Is poverty voluntary?

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Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86
So finding old Census data on Merced was a pain in the ass.
Here is something that helps.

http://censusviewer.com/city/CA/Merced

http://merced.areaconnect.com/statistics.htm

Both are annoying in how they lay out the data. The first link combines white with Hispanic. You have to go down and see where they talk about Hispanic or Latino origin to see the break down.

The 2nd is just as bad, but they do have this.

Hispanic or Latino and race
Total Population 63893 100.00%
Hispanic or Latino(of any race) 26425 41.36%
Mexican 22616 35.4%
Puerto Rican 200 0.31%
Cuban 44 0.07%
Other Hispanic or Latino 3565 5.58%
Not Hispanic or Latino 37468 58.64%
White alone 24121 37.75%

Either way, its about the best I can find, and it shows not much has changed. 9th grade was 2001-2002 so not a world of change in 13 years.



My mom was a single mom and received both SSI (Supplemental Security Income) and SSID (Social Security disability insurance). By no means was I not poor. There were 2 main differences. One was that I was not okay with being poor for the rest of my life if I could change it. If I came across any money, I would not blow it on drugs or alcohol. Most of my friends and peers started drinking and doing drugs around 12, and I wanted to spend my money on better things.

The main difference was that I became smart around my 2nd 7th grade year. I was always thought to have a learning disability up until that point. I almost was not allowed to pass the 4th grade because my standardized scores were 2-3 grades behind. Eventually, I was not able to pass 7th grade. I ended up moving that year, so when I did 7th grade again I lived in Merced. Something clicked, because by the end of that year, I was scoring in the 90th percentile. It was very strange, because I knew it was happening. One of the hardest things growing up was pushing my friends to not give up, and them giving me the excuse that I did not know what it was like to be dumb.

I just went to the Merced wiki page.
It shows that in 2000 a quarter of the pop was Hispanic. It did a big jump after that because of a huge influx of farm workers

Ya, your relationship with your friends was weird.
I had good friends in the sweat hog class but I'm pretty sure them being dumb never came up and certainly they never thought that they were limited by that.
I can think of at least a couple who are millionaires now
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
I just went to the Merced wiki page.
It shows that in 2000 a quarter of the pop was Hispanic. It did a big jump after that because of a huge influx of farm workers

Ya, your relationship with your friends was weird.
I had good friends in the sweat hog class but I'm pretty sure them being dumb never came up and certainly they never thought that they were limited by that.
I can think of at least a couple who are millionaires now

Someone needs to update the wiki page then. The link to the source gives you the same data I used.

http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=CF

HISPANIC OR LATINO AND RACE
Total population 63,893 100.0%
Hispanic or Latino (of any race) 26,425 41.4%
Mexican 22,616 35.4%
Puerto Rican 200 0.3%
Cuban 44 0.1%
Other Hispanic or Latino 3,565 5.6
Not Hispanic or Latino 37,468 58.6
White alone 24,121 37.8

As I explained, they are mixing white with Hispanic and Latino. The US census does this, and its a bit misleading to someone who is not from this country. The person that put in the line about only 26.4% of the population being Hispanic or Latino is obviously wrong, as Mexican made up 35.4% alone. The population grew by about 23% from 2000 until the current population of the city.

I would imagine you grew up in a very different place than I did. The reason it came up, is because I tried to show them that they could get out of that town, and have a better life.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
I think the monetary system needs to be aboloished

Getting rid of using money in human civilization?

Something that has been central to human civilization for millennia in various forms of government including noncapitalist governments like communism and authoritarianism? Something that has never been done once yet in any large community, culture, or civilization?

Where do I sign up?
 

Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86
Someone needs to update the wiki page then. The link to the source gives you the same data I used.

http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?src=CF

HISPANIC OR LATINO AND RACE
Total population 63,893 100.0%
Hispanic or Latino (of any race) 26,425 41.4%
Mexican 22,616 35.4%
Puerto Rican 200 0.3%
Cuban 44 0.1%
Other Hispanic or Latino 3,565 5.6
Not Hispanic or Latino 37,468 58.6
White alone 24,121 37.8

As I explained, they are mixing white with Hispanic and Latino. The US census does this, and its a bit misleading to someone who is not from this country. The person that put in the line about only 26.4% of the population being Hispanic or Latino is obviously wrong, as Mexican made up 35.4% alone. The population grew by about 23% from 2000 until the current population of the city.

I would imagine you grew up in a very different place than I did. The reason it came up, is because I tried to show them that they could get out of that town, and have a better life.

Ya, the old White Hispanic or Latino or Black Hispanic or Latino thing. It's pretty misleading to lots of American posters here

I did grow up somewhere different, racism isn't such a big deal here
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
What theory?

Did you even read what I had said?

Trying to use DNA in that fashion is a fools errand.

From the original article.

Instead, the two studies both concluded the ancestors of living East Asians had likely bred with Neanderthals more than once. “The key idea is that there would have to have been some additional interbreeding events involving East Asians, but not Europeans,” Lohmueller told the Daily Mail last week. "These interbreeding events could have been directly between Neanderthals and East Asians, maybe in some other indirect way."

Oh yeah an "interbreeding event" whatever that is, because they don't know. Nobody knows jack shit about our ancestry from that time. This is where DNA blurs with history but is a shitty replacement. Fact is simply this: We don't know.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
Oh yeah an "interbreeding event" nobody knows jack shit about our ancestry from that time. This is where DNA blurs with history but is a shitty replacement. Fact is simply this: We don't know.

There are infinite possibilities.

But their science is not some shit they just made up while drinking shots of rum and smoking weed on the weekend.

The science of genetics and biology are only just starting to get understood and there is so much more we have yet to discover and fully understand.

There could have been another interbreeding event or there could have been some interbreeding even between Europeans and Africans that reduced how much Neanderthal ancestry was in European populations.

You have lots of material you can read on the subject of genetics.

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/

Like this article from only a few days ago.

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2015/05/neandertal-in-immediate-family-tree.html
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
There are infinite possibilities.

But their science is not some shit they just made up while drinking shots of rum and smoking weed on the weekend.

The science of genetics and biology are only just starting to get understood and there is so much more we have yet to discover and fully understand.

There could have been another interbreeding event or there could have been some interbreeding even between Europeans and Africans that reduced how much Neanderthal ancestry was in European populations.

You have lots of material you can read on the subject of genetics.

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/

Like this article from only a few days ago.

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2015/05/neandertal-in-immediate-family-tree.html
So what are some concrete facts that they know 100% for sure.

One of Europe’s earliest known humans had a close Neanderthal ancestor: perhaps as close as a great-great-grandparent.

Weak sauce.

They estimate that 5–11% of the bone's genome is Neanderthal, including large chunks of several chromosomes.

Moar weaksauce.

You get the idea. Its shit. There is nothing substantial to be gleened from this type of research. Move on. Reading twilight is a more academic exercise.
 
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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
Ya, the old White Hispanic or Latino or Black Hispanic or Latino thing. It's pretty misleading to lots of American posters here

I did grow up somewhere different, racism isn't such a big deal here

Its Canada. You will find racism is not much of a thing when most of the people are the same.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
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So what are some concrete facts that they know 100% for sure.

Ahh.

So you are one of those guys who believes that everything is 100% yes or no and even worse at this very time type of guy.

Absolutism has often had very horrible effects not only on humanity but also on all of the biosphere.
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
Ahh.

So you are one of those guys who believes that everything is 100% yes or no and even worse at this very time type of guy.

Absolutism has often had very horrible effects not only on humanity but also on all of the biosphere.

Do you have any idea how bad "pretty sure 5-11%" is for an error bar? Pretty shitty. You're just upset that psuedo science that amounts to borderline fiction isn't all that concrete. There is NOTHING to be gleaned from that kind of uncertainty.
 

Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91

It depends where you live. Facepalm.

Canada is diverse but regionally divided. They speak French in Quebec FFS. The US isn't divided like that.

I swear its like some kind of retard disorder going around that people think the first link in their google search results is the complete answer to everything.

I would imagine staying within one region of Canada gives the impression that you are in a culturally homogeneous area. Who are you to argue that with your stupid link?

From your article

A caution: Cultural diversity is a different concept than ethnic diversity. As a result, a map of the world reflecting ethnic diversity looks somewhat different than the one based on Goren’s cultural diversity measure that combines language and ethnicity profiles of a country.

So its mostly the fact that several languages are represented in Canada skewing the study in that direction.

Critical thinking, the new superpower.
 
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norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
Do you have any idea how bad "pretty sure 5-11%" is for an error bar? Pretty shitty. You're just upset that psuedo science that amounts to borderline fiction isn't all that concrete. There is NOTHING to be gleaned from that kind of uncertainty.

You are quite ignorant. It is obvious you do not even have a basic understanding about genetic science and what they are actually doing and how they come up with their data and theories.
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
You are quite ignorant. It is obvious you do not even have a basic understanding about genetic science and what they are actually doing and how they come up with their data and theories.

Well then you'd be surprised.

The equations they use to assemble phylogenetic trees and to establish a common ancestor are rubbish.

Although phylogenetic trees produced on the basis of sequenced genes or genomic data in different species can provide evolutionary insight, they have important limitations. Most importantly, they do not necessarily accurately represent the evolutionary history of the included taxa. In fact, they are literally scientific hypotheses, subject to falsification by further study (e.g., gathering of additional data, analyzing the existing data with improved methods). The data on which they are based is noisy; the analysis can be confounded by genetic recombination,[9] horizontal gene transfer,[10] hybridisation between species that were not nearest neighbors on the tree before hybridisation takes place, convergent evolution, and conserved sequences.

Which is why the conclusions to the studies you are a fan of are all over the place. Its not the method that is at fault. Its that people are trying to read between the lines to try and form some sort of hypothetical narrative based on what is essentially statistical noise.

Its garbage man. Go read twilight. There are more science facts in twilight I'd reckon.
 
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ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,324
15,123
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It depends where you live. Facepalm.

Canada is diverse but regionally divided. They speak French in Quebec FFS. The US isn't divided like that.

I swear its like some kind of retard disorder going around that people think the first link in their google search results is the complete answer to everything.

I would imagine staying within one region of Canada gives the impression that you are in a culturally homogeneous area. Who are you to argue that with your stupid link?

From your article



So its mostly the fact that several languages are represented in Canada skewing the study in that direction.

Critical thinking, the new superpower.

So when the paper also linked to a study analyzing ethnic diversity which also showed Canada to be more diverse than the US, you used exactly what critical thinking skills or is that a super power you don't posses?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-most-and-least-ethnically-diverse-countries/
 

Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86
It depends where you live. Facepalm.

Canada is diverse but regionally divided. They speak French in Quebec FFS. The US isn't divided like that.

I swear its like some kind of retard disorder going around that people think the first link in their google search results is the complete answer to everything.

I would imagine staying within one region of Canada gives the impression that you are in a culturally homogeneous area. Who are you to argue that with your stupid link?

French is Canada's second language
Canada would be like the US, in that within certain regions you might get the impression that you are in a culturally homogeneous area.
Just not as much as in the US
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
So when the paper also linked to a study analyzing ethnic diversity which also showed Canada to be more diverse than the US, you used exactly what critical thinking skills or is that a super power you don't posses?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-most-and-least-ethnically-diverse-countries/

Yea you clicked a foot note congrats.

How people perceive ethnicity, both their own and that of others, can be tough to measure, particularly given that it's so subjective.

Its only like the third sentence. This is stupid.

It basically boils down to people skimming something and thinking they are experts. Because they are real world topics they are much more nuanced than that. But you guys skim and suddenly we're all experts. I'm not the one shoving links in peoples faces, FWIW.
 

Orignal Earl

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2005
8,059
55
86
It basically boils down to people skimming something and thinking they are experts. Because they are real world topics they are much more nuanced than that. But you guys skim and suddenly we're all experts. I'm not the one shoving links in peoples faces, FWIW.

I'm no expert by any means, I've just read several such posts over at reddit
 
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
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Its Canada. You will find racism is not much of a thing when most of the people are the same.

As of several years ago the white (European-Canadian) population of Canada was approx. 76% while for the US it was approx. 72%.

In 2011 the urban area I live in was just over 46% European Canadian and roughly 52% 'visible minorities' with South Asian, East and SouthEast Asians forming roughly 38% of the total population.

Now, what was that about most [Canadian] people being just the same.

btw, our immigration rate/100,000 is roughly double that of the U.S. (5.66/100,000 compared to 2.45/100,000) and most of those do not come from Europe.
 
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