Is RAID 1 underrated?

fpbear

Member
Aug 19, 2007
38
0
61
I see a lot of enthusiasts are setting up RAID 0, but I am wondering if RAID 1 is overlooked too often, and I would like to learn more about whether it offers a noticeable performance boost with concurrent access. For example, editing a video while running a virus scan at the same time. In this case with the data mirrored on both drives, the virus scan can access one drive while the other is free of any serial bottleneck. Of course this is an oversimplified example, but the general idea is similar to processor manufacturers shifting their focus from clock speed to multiple cores for paralllel execution.

Is this benefit only seen with expensive dedicated hardware controller cards? Or does RAID 1 also show a performance boost with onboard controllers such as the ICH9R?

Even if it is only half the performance boost of RAID 0 (according to some benchmarks), any kind of performance boost out of RAID 1 would make it well worth considering, given the data protection it offers.
 

tcrosson

Senior member
Oct 24, 1999
308
0
0
Raid 1 will act like Raid 0 when the drive is reading data (reads partly from each drive).

You will see a minor (but probably not a noticeable) performance hit when writing since the data has to be written twice.

I would say Raid 1 is very underrated especially considering all of the data people have on their drives now (games, movies, music, school stuff, etc).

 

yinan

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2007
1,801
2
71
I do kind of a ghetto RAID 10 setup. What I do for all my data is have to HUGE (1 TB+) arrays that are set up in RAID level 0, then every couple of days or so I use robocopy or vice versa pro to sync the 2 sets of data. This also protects me if I accidentally delete something, I can always go and retrieve it from the second array.

I suppose I could script it to sync the data daily but I havent gotten around to it yet.

Jim
 

Phrontis

Member
Dec 8, 2004
28
0
0
Raid 1 is a disk mirror. The data is written or read to both disks at the same time, so in theory the raid array sould perform the same as a single disk. Both disks have the same data on them, if one goes down then you you can remove that disk, put in another and copy or rebuild the array onto the new disk therefor saving all of your data. Its used to protect data not perform faster. The thought of yinans 1TB array in raid 0 fills me with horror, if just one disk goes down all of the data since the last copy has gone. If its written over the same drives ,as it sounds like it is, all of the data will have gone. If you want fast performance buy faster disks, but mirror them for data security. Look at the spec on my PC on my post on upgrading. Phrontis
 

fpbear

Member
Aug 19, 2007
38
0
61
Phrontis, what I find curious and puzzling is why half the articles say that RAID 1 read performance is the same as a single disk, and the other half say that the performance improves because pieces of the data can be fetched from either disk, especially during concurrent access.

That is at the center of what I'm trying to figure out in this thread.

Maybe it depends on the controller how well RAID 1 is implemented in hardware? Does the ICH9R onboard controller optimize RAID 1 reads to interleave the data fetch between disks to increase read throughput? Or is this only found on fancy expensive controllers?
 

Phrontis

Member
Dec 8, 2004
28
0
0
fpbear,

I have to admit I am not sure if a mirror can look for bits of the data on the two drives at the same time. It is some time since I last had a look at the various aspects of raid arrays as basic as a mirror.

Phrontis.
 

Blain

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
23,643
3
81
"I see a lot of enthusiasts are setting up RAID 0, but I am wondering if RAID 1 is overlooked too often, and I would like to learn more about whether it offers a noticeable performance boost with concurrent access."

"what I find curious and puzzling is why half the articles say that RAID 1 read performance is the same as a single disk, and the other half say that the performance improves because pieces of the data can be fetched from either disk"

What articles are you talking about? :roll:

RAID 1 is like driving a pick-up truck and RAID 0 like driving a Mustang.

People that drive Mustangs aren't interested in the things a pick-up has to offer.
 

yinan

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2007
1,801
2
71
it is a different set of drives in a different machine. I did this because once I had stuff mirrored but accidentally deleted a bunch of stuff and had no way to recover it once it was mirrored. Yes, if I had a way to run more drives in my system I may run true RAID 10 but this is the best solution I could think of.
 

Madwand1

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2006
3,309
0
76
"Striping" RAID 1 reads is great in theory, but lacking in implementation from what I've seen. There are two points of failure here -- (1) the RAID implementation (2) the access pattern under which read are "striped". AFAIK, low-end controllers and even some high-end ones don't "stripe" RAID 1 reads at all, and none "stripe" common sequential accesses -- only concurrent accesses.

This bodes poorly for desktop configurations and typical uses.

I might be wrong, but despite looking and doing some limited testing myself, I haven't seen anything positive and convincing regarding RAID 1 performance.
 

Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
11,641
0
76
Originally posted by: BlainRAID 1 is like driving a pick-up truck and RAID 0 like driving a Mustang.

People that drive Mustangs aren't interested in the things a pick-up has to offer.

Not entirely sure what you're trying to say there...


As for RAID-1, it'll depend on the controller.
From what I know, most cheapo consumer controllers won't read from two or more disks at once, haven't used one in a long time though, so this may have changed.
Every proper controller I've used will do that though.
 

JBT

Lifer
Nov 28, 2001
12,094
1
81
Originally posted by: Madwand1
"Striping" RAID 1 reads is great in theory, but lacking in implementation from what I've seen. There are two points of failure here -- (1) the RAID implementation (2) the access pattern under which read are "striped". AFAIK, low-end controllers and even some high-end ones don't "stripe" RAID 1 reads at all, and none "stripe" common sequential accesses -- only concurrent accesses.

This bodes poorly for desktop configurations and typical uses.

I might be wrong, but despite looking and doing some limited testing myself, I haven't seen anything positive and convincing regarding RAID 1 performance.

Pretty sure you have that switched.

Raid 0 is Striping.
Raid 1 is mirroring.

Either way I doubt there is really that much performance gain at all except of course moving large files accross a Raid 0 array. Any other changes i'm sure are negligible at best with the lower end controllers found on mother boards these days.
 

themisfit610

Golden Member
Apr 16, 2006
1,352
2
81
Definitely. From what I've read, a RAID 1 on a legit hardware controller, with small cluster sizes, will perform well on database type operations, where there are large number of concurrent operations, but low overall bandwidth. Much better than RAID 0 or RAID 5 I've been told.

~MiSfit
 

Madwand1

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2006
3,309
0
76
Originally posted by: JBT

Pretty sure you have that switched.

Raid 0 is Striping.
Raid 1 is mirroring.

No, I know what striping and mirroring are. I'm borrowing the term "striping" to describe a potential read-only optimization of RAID 1 -- whereby data is read off both mirrors at the same time, in a manner somewhat similar to RAID 0 striping. I used quotes to show that this wasn't literally the same as RAID 0 striping. This expression is fairly commonly used in this context (RAID 1 optimization) elsewhere.

I don't really care to get hung up on terminology. If you have a suggestion for another term which better describes this behavior succinctly, I'd use that instead.
 

mindless1

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2001
8,344
1,551
126
Originally posted by: fpbear
Phrontis, what I find curious and puzzling is why half the articles say that RAID 1 read performance is the same as a single disk, and the other half say that the performance improves because pieces of the data can be fetched from either disk, especially during concurrent access.

That is at the center of what I'm trying to figure out in this thread.

Maybe it depends on the controller how well RAID 1 is implemented in hardware? Does the ICH9R onboard controller optimize RAID 1 reads to interleave the data fetch between disks to increase read throughput? Or is this only found on fancy expensive controllers?


RAID1 performance is no faster, sometimes marginally slower on writes. With a very good caching hardware controller it can "seem" faster on writes for short bursts, but only up until the limit of the caching or the next I/O request.

On reads, RAID1 can be faster or is at least as fast as single drive in most situations (I'm ignoring a poor controller or one sitting on PCI bus causing a separate bottleneck from that).

Yes a piece of data can be fetched from either disk, but there is no intelligent division of concurrent IO such that two requests will be split between the two drives in an efficient manner. The data requests to the controller can be dumbly spread between two drives, even with a soft-raid instead of an expensive controller, but ultimately the logic in efficient retrieval still depends on the logic (& firmware) on each drive used.

The generic answer is, you'll have to consider your most common or most demanding use. Generally, one does not choose RAID0 for performance, though in many cases the performance is good enough, when their primary need was the realtime redundancy.

AFAIK, there is never a case where a RAID1 will be nearly as fast as either a RAID0, or using at least two of the drives as independant volumes for concurrent IO. Sadly this 2 separate volumes option is often overlooked, but often even faster than a RAID0 is, without the double jeopardy of RAID0 drive failures.

As for those (including myself) that say it depends on the controller, generally today's systems have plenty of processing power for soft-raid, the controller benefits are generally that of caching (I mean invisible to the OS caching, such that the OS continues on) and that caching occurs even if the drives are connected as independent spanned volumes instead of arrays, so to some extent we can ignore the controller variable and isolate whether it's a RAID or not.


As for the thread question, is RAID1 underrated? YES, but not for performance reasons
It is great to be able to spend a mere $xx and have realtime redundancy, to not have to skip a step to replace a failed drive ever and have it interrupt use of a system. It is not a backup strategy, that too is equally important, but at least on any mission critical workstation or server, RAID1 (if not a more advanced level like 5) is a good idea and IMO, worth the price of a 2nd drive. I should also elaborate that having fileservers, I would RAID1 a couple 200GB drives and reserve the larger ones to the fileserver for addt'l capacity, so it is not as extreme an expense as someone trying to fit every client with a TB+ of drives space.
 
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