Is it just me? Subaru BRZ = Enthusiast's dream car

[PricklyPete]

I hope the highest BRZ trim level still permits deletion of the spoiler.

Agreed...overall I think the car looks decent, but I hate that spoiler.

 

[thomsbrain]

Gimme a turbo with 280+ HP and I'm in. Until then, I'll stick with my S2000. BTW, if you want an easy engine bay to work in, look at the S2000's. You could stuff a dead body in there.

I do see this eventually becoming the next track toy of choice in the price range, once they get the power situation fixed.

 

[thomsbrain]

Regarding the two cars being the same, the biggest difference is the suspension tuning. The Scion is tuned for more neutral handling, while the Subaru is tuned for more understeer. The Scion is the driver's car of the pair, but if you're going to be replacing the suspension for track duty anyway, it doesn't matter which one you choose.

 

[exar333]

Regarding the two cars being the same, the biggest difference is the suspension tuning. The Scion is tuned for more neutral handling, while the Subaru is tuned for more understeer. The Scion is the driver's car of the pair, but if you're going to be replacing the suspension for track duty anyway, it doesn't matter which one you choose.

Bet you never thought you would ever say that!

 

[exar333]

Agreed...overall I think the car looks decent, but I hate that spoiler.

Yeah, I love Subaru but they make UGLY spoilers. If I didn't like the hatch more than the sedan anyway, there is no way I would purchase the STi sedan with the spoiler it comes with...UGLY!

 

[xSkyDrAx]

Regarding the two cars being the same, the biggest difference is the suspension tuning. The Scion is tuned for more neutral handling, while the Subaru is tuned for more understeer. The Scion is the driver's car of the pair, but if you're going to be replacing the suspension for track duty anyway, it doesn't matter which one you choose.

Where are you finding that the scion is more neutral and the subie is set for more understeer? Given that they're both RWD i would think they're more prone to oversteer?

 

[TechBoyJK]

Really liking this car. Want to see one in person.

What's a fully loaded model going to cost? When are they supposed to be available?

 

[OS]

yeah i'm reserving judgement until i see invoice and MSRP pricing on both the FRS and BRZ.
25K base MSRP would be baseline decent and then my opinion pretty much goes either way based on price.

 

[RiDE]

Where are you finding that the scion is more neutral and the subie is set for more understeer? Given that they're both RWD i would think they're more prone to oversteer?

I think it was this months issue of CAR or Top Gear that said it as well... can't remember which. I only remember that they were both $11. :hmm:

 

[TakeNoPrisoners]

Boring, now if it had a turbo or two...

 

[Kroze]

Really liking this car. Want to see one in person.

What's a fully loaded model going to cost? When are they supposed to be available?

The brz is coming out in spring. It cost a couple of grand more than the scion because it have more standard features such as HID and touchscreen navi. iWeb I asked the Subaru rep at the auto show, it should be around $25k

 

[GTaudiophile]

Re: Oil filter...

The BMWs my parents use to own use to have the oil filter accessible from the top like that. My dad has always changed his own oil and felt that this method was 100x easier and cleaner to work with than from underneath.

 

[Ketchup]

I think a turbo model is a question of when, and not if. We will probably see it as a 2014 model at the earliest.

 

[Ronstang]

I'm a car enthusiast and that is about as far from my dream car as it gets. Damn that is ugly.

 

[Howard]

Re: Oil filter...

The BMWs my parents use to own use to have the oil filter accessible from the top like that. My dad has always changed his own oil and felt that this method was 100x easier and cleaner to work with than from underneath.

Yep. They're a godsend, especially with the element-only style filter.

 

[mmntech]

I saw it at the Canadian Auto Show today. Couldn't get close enough to take any pictures unfortunately. People are getting stoked for it. It's certainly not a practical car, but if you can afford it, practicality goes out the window.

 

[alkemyst]

Is that the oil filter up top too? That would make a mess coming off. I'm not 100% sold on the style but it has potential to grow on me.

This is how the M3 is. As long as you drain the oil first, it's not so messy...just a few drops.

One of the worst cars to change was my 1996 Saturn SC2 and my wife's 2000 Saturn SL2. Getting to the filter was simple, pop the passenger tire off and remove the inner fender liner. However, it was on an angle that retained oil in it. You had to angle it back down to get it out spilling oil on the center X-member and all over your CV joint boot.

The field fix was to cut an oil bottle open and put it under the filter, it would funnel the oil around everything and into the pan.

 

[alkemyst]

IMHO it's going to be a lot like the Celica GTS only with rear wheel drive (finally).

It's going to be nearly impossible to mod this engine short of forced-induction.

I am sure it will be a fun car though.

 

[alkemyst]

Yeah, I don't understand it at all.

This has been a business model for a long time. Lincoln VS Ford VS Mercury or Pontiac VS Buick VS Olds, or Cadillac VS Chevrolet are a prime examples.

They target slightly demographics and that audience is profitable today even if you only capture 1%

 

[overst33r]

I like it much more than the typical ~$25k compact "sports" cars that are usually FWD variants based on economy cars.

That said, a Mustang V6 w/track pack will eat this thing alive on anything but parking lot autocross courses, and hence, that'd be what I'd buy if I was given $25k and told to buy a new performance car for that price. I'd probably look like an idiot in one anyway. I love Miatas as well, but I'm 6'4", and it looks like I'm auditioning for clown school when I'm in one.

Now, if a stock BRZ can beat a 5.1 0-60, 13s quarter, .98g lateral grip, then I'll come back and admit I was completely wrong.

You've got a valid point if you're looking at a sheet of paper. Toyota has stressed from inception that this car isn't about numbers. It's about the driver.

Chris Harris seems to support this notion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=romf-G6CZ7g&feature=player_embedded

I just can't see him that excited about a V6 Mustang In fact, I think the Mustang will handle like a wet noodle compared to this car.

 

[PricklyPete]

Re: Oil filter...

The BMWs my parents use to own use to have the oil filter accessible from the top like that. My dad has always changed his own oil and felt that this method was 100x easier and cleaner to work with than from underneath.

Yes, but the BMW's (like my current E46 M3) have a different filter assembly where you are replacing the internal filter/gaskets...not unscrewing the whole unit. Much less messy. My 2005 Tacoma had something similar to what is in the Subaru and it was potentially messy. Toyota provided a little "catch lip" witha drain plug to catch the oil coming out. If you weren't careful, this could still get messy. I usually drove a hole into the top of the filter canister to let it fully drain before pulling it off. No matter what, this is much easier than if the oil filter is located in some nook and cranny of the engine like it is in so many Japanese cars I've had to work on (I'm thinking my old Mazda and my wife's old Civic particularly).

 

[PricklyPete]

Yeah, I love Subaru but they make UGLY spoilers. If I didn't like the hatch more than the sedan anyway, there is no way I would purchase the STi sedan with the spoiler it comes with...UGLY!

Agreed. If I were to buy an STi...it would definitely be a Hatch...I hate the spoiler on the sedan.

 

[m0r1san]

Was just about to post Chris Harris' episode from Drive.

Personally, I haven't been so excited for a new car like this in a long time that was actually within my price-range. It has always taken a much more expensive car to get me this excited, like an M3, GT-R, Corvette, etc.

I'm at least 3 years out from getting a new car, but I was starting to worry for a little bit that cheap sub-3000lbs RWD sports cars were on their way out. There used to be some great cars in this range: S2000, RX-8, 240SX, MR-2, etc. Hell, even Mazda is having financial problems now and I worry the Miata will soon be history.

Every other <$25K RWD competitor looks "fat" to me. I drive my wife's V6 Mustang every once and a while. It's an amazing car for road-trips and general cruising around, but the cockpit is just way too relaxed for serious driving... the wheel is big, the clutch is heavy as hell, the shifter is clunky and the center console is awkwardly high for me. It just doesn't feel very driver-oriented like say an RX-8 would. I've done a fair bit of playing around with this car in parking lots, etc, and the most "unsettling" thing about it is hitting a bump with the rear tires while going into a turn at the limit. Total lack of control and rubber screeching ensues. I really get the feeling that the money allocation in this <$25k sports car is going to the motor and all that heavy sheet metal and other various over-sized parts. **Her's is a 2007, so maybe all this has been fixed in more recent models.

If someone gave me a list of how much sheet metal costs, transmissions, engines, suspension, glass, etc parts cost and said "build a fun RWD car for under $25K", I have a feeling I'd end up with something like the BRZ/FR-S.

 

[alkemyst]

If someone gave me a list of how much sheet metal costs, transmissions, engines, suspension, glass, etc parts cost and said "build a fun RWD car for under $25K", I have a feeling I'd end up with something like the BRZ/FR-S.

Yeah, I agree. Best to put profit ahead of anything else in mass production.

In low production, nothing would touch this at $25k, but why target that?

 

[JulesMaximus]

Looks good. Might have to test drive one of these when they hit showrooms.