Is Microsoft playing a dangeous game of chicken with the internet? (XP)

[Savatar]

...
GNU/Linux takes care of itself. You literally have to do nothing but press the upgrade button that's sitting in the panel. Every single package gets upgraded through that system, including the core system....

The linux distributions that I've used work similarly to Windows in that regard. They actually do go 'out of support' and will only update to the latest supported version of the packages on the official repositories, not the _actual_ latest version of the packages that you have installed. So there are often many bugs still un-patched even on a fully updated linux system... it mostly depends on how recent your distribution is... but also how up-to-date they keep their repositories. It's harder to keep a linux system up-to-date than a Windows system because of that.

As an example, let's take a look at Ubuntu's support cycle - since it is one of the most popular distributions that should be a relatively fair baseline. Standard Ubuntu releases are only supported for 9-18 months... and LTS (long-term support) releases (which occur about once every 2 years) are supported for 5 years. http://www.ubuntu.com/info/release-end-of-life

Canonical doesn't fix the bugs that are identified after the support life-cycle is over.

Let's be fair here,... Windows XP was released in 2001, about 13 years ago!!! In my opinion, Microsoft has done a great job supporting XP, but an average job of encouraging users to upgrade along the way.

There are some ways that upgrading the OS should be more streamlined with notifications that a new versions of Windows is out on Windows Update, but they're not there yet. Eventually, I do think (and hope) that the operating system upgrade process will be more streamlined... this will help users stay up to date and be more secure online.

 

[lxskllr]

The linux distributions that I've used work similarly to Windows in that regard. They actually do go 'out of support' and will only update to the latest supported version of the packages on the official repositories, not the _actual_ latest version of the packages that you have installed. So there are often many bugs still un-patched even on a fully updated linux system... it mostly depends on how recent your distribution is.

As an example, let's take a look at Ubuntu's support cycle - since it is one of the most popular distributions that should be a relatively fair baseline. Standard Ubuntu releases are only supported for 9-18 months... and LTS (long-term support) releases (which occur about once every 2 years) are supported for 5 years. http://www.ubuntu.com/info/release-end-of-life

Canonical doesn't fix the bugs that are identified after the support life-cycle is over.

Yea, but it'll in-place upgrade to the newest version, and that won't require thought. No one supports software forever, nor should they. XP is long out of date. Ubuntu didn't even exist when XP was released. I don't expect MS to support XP, same as don't expect Canonical to support Ubuntu 5.10(the first Ubuntu I used).

 

[Savatar]

Yea, but it'll in-place upgrade to the newest version, and that won't require thought. No one supports software forever, nor should they. XP is long out of date. Ubuntu didn't even exist when XP was released. I don't expect MS to support XP, same as don't expect Canonical to support Ubuntu 5.10(the first Ubuntu I used).

Ahh, I've never went through that... I have always manually re-formatted and re-install later versions before I've ever gotten a message to do that.

Windows upgrades aren't known for being very 'smooth', so people still encourage users to completely re-install from scratch.

 

[lxskllr]

Windows upgrades aren't known for being very 'smooth', so people still encourage users to completely re-install from scratch.

I'd be lying if I said I could guarantee a flawless Ubuntu upgrade every time, but I've never had problems. I don't think it would be too much to ask for "granny" to take her machine to a shop every two to five years, and pay them $100 to upgrade the machine for her. We're talking dumb end users here. It isn't hard for someone to do it themselves if they chose to, even with only modest technical ability.

 

[imagoon]

Windows upgrades aren't known for being very 'smooth', so people still encourage users to completely re-install from scratch.

Well... 1500 PCs and 200 servers monthly says otherwise here. Update issues hit maybe 1 device a month if that?

 

[Savatar]

Well... 1500 PCs and 200 servers monthly says otherwise here. Update issues hit maybe 1 device a month if that?

My apologies, I meant upgrading to newer Windows versions. For example, from Windows XP to Windows 7 or something like that... not applying Windows Updates (that doesn't currently upgrade to new operating system versions).

 

[imagoon]

My apologies, I meant upgrading to newer Windows versions. For example, from Windows XP to Windows 7 or something like that... not applying Windows Updates (that doesn't currently upgrade to new operating system versions).

Ah makes sense. I seem to have ok luck on the server OS's but yes, user systems are often easier to level and rebuild.

 

[powerhouse65]

XP - bury it and give it a rest. RIP

That said, Microsoft needs money, which they hope to make from ending Windows XP support and selling Windows 7/8 licenses.
For users it's an opportunity to reassess the need and perhaps switch OS - e.g. Linux, Chrome OS, iOS etc.

 

[Imaginer]

Yea, but it'll in-place upgrade to the newest version, and that won't require thought. No one supports software forever, nor should they. XP is long out of date. Ubuntu didn't even exist when XP was released. I don't expect MS to support XP, same as don't expect Canonical to support Ubuntu 5.10(the first Ubuntu I used).

Windows, in the past, I used the in place upgrade, no re-format and install as users have habitually done. I moved from XP to 7 on a Core 2 system with no issues. Similarly, only one issue with 7 to 8 because of the Asmedia USB 3 controller that on using 8 will disconnect and reconnect my external drive frequently, a driver updated for 8 resolved it.

 

[Remobz]

XP - bury it and give it a rest. RIP

That said, Microsoft needs money, which they hope to make from ending Windows XP support and selling Windows 7/8 licenses.
For users it's an opportunity to reassess the need and perhaps switch OS - e.g. Linux, Chrome OS, iOS etc.

At home my desktop runs Windows 7 home and my laptop runs Windows 8 (not ready to upgrade to 8.1 yet).

Only my work computer had Windows Xp pro sp2 ever since it came out years ago.

Well, as of the past 2 weeks I have officially upgraded to Windows 7 professional for my work computer. Windows XP pro has become officially dead to me. I will hold a funeral this weekend for it...lol!!

 

[lxskllr]

Windows, in the past, I used the in place upgrade, no re-format and install as users have habitually done. I moved from XP to 7 on a Core 2 system with no issues. Similarly, only one issue with 7 to 8 because of the Asmedia USB 3 controller that on using 8 will disconnect and reconnect my external drive frequently, a driver updated for 8 resolved it.

I'm talking about through the network, and using the built in package manager. There's no good reason to download a whole iso, write it to some kind of media, then boot to it to upgrade. Ubuntu will let you know there's a new release available, and you upgrade from the desktop. Same as you would a browser.

 

[Imaginer]

I'm talking about through the network, and using the built in package manager. There's no good reason to download a whole iso, write it to some kind of media, then boot to it to upgrade. Ubuntu will let you know there's a new release available, and you upgrade from the desktop. Same as you would a browser.

When I did 7 to 8, it was a run of an executable in Windows. No ISO needed. XP to 7, I had a retail upgrade disk. 8 to 8.1, ran through the store.

I never needed to push a local network install on local machines, even if I have a local LAN. I do not have the number of workstations that would be significant to do so. Windows's enterprise solutions and server solutions I believe offer the network updates.

 

[ultimatebob]

I remember people making the same fuss about Windows 2000. And Windows 98. And Windows NT 4 before that. I mean... how DARE Microsoft stop offering security patch support for this software that we stopped selling 5 years ago? The nerve, I tell ya!

Ya know what? Most people quit bitching and eventually ponied up for a software upgrade. A brave few switched to Linux, and are probably complaining to Red Hat about their 10 year software lifecycle policies instead

 

[Zargon]

What I'm wondering is - is there any possibility MS will end up extending the extended support period for Windows 7?
If Windows 8 continues to fail to take off, won't 7 be in the same position as XP was with respect to Vista?

Bugs me that if I go for 7 now there's only 6 years support left (but if I choose 8, then I get 3 more years, but have to deal with metro).

WHAT FREAKING HARDWARE ARE YOU RUNNING????


in 6 years a new PC will be slower than a current smartphone/tablet.

you'll be due for a hardware refresh before win7 support sunsets

 

[pmv]

WHAT FREAKING HARDWARE ARE YOU RUNNING????


in 6 years a new PC will be slower than a current smartphone/tablet.

you'll be due for a hardware refresh before win7 support sunsets

Maybe, maybe not. I used to upgrade every couple of years, but last machine lasted 7 years before I had to actually change the motherboard (OK, everything else changed more than once, but windows OEM only cares about the motherboard). Dunno if going so long on the same PC is 'cos I'm getting old or because the PC market is.

Edit - course, you may be right that 6 years is a long time in computing-world, but I just don't like the idea of the timer ticking down so explicitly.

 

[Virgorising]

Microsoft essentially said bye-bye to XP in March 2011 when they didn't make IE9 compatible with XP. I hate to see it go. It was the first user-friendly multi-core operating system and compared to it's predecessors it was stable as a rock. Pre-service packs it wasn't much of a resource hog. You could run it decently with 128 Megs of ram but for the last few years I wouldn't sell an XP machine without atleast a gig of ram. A lot of that blame can be put on modern browsers eating a lot of resources though.

I agree with all of the above, even tho I moved on long ago. XP was a quantum leap forward.

 

[Virgorising]

Maybe, maybe not. I used to upgrade every couple of years, but last machine lasted 7 years before I had to actually change the motherboard (OK, everything else changed more than once, but windows OEM only cares about the motherboard). Dunno if going so long on the same PC is 'cos I'm getting old or because the PC market is.

Edit - course, you may be right that 6 years is a long time in computing-world, but I just don't like the idea of the timer ticking down so explicitly.

:thumbsup:

I despise feeling a victim of commerce, ever.

And your "going so long" is no way a manifestation of YOUR getting older.
Nor is it for the infinite businesses thruout the world who will still be running XP after April.

Tho I think that is very unsafe, people will go on running it.

 

[nemesismk2]

Just saw on THG about Microsoft Ending Anti-Virus Protection for Windows XP. If you ask me that is a good idea for people because let's be honest here Microsoft Security Essentials is useless for virus protection.

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/no-more-xp-av,news-18190.html

Well i have already moved from Microsoft by upgrading my Windows 7 computer to Ubuntu and Windows XP to Ubuntu. Yes i will never be buying another Microsoft Operating System again.

 

[Virgorising]

You can still get support and patches from MS after April...just gotta pay. My company is in the middle of Win7 rollout that won't be done by then. Due to the nature of our business and regulators we can't go unsupported. We just cut a check in the millions to Microsoft for extended, extended support. As long as you have a migration to Vista, Win7 or Win7 in process, Microsoft will support your XP PCs, it just ain't cheap.

I heard about this like over a year ago, didn't quite believe it, I do now. That I first didn't.....means I can be naive.

 

[nemesismk2]

I heard about this like over a year ago, didn't quite believe it, I do now. That I first didn't.....means I can be naive.

"You can still get support and patches from MS after April...just gotta pay. My company is in the middle of Win7 rollout that won't be done by then. Due to the nature of our business and regulators we can't go unsupported. We just cut a check in the millions to Microsoft for extended, extended support. As long as you have a migration to Vista, Win7 or Win7 in process, Microsoft will support your XP PCs, it just ain't cheap."

I have never heard of this as well

 

[escrow4]

Just saw on THG about Microsoft Ending Anti-Virus Protection for Windows XP. If you ask me that is a good idea for people because let's be honest here Microsoft Security Essentials is useless for virus protection.

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/no-more-xp-av,news-18190.html

Well i have already moved from Microsoft by upgrading my Windows 7 computer to Ubuntu and Windows XP to Ubuntu. Yes i will never be buying another Microsoft Operating System again.

On the contrary, MSE is fine if you have half a brain and are aware of what you click on. As for Linux, if I just built a grunty $2K Haswell box with some SSDs (and I did last month) I can't be bothered trusting some random Linux distro that everything will work out of the box at 100%. I'd easily pay an extra $120 for a copy of 8.1, no hesitation. Moan all you want about Microsoft, their OS works. Period.

 

[Virgorising]

On the contrary, MSE is fine if you have half a brain and are aware of what you click on. As for Linux, if I just built a grunty $2K Haswell box with some SSDs (and I did last month) I can't be bothered trusting some random Linux distro that everything will work out of the box at 100%. I'd easily pay an extra $120 for a copy of 8.1, no hesitation. Moan all you want about Microsoft, their OS works. Period.

I ditto all of the above, and few are more cynical re MS than I. I always go third party, but Ketchup79 here, an uber pundit, runs only MSE. That means sumthin.

Congrats the Haswell rig! :wub:

 

[Virgorising]

Forced obsolescence is the name of the game. It's why Office 2013 / 365 only work on Windows 7 and 8. Why else, because writing words on a page or calculating a row of figures is terribly advanced stuff? Can anyone remember some huge leap forward in Office functionality because it took advantage of new Windows features? Same goes for IE's history.

Alas, serious truths in the above. Tho also true, W7 brings some very impressive improvements over XP. W8, I would rather eat worms.

 

[Doppel]

Been using win7 at home for a few years but at work only this past week did I get changed to 7 when I got a new PC. I never felt like I was missing anything. It was a great OS. Since I am now combining machines only now am I retiring a machine with server 2003 on it as well.

 

[nemesismk2]

I was just sent this link from one if my friends from India:-

Microsoft is readying an urgent patch for Windows XP on this month's patch on Tuesday, restricting attackers from completely taking over the affected computers.

According to a Symantec blog post, successful exploits will result in complete compromise of affected computers and patching of XP will make it less vulnerable.

Attackers are known to execute arbitrary code with kernel privileges and according to Microsoft; the same problem affects Windows Server 2003.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...-patch-for-windows-xp-next-week/1/335781.html