something about those photos "pops" for me in a way that most smartphone photos don't. I wish that the article would clarify that those are straight out of the phone's Camera app and not post-enhanced in any way.

I'm also hoping they can get TrueTone in the next generation of iPhones. For now, I am pretty happy with my 6S.
Just a note that the Google benchmark isn't really a great test of CPU architecture. They're mainly JavaScript as I understand it, and aren't well multi-threaded. Furthermore, they're heavily dependent on browser and OS optimization. So, they will favour platforms with fewer faster cores as opposed to those with lots of slower cores, and they also favour iOS, because of the heavy optimizations present in Safari for this. Thus, as a cross platform benchmark it's not great, but it's useful to compare iOS devices to other iOS devices, as long as they're running the same version of iOS.

Oh and while I know nothing about chip design, I'm thinking Anand might be working at Apple in some other capacity than hardcore chip design. But I'm just guessing.

As for the camera zoom, the one thing that pissed me off is that the zoom lens does NOT have optical image stabilization. Only the wide one does. Ming Chi Kuo predicts that the iPhone 8 in 2017 will have optical image stabilization for both lenses.
 

slashbinslashbash

Golden Member
Feb 29, 2004
1,945
8
81
Just a note that the Google benchmark isn't really a great test of CPU architecture. They're mainly JavaScript as I understand it, and aren't well multi-threaded. Furthermore, they're heavily dependent on browser and OS optimization. So, they will favour platforms with fewer faster cores as opposed to those with lots of slower cores, and they also favour iOS, because of the heavy optimizations present in Safari for this. Thus, as a cross platform benchmark it's not great, but it's useful to compare iOS devices to other iOS devices, as long as they're running the same version of iOS.

Oh and while I know nothing about chip design, I'm thinking Anand might be working at Apple in some other capacity than hardcore chip design. But I'm just guessing.

As for the camera zoom, the one thing that pissed me off is that the zoom lens does NOT have optical image stabilization. Only the wide one does. Ming Chi Kuo predicts that the iPhone 8 in 2017 will have optical image stabilization for both lenses.

About optimized browsers/OS.... 1) Google should be able to optimize Chrome/Android in the same way. The fact that they haven't either A) Shows the difficulty of doing so in general or B) Shows the difficulty of doing so on Android with its comparatively heterogenous hardware ecosystem, and thus shows a flaw of the Android philosophy. 2) Javascript benchmarks do tend to reflect real-world Javascript/webpage-rendering performance to a greater extent than, say, 3DMark represents real-world gaming performance. As a high-level, realtime-interpreted language, it's harder to optimize specifically for a given Javascript benchmark by adding special hooks in the hardware or OS than it is a benchmark written in a lower level language like C where memory, etc. is directly manipulated.

About Anand... his last few years on this site, his focus was more on the CPU/GPU deep dives, IIRC. While he may not be on the "hardcore" chip design team (layout or transistor design), I would be surprised if he weren't involved at a higher, chip architecture level.
 
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