Is SLI worth it?

[KAM04m]

I haven't got much of a response at ExtremeOverclocking.com so I wanted to bring my topic here to ANANDTECH! What do you guys think?
SLI now?

 

[Dethfrumbelo]

Maybe if you use 2 6800NUs, like Dell's 6800 GTO, if you can get them for around $250 each. That should fairly easily outperform any single slot card on the market.

The 6600GTs just don't have enough memory or bandwidth to keep up when AA is applied. Although it still isn't bad, and they can be had for <$180 each. So $360+ $80 extra for SLI board = $450, about the price of a GT. If you're not planning on using AA at 1280 or 1600, it might be worth it.

There's no guarantee though that a given brand of identical cards will work in SLI. Wait until they're officially certified.

 

[Atif]

^ Unfortunately, 6800NU do not support SLI right now. There is a rumor @ TheInquirer that nVidia will be launching a PCI Express 6800NU with SLI support. Until that card is released, assuming you like playing at high resolutions/with AA/AF on, you might be better served buying a 6800GT.

Peace

 

[classy]

From what I see not really. The price is still very high and the return to me just doesn't justify the cost.

 

[Rage187]

if you can afford it, then yes.

 

[carage]

If you can afford it, then I guess yes.
However, you should also keep in mind that SLI doesn't neccesarily mean you have to buy both cards at the same time. You can always get your second card when you need the extra horse power.
I know there are also skeptics out there who think it might be a problem to find the same card 6 months down the road or by the next product cylce it would make more sense to just upgrade to the next generation offering.

 

[MegaWorks]

No too expensive

 

[Insomniak]

I think it is an excellent option to have as upgrade. Buy one 6800GT now, pick up another for half price a year down the road, and get the same performance as buying another $400 top o da heap GPU.

The only thing that really concerns me at the moment is power consumption...I really wouldn't feel comfortable running an SLI setup with anything less than a 500W PSU.

 

[nitromullet]

The way I see it, I was already planning on my next upgrade (maybe next summer or fall) to be an Athlon64, so I will probably get an nForce4 or 5 SLI capable mobo and a close to top-of-the-line video card - most likely a notch below an whatever next generation's XT PE or Ultra is. Once I have the basic rig, with a single vid card, I will evaluate the pros and cons of getting another card to run in SLI or waiting to upgrade until the next generation.

Currently, I think SLI is really only something people with money to burn will have. I also don't see the sense in SLI'ing two mid range (6600GT) cards. I think SLI is a cool option for those seeking the ultimate in performance, but not a good option as a planned upgrade path for mid range cards, simply because the money you spend on the motherboard could be spent on a better perfroming video card to begin with.

 

[Thermalrock]

i thought about it and figured history will repeat itself. when you could hook up two voodoos ppl thought it was cool for a lil time then it got annoying and back to single card the market went. i think might happen again.
i do believe that some time theyll make single cards with dual gpu for mainstream. thats a way more elegant and prolly even a lil faster solution anyway.

 

[KAM04m]

Originally posted by: Thermalrock
when you could hook up two voodoos ppl thought it was cool for a lil time then it got annoying and back to single card the market went.

I did not know they tried this once. Why did they switch back. SLI and PCI express is a great technology for people who have boatloads of cash (not me of course ) or an old system setup and want to upgrade. That is not a good amount of people to keep the market alive for dual GPU's. We will see in the future. Maybe they could offer twin pack video cards ...you know like two cards in a box for the price of 1.5 cards instead of the full 2 priced cards. Aren't PCI express/SLi cards more expensive than the same AGP ors is that only b/c its new right now?

 

[IAteYourMother]

While it isn't very smart in terms of cash to get 2 video cards now, the point for the cheap majority of people is for upgrading purposes. You buy your 6800GT now for 400. Maybe 2 years later, you find one for say 200 dollars and you buy it, hook it up through SLI, and you've successfully upgraded your comp to current specs without having to shell out dough for a brand new card.

 

[knyghtbyte]

in regards to Dells GTO, certainly the first boards they were putting in their puters are SLI, they were also unlockable on pipes and OC'able, but newer bought ones cant seem to be unlocked, those that have told me havnt yet mentioned if they are SLI still......if they are then its worth grabbing a couple of Dells, their clock and memory is much better than a 6800nu at stock (325/700 nu compared to 350/900 GTO and of course on the GTO its GDDR3 memory) so would be a fairly reasonable and cheap way to get higher performance
only downside of course is im not sure if Dell will sell just the graphics cards, if they wont sell them on their own you'll have to get a couple off Ebay...lol

 

[HappyNic]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother
While it isn't very smart in terms of cash to get 2 video cards now, the point for the cheap majority of people is for upgrading purposes. You buy your 6800GT now for 400. Maybe 2 years later, you find one for say 200 dollars and you buy it, hook it up through SLI, and you've successfully upgraded your comp to current specs without having to shell out dough for a brand new card.

I think Sli is a good idea on paper but in real life it wouldn't really give you that much of a advantage.

--First you would need to invest in a SLI mobo,

--If you get 2 top end card now, it would be a overkill and you'll be spending too much $$$ for something that you will not use fully.

--If you get 1 top end card now, you'll be limited to getting the same card later if you plan to take advantge of the SLI Motherboard that you purchased before hand. By doing so you are limiting yourself on videocard options. Either you get the same card you got a year ago, or you get a new Graphic card. If you are getting a new Graphic card then you just wasted you money on the SLI mobo, so your only option that Justified you purchase of this SLI mobo is to get the same card you got a year ago.

So instead of getting a SLI mobo and then a top end card, you could just get a top end card, and when the time comes to upgrade, you can get the new top end card and just resell your old one. You also have the options of moving to SLI mobo if it gained more support by this time, and you'll know exactly how 2 sli card will preform on the newer current games. A Good example is Direct X.
If you do SLI now you are limited to DX9 and i'm sure the new card will be going to DX10 or 11. So this can really decrease your preformance, if the game you want to play is base on the new DX. Just check out how bad the FX5900 did on DX9 over DX8 on half-life 2.


What i'm waiting for is a Videocard that's similar to a motherboard, so that we can just exchange the GPU and RAM.

 

[nRollo]

I think Sli is a good idea on paper but in real life it wouldn't really give you that much of a advantage.

That's odd. All the reviews, here included, show it to be a huge advantage. Why do you say this? Links?

--First you would need to invest in a SLI mobo,

I buy a new motherboard every year anyway, Ive read these will cost $150 and up. (about $10-$20 more than I usually spend, so not a factor?)

--If you get 2 top end card now, it would be a overkill and you'll be spending too much $$$ for something that you will not use fully.

Why wouldn't you get to use it fully? When you're playing every game at 16X12 4X8X with no slowdowns, that isn't "using it"?

--If you get 1 top end card now, you'll be limited to getting the same card later if you plan to take advantge of the SLI Motherboard that you purchased before hand. By doing so you are limiting yourself on videocard options. Either you get the same card you got a year ago, or you get a new Graphic card. If you are getting a new Graphic card then you just wasted you money on the SLI mobo, so your only option that Justified you purchase of this SLI mobo is to get the same card you got a year ago.

Errr, this is sort of the point? That you can by another of the same card later when they're cheaper rather than selling your old card at a huge loss?

So instead of getting a SLI mobo and then a top end card, you could just get a top end card, and when the time comes to upgrade, you can get the new top end card and just resell your old one.

Of course, you'll have to live with much lower performance than the guys who bought SLI, and knowing that you're usually a guy who tries to have the best or close to it, but now you're just in the middle of the pack with average performance. Every benchmark you look at from now on will have your $400 - $500 card in the middle of the chart.

You also have the options of moving to SLI mobo if it gained more support by this time, and you'll know exactly how 2 sli card will preform on the newer current games.

More support? Who cares? Motherboard makers are working feverishly to put out boards like this as we speak. We know how it works with FarCry, Doom3, and Half Life2, which are going to be the most heavily licensed engines in the next couple years?

A Good example is Direct X.
If you do SLI now you are limited to DX9 and i'm sure the new card will be going to DX10 or 11.

nVidia cards are DX9 SM3. The games that support this will start coming out over the next year. Even though DX9 has been out two years there are less than 10 games that really use it. Do you honestly think you can tell us, and not have us laugh really hard, that DX10 and 11 will be a factor in the next year and a half? How often do you think people with $600-$1000 to spend on video cards upgrade video cards? (hint: they are not keeping them 5 years)

So this can really decrease your preformance, if the game you want to play is base on the new DX. Just check out how bad the FX5900 did on DX9 over DX8 on half-life 2.

LOL- this proves my point. HL2 came out a year and a half after the FX5900. I don't know about you, but if you honestly keep any computer hardware 2 years, you're using antiques.

What i'm waiting for is a Videocard that's similar to a motherboard, so that we can just exchange the GPU and RAM.

You'll wait a long time for that, do you think the only components on a video card that change are the core and RAM?!?!?

Nothing in your post makes any sense at all, you should really research this stuff better before giving advice on it.

 

[Dolly]

What id say, is that if you need/want to run anything in 16x12x4x8 and you can afford it then go for it, otherwise there is no reasson, since in 1024 resolutions it offers close to 0 benefit these days.

In newer games to come tho it might prove a big advantage, and the best thing to do ( that I will do as well now ) is to get a dual pci-e mobo, and get an 6800GT, and next year when the prices are low, get another one.

I thinkg since sli is uppon us atm, its foolish to get a new configuration and NOT get sli mobo just to save 30$ because in the long run its gona pay off for sure.

 

[JackBurton]

ANYONE who dismisses the performace gains of SLI are in severe denial. OR, they have such a sh!tty setup, that SLI won't really benefit them that much (ex: 15" or 17" monitor only capable of running at 1024x768 or 1280x1024).

 

[Acanthus]

I dont see how 70%+ across the board is a negligible gain either.

 

[lifeguard1999]

Originally posted by: Rollo
I don't know about you, but if you honestly keep any computer hardware 2 years, you're using antiques.

I don't know about that. The 9700 Pro was launched in July 2002 and it is still a good card. Certainly it is not as good as the X800 XT or 6800 Ultra which have doubled the performance, but it is still very respectable.

A month later in August 2002 Intel launched the 2.8 GHz P4. Has Intel doubled its performance in the same time period?

As I have stated elsewhere, SLI brings a new problem to the game. This new problem is that we are no longer CPU bound or GPU bound, but data bound. It is only at 1600x1200 4xAA/8XAF that we see the performance of SLI really shine.

Oh and my home setup is an antique: Tualatin o/c to 1.4GHz and a 9800 Pro. But it is quiet, runs cool, and still plays games well.

 

[Fern]

quote:

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--If you get 2 top end card now, it would be a overkill and you'll be spending too much $$$ for something that you will not use fully.
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Why wouldn't you get to use it fully? When you're playing every game at 16X12 4X8X with no slowdowns, that isn't "using it"?

Can't you already play every game at 16x12 4x8x with no slowdowns with just ONE 6800 Ulta?. Hence wouldn't two be overkill ATM?

quote:

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--If you get 1 top end card now, you'll be limited to getting the same card later if you plan to take advantge of the SLI Motherboard that you purchased before hand. By doing so you are limiting yourself on videocard options. Either you get the same card you got a year ago, or you get a new Graphic card. If you are getting a new Graphic card then you just wasted you money on the SLI mobo, so your only option that Justified you purchase of this SLI mobo is to get the same card you got a year ago.
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Errr, this is sort of the point? That you can by another of the same card later when they're cheaper rather than selling your old card at a huge loss?

I think his point is that the SLI route does limit your future gfx card choice, unless money is of no concern in the matter. I think it's a good point

quote:

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So instead of getting a SLI mobo and then a top end card, you could just get a top end card, and when the time comes to upgrade, you can get the new top end card and just resell your old one.
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Of course, you'll have to live with much lower performance than the guys who bought SLI, and knowing that you're usually a guy who tries to have the best or close to it, but now you're just in the middle of the pack with average performance. Every benchmark you look at from now on will have your $400 - $500 card in the middle of the chart.

What? Games are more important than benchmarking for many of us. I'm going to guess that future top-end cards will play future games perfectly fine with no slow downs in FPS. So continually upgrading to one top-end card seems to make sense for gameplay. If you wanna have the top bencmark scores, by all means you will need SLI with two current top-end cards. In otherwords, you'll have to buy two new cards every product cycle to be "benchmark King". Hardly economical though.

quote:

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A Good example is Direct X.
If you do SLI now you are limited to DX9 and i'm sure the new card will be going to DX10 or 11.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


nVidia cards are DX9 SM3. The games that support this will start coming out over the next year. Even though DX9 has been out two years there are less than 10 games that really use it. Do you honestly think you can tell us, and not have us laugh really hard, that DX10 and 11 will be a factor in the next year and a half? How often do you think people with $600-$1000 to spend on video cards upgrade video cards? (hint: they are not keeping them 5 years)

Yeah, peeps DO get exited about the "new features". Haven't some said that nVidia won this new round because the 6XXX series has these "new features". Remember the patch for Far Cry? For SLI to make any economical sense you're gonna have to hold on to the cards for a couple of years and yes, you will likely be missing new DX features that will be present in games

Broadly, there appears to be two schools of thought on the merits of SLI (1) top performance and (2) economical upgrade path. I'll agree to the former, but am still a doubter as to the latter. And I look forward to seeing Rollo's SLI benchies.

Fern

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Acanthus
I dont see how 70%+ across the board is a negligible gain either.

I don't think anybody's saying it doesn't increase performance by a significant amount (if they are, they're on crack). If you want something faster than a single 6800U or X800XT, obviously SLI is the only way to get it right now.

But it doesn't look like two 6600GTs are really a better deal than a single 6800GT (in some shader-limited situations without AA/AF on, yes, it runs as fast or a little faster, but that's about it). And whether or not the 'buy one 6800GT now, buy another later' argument pans out is highly dependent on what NV50 and R500 look like. When the Voodoo2 SLI came out, within a year there were single cards (Voodoo3, TNT2) that were faster, cheaper, and had better features (in those days, 32-bit color, and the ability to run at resolutions over 1024x768) than a Voodoo2 SLI setup (link). If that happens again (and nobody outside of ATI and NVIDIA has any idea if it will right now!), upgrading via SLI is not going to be a good deal. If it doesn't happen, and the next-gen cards are not that much faster than the current ones, then it might make sense, depending on how the pricing goes. I'm not sure if paying the premium for an SLI motherboard at this point is a good idea.

Rollo sez:

I buy a new motherboard every year anyway, Ive read these will cost $150 and up. (about $10-$20 more than I usually spend, so not a factor?)

The ASUS SLI that was reviewed the other day had a price of $180 (I'm not sure if that's MSRP, or if the MSRP is $200 and they think it'll be available for $180). I haven't heard anything official on other NForce4 SLI boards, but rumors say $200ish. You can get a very capable motherboard for around (or under, for Socket 754) $100 if you don't need every bell and whistle included in the high-end models; that's a pretty big premium right now for an upgrade path that may not ever really pan out. Not everybody buys a new motherboard every year (although I think a lot of people are going to be in the market for one in the next 6 months), and not everybody buys the most expensive parts out there either.

 

[Genx87]

Applying AF and AA it is worth it if you want the absolute fastest frames.
But I am wondering if when you dont apply AA and AF if we are too CPU bound at the moment?

Will Dual core CPUs alleviate this problem?

 

[Dolly]

Can I ask something, does playing in 16x12 instead od 1024x768 or exen 12x10 with AA and AF make SUCH a big difference ??? WITH AA and AF enabled?

I mean is it so crap at 1024 that you need so spend atm 1000$ ( rougly of course ) to run the game at 16x12?

The next step to start buying 22"+ screend to up the resolution that a game can run

I thing its more future proof to get the sli tech now and the second card later rather than a need for todays game.

As I say unless 1024x768 with 4x8 looks crap to you peeps

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Genx87
Applying AF and AA it is worth it if you want the absolute fastest frames.

Uh, AA and AF decrease your framerate. They do give you better image quality.

But I am wondering if when you dont apply AA and AF if we are too CPU bound at the moment?

With a 6800GT or 6800U SLI, yes. Look at AT's review; on an Athlon 4000+, you're almost CPU-bound in most of the games even at 1600x1200 without AA and AF. It's really only Doom3 (and HL2, slightly) that pushes a 6800GT-SLI setup without AA/AF. Heck, in an older game like Wolf:ET, even a single 6800GT is CPU-bound at 1600x1200 without AA/AF on. However, I have never understood the 'being CPU-bound' argument; just crank up the AA/AF and/or up the resolution until you're not. There's currently no (single) GPU that can keep up with a reasonably fast CPU at 1600x1200 with AA and AF, except in very old games.

Will Dual core CPUs alleviate this problem?

Not unless we start getting some multithreaded game engines.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: Genx87
Applying AF and AA it is worth it if you want the absolute fastest frames.
But I am wondering if when you dont apply AA and AF if we are too CPU bound at the moment?

Will Dual core CPUs alleviate this problem?

Not unless the game is smp aware. Otherwise you either get load balancing or can assign it to run on 1 CPU with duallys, neither of which will out perform a single CPU of the same specs in game performance for all but the few smp aware titles or those that allow for running more than one instance=very short list.

That will all change if/when dual-core systems start comprising a significant percentage of the gamer's market I'm certain. For now there has been no real financial motivation to code for it, but times they are a changin'