Is Steph Curry already the best shooter in NBA history?

[Muse]

Look, basketball shouldn't be played like the NFL, Zin. IMO, it should be played more like today than like you say it was a couple decades ago. It should allow limited contact, not major contact. I think your impression of Jordan is exaggerated. He wasn't as tough as all that. Look at him compared to LeBron. LeBron is a tank next to Jordan a jeep.

The reason the court has opened up is the 3 point shot, not some laziness that makes players want to loiter beyond the arc. 3 point line was drawn in 1980. It took quite a while for people to develop the ability to hit from "downtown," people just didn't realize it was possible to make 25-35 footers. Curry has redefined this. They could even institute a 4 point shot with a line a few feet further out for another revolution in the sport.

 

[GobBluth]

For me, Bird is always going to be the best pure shooter with Reggie Miller as a close second. I don't have any substantiating evidence to back that up, just the eye test.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Was going to say Bird, but he missed a lot of shots. He did hit some amazing shots during the playoffs though.

Bird "missed a lot of shots"??

Even including his final years when he had a back injury, Bird's career FG % is only .008 less than Lebron's is now, before his decline if he chooses to play that long. That's basically even.

Bird's 3pt % is .376 while Lebron's is 34.4%.

So Bird didn't miss any more shots than Lebron did and he was a better 3 point shooter. Don't know why you think that. Bird would be absolutely dominant in today's game, where they don't get hammered by defenders all the time.

 

[Pacfanweb]

For me, Bird is always going to be the best pure shooter with Reggie Miller as a close second. I don't have any substantiating evidence to back that up, just the eye test.

Pistol Pete Maravich. Best shooter I've ever seen. There was no 3pt line for the majority of his career, but I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that he'd be the leading career 3pt shooter by a LONG margin if there was. He made the likes of Lebron and Durant look like bricklayers from long range.

His college coach Dale Brown went back and recharted Pete's shots from his LSU career, assuming a 19'9" 3pt line and recalculated his averages.
Dude would have averaged 13 3's a game and 57 points per game had there been a 3 pt line, and that is assuming his shot selection would have stayed exactly the same and he didn't shoot even more long range shots since they counted more.

He would kill anyone alive or dead in long range shooting. Curry, Miller, you name the player and he's not as good a shooter as Pistol Pete was.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Look, basketball shouldn't be played like the NFL, Zin. IMO, it should be played more like today than like you say it was a couple decades ago. It should allow limited contact, not major contact. I think your impression of Jordan is exaggerated. He wasn't as tough as all that. Look at him compared to LeBron. LeBron is a tank next to Jordan a jeep.

The reason the court has opened up is the 3 point shot, not some laziness that makes players want to loiter beyond the arc. 3 point line was drawn in 1980. It took quite a while for people to develop the ability to hit from "downtown," people just didn't realize it was possible to make 25-35 footers. Curry has redefined this. They could even institute a 4 point shot with a line a few feet further out for another revolution in the sport.

Yes, Jordan WAS "as tough as all that". Players got hammered on a regular basis when they drove to the basket in Jordan's era. They do not now. Remember, Lebron was known as "LeFlop" awhile back, because faking drew charging calls. That didn't work so much 20 years ago.

Plus Jordan faced a virtual Murderer's Row of top 50 players around the league on a nightly basis. The East is a joke in Lebron's era. Now he can't help that....but if you're going to compare the two, you have to look at what they faced. The best group of big men in history....all the good bigs in Jordan's era would be utterly dominant today. Today's best big is....Dwight Howard? LOL. Dude is a physical marvel, but he wouldn't have started for any of the good teams back then and he'd have never made an All-Star game. He is just too unskilled. All athleticism. That was the criticism of young Shaq, but young Shaq would have murdered Howard. Hell, old Shaq pretty much owned him when he wanted to.

Finally, players couldn't move around and team up with other top players to form a mini Dream Team when Jordan played. Most of his top years, he had an uncompetitive team around him. And remember, when Jordan retired the first time, his still fully-intact team couldn't even make the conference finals, much less play for a league title.

 

[Red Storm]

Bird "missed a lot of shots"??

Even including his final years when he had a back injury, Bird's career FG % is only .008 less than Lebron's is now, before his decline if he chooses to play that long. That's basically even.

Bird's 3pt % is .376 while Lebron's is 34.4%.

So Bird didn't miss any more shots than Lebron did and he was a better 3 point shooter. Don't know why you think that. Bird would be absolutely dominant in today's game, where they don't get hammered by defenders all the time.

I appreciate you defending Bird, but I don't know why you're using Lebron as a comparison. He will never be in the discussion for greatest shooter...

 

[child of wonder]

If Lebron was really the MVP, why did he go 0 for 130? Makes no sense, and these are analysts paid to write about the NBA (i.e. they know more than everyone in this thread about the sport).

Read this and see if you still think Lebron should have gotten even 1 vote.
http://espn.go.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/15492948/the-numbers-steph-curry-incredible-mvp-season

Best improvement for any MVP in NBA history, even beating Bird's 84-85 PER improvement.


Best ever rate for 4th Q dominance, yes better in the 4thQ than MJ/Lebron/whoever else.


Best in the NBA in the lane/driving:


Is over 50% shooting between 28ft and the half court line (yes even better than regular 3's):


Hit more 3's than an entire NBA team:


More 3's in 2 seasons than Larry Legend and MJ's entire careers:


Better PER compared to MJ during his record 72-win season:


Best in secondary assists:


Best in points off the pick and roll:


Best in Points off screens:


Best in Contested 3's Off the Dribble:


Best in Quality Shot Creation:


Is your brain dizzy yet? If you accept these truths and still think Bron Bron is MVP you are nuts. Steph is not only the best shooter in NBA history but a better passer than Lebron and arguably the best passer in the league at identifying the open man. He's not only the best at shooting 3's but the best at driving and finishing in the lane. And last I checked lebron never led his team to 73 wins. That alone makes Steph MVP, GS is a 40 win team without him. He is the ultimate offensive weapon and team player. Hail to the MVP. Will be great to see him win a 3rd one in a row next year as long as he's healthy.

Curry 9-26 and averaged 5.6 PPG in the 4th quarter, including one game where he scored zero points and had zero FGAs, between all 6 of the NBA Finals games.

Curry is an amazing player and one of the greatest shooters in history but he is NOT the kind of player to carry a team or be relied upon in crunch time to deliver for his team.

 

[purbeast0]

They also showed the stat last night that he was like 0-7 in shots to take the lead in the last 20 seconds of games in his career. Now he is 0-8.

 

[LikeLinus]

Curry is a great shooter, no doubt. But i have to agree that Allen, Miller and Bird were all phenomenal shooters who I'd trust more at the end of the game.

As far as Jordan goes, not the greatest strictly shooter in the game. But that MOFO could take a beating and still destroy you. Not to mention he was a terrific defender and he controlled the outcome of most games he played. He had the mindset of a killer. Can't say the same for most players today.

 

[zinfamous]

Pistol Pete Maravich. Best shooter I've ever seen. There was no 3pt line for the majority of his career, but I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that he'd be the leading career 3pt shooter by a LONG margin if there was. He made the likes of Lebron and Durant look like bricklayers from long range.

His college coach Dale Brown went back and recharted Pete's shots from his LSU career, assuming a 19'9" 3pt line and recalculated his averages.
Dude would have averaged 13 3's a game and 57 points per game had there been a 3 pt line, and that is assuming his shot selection would have stayed exactly the same and he didn't shoot even more long range shots since they counted more.

He would kill anyone alive or dead in long range shooting. Curry, Miller, you name the player and he's not as good a shooter as Pistol Pete was.

A friend of mine bought a house in Raleigh a few years ago (fancy pants neighborhood). He has a concrete bball court in the back that happens to be the court that Maravich grew up on through higschool. ....so I guess it's where the family lived (either that house or the one next to it, or some version of whatever was on those lots at the time), when Press was the head coach at NC State.

The backboard had already been replaced once since then (supposedly, prior to his owning the property, or so he claims), but some dudes apparently came by a few weeks ago to put in a new one, and wouldn't allow the ratty (falling apart plywood backboard bolted into a wall) remain, so they replaced the whole setup with a reinforced standing goal. ....I mean, talk about a crime against history, lol.

 

[Captante]

Curry is a great shooter, no doubt. But i have to agree that Allen, Miller and Bird were all phenomenal shooters who I'd trust more at the end of the game.

As far as Jordan goes, not the greatest strictly shooter in the game. But that MOFO could take a beating and still destroy you. Not to mention he was a terrific defender and he controlled the outcome of most games he played. He had the mindset of a killer. Can't say the same for most players today.

No question Jordan was the best basketball player I've ever seen bar none.

 

[DesiPower]

This Finals proved my point, Curry might be a noteworthy shooter, but as a basketball player he is mediocre at best... Overrated swag. It's being said that the franchise will not be able to keep the "dynasty" together after this year, I say good riddance, maybe we can get back to playing real basketball again.

 

[eng2d2]

Could be curry is not 100% because too many championship. Maybe not practicing like he used to be.

 

[Muse]

This Finals proved my point, Curry might be a noteworthy shooter, but as a basketball player he is mediocre at best... Overrated swag. It's being said that the franchise will not be able to keep the "dynasty" together after this year, I say good riddance, maybe we can get back to playing real basketball again.

What are you thinking? Well, obviously you're not thinking. The Warriors were playing real basketball, modern basketball. Curry "overrated swag?" You're drinking too much brandy. Way too much. Admit it, you are just anti-Curry etc.

 

[Muse]

Could be curry is not 100% because too many championship. Maybe not practicing like he used to be.

No, Curry was fit and polished, has incredible work ethic all year round. He had a 47 point game in the finals. He couldn't do that every night. He and his trainer said he could go 48 minutes but Kerr evidently didn't agree, he gave him some bench minutes. Fact is, unless Curry had deadly options (IOW, teammates who could hit open jumpers), he could be shut down with double teams. It was true of Leonard too, but his support was better than Curry's unless Durant and Thompson were on the court.

 

[purbeast0]

What are you thinking? Well, obviously you're not thinking. The Warriors were playing real basketball, modern basketball. Curry "overrated swag?" You're drinking too much brandy. Way too much. Admit it, you are just anti-Curry etc.

I don't know what "real" basketball is, but the brand the Warriors typically play is boring as hell to me. I just don't find people running fast breaks and pulling up behind the arc, fun basketball to watch. Yes, it's very hard to do that and they have more skill than any team in the NBA as far as shooting goes, and Curry make some crazy shots that are defended as good as possibly can be, but I just don't find it that entertaining to watch.

Whether it's "real" basketball or whatever, I'd say it's definitely the current trend style of ball. But they are a team that has like 3-4 all stars in their starting lineup, so they can play whatever kind of basketball they want because they have more talent than any other team.

 

[eng2d2]

No, Curry was fit and polished, has incredible work ethic all year round. He had a 47 point game in the finals. He couldn't do that every night. He and his trainer said he could go 48 minutes but Kerr evidently didn't agree, he gave him some bench minutes. Fact is, unless Curry had deadly options (IOW, teammates who could hit open jumpers), he could be shut down with double teams. It was true of Leonard too, but his support was better than Curry's unless Durant and Thompson were on the court.

Thanks for that info. I don’t really follow the warriors during regular season but they are my team right now. I just watch the playoffs. I just detect a different warriors this year as oppose to last year. I was hoping they would get the championship without kd. Don’t think they need kd but nice to have him.

 

[Muse]

Thanks for that info. I don’t really follow the warriors during regular season but they are my team right now. I just watch the playoffs. I just detect a different warriors this year as oppose to last year. I was hoping they would get the championship without kd. Don’t think they need kd but nice to have him.

That other Splash Brother was pretty essential. Even if they'd pulled out game 6 (they were close), a game 7 didn't look good for them. Next man up is the mantra in the NBA when a star goes down but who could it be for the Warriors? Iggy? Possibly, but his defense if bigger than his offense these days, anyway. Livingston? He doesn't have a 3 pointer. Cook? A stretch. He AFAIK has never had a breakout performance. McKinney? He can shoot but he didn't seem to have it going in the finals. I hear that Jerebko can really shoot but I wasn't seeing it. Cousins and Green can hit the 3 but I didn't see either hitting it consistently. All starting 5 for the Raptors could hit the 3. Every one was a big threat from the 3 point line during the finals.

 

[LikeLinus]

What are you thinking? Well, obviously you're not thinking. The Warriors were playing real basketball, modern basketball. Curry "overrated swag?" You're drinking too much brandy. Way too much. Admit it, you are just anti-Curry etc.

Shaquille O'neal said it best the other day. Are we talking about when real men played, or this cupcake league now?

I still love the NBA, but its not nearly as good as it was when I saw it growing up.

 

[glenn1]

DeMar Derozan is a poor man's Jordan and can average 27ppg in this NBA, you think prime Jordan wouldn't be the best player in the league?

The league's a lot better these days, IMO. Players work harder, train harder, way harder. Jordan was a great athlete and had an obsession with winning, winning at everything. But he wouldn't be one of the best of today's players without having a much greater work ethic than he had in his day. He smoked cigars, for fuck's sake, and not just after winning championships.

The idea that transcendent players wouldn't be good nowadays is garbage. MJ would dominate if his peak year version time traveled forward to today. Bo Jackson would still run faster than everyone else on the field and truck outside linebackers for TDs if he played today. Barry Bonds will still get walked with the bases loaded today. The original "Dream Team" would still beat the shit out of any other team you could compose today. The idea that MJ is nothing special is only held by youngsters who never saw him play in real time.

 

[LikeLinus]

Lol, I missed that whole Jordan smoking cigars comment.

Well, I guess Steph isn't very good either. All that drinking and smoking going on.

 

[purbeast0]

I bet Steph is chewing on his mouthpiece while smoking cigars and drinking Heineken.

 

[eng2d2]

That other Splash Brother was pretty essential. Even if they'd pulled out game 6 (they were close), a game 7 didn't look good for them. Next man up is the mantra in the NBA when a star goes down but who could it be for the Warriors? Iggy? Possibly, but his defense if bigger than his offense these days, anyway. Livingston? He doesn't have a 3 pointer. Cook? A stretch. He AFAIK has never had a breakout performance. McKinney? He can shoot but he didn't seem to have it going in the finals. I hear that Jerebko can really shoot but I wasn't seeing it. Cousins and Green can hit the 3 but I didn't see either hitting it consistently. All starting 5 for the Raptors could hit the 3. Every one was a big threat from the 3 point line during the finals.

Cousin was painful to watch. Slowww !!! Mooney tried to look good without kd but just didn’t work out. Cousin and Mooney got a lot of passes from under the basket but faked a lot instead of just shooting or drawing a foul. Iggy in the past was good shooter I thought but he also had a lot of injuries. Green was just there when you need him. He didn’t claim to be a shooter.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Shaquille O'neal said it best the other day. Are we talking about when real men played, or this cupcake league now?

I still love the NBA, but its not nearly as good as it was when I saw it growing up.

Analytics have ruined the game. They're slowly ruining the NFL and baseball as well.
I get it...they help teams win, but the whole "everyone take more 3's because of risk/reward" has ruined the NBA and college.

There is no post play now. There is little mano-y-mano now...a guy backing another guy down, etc.
Even the big guys want to shoot 3's now.

The best thing they could possibly do for the game is to eliminate the 3 ball, or move it WAY back.

 

[Muse]

Shaquille O'neal said it best the other day. Are we talking about when real men played, or this cupcake league now?

I still love the NBA, but its not nearly as good as it was when I saw it growing up.

I have heard this a few times, but I feel like they allow too much bullying and brute force in the NBA... TODAY. And I have always disliked Shaq and don't give a shit what he says. I always hated his style of play. He just pushed guys around because he could and the refs let him. I couldn't stand to watch him and mostly didn't. If you want to see men pushing men around or banging into them watch the NFL. Or boxing or some other martial arts sport, or even wrestling (what a joke, not Greco-Roman) or sumo. I never had a sense that Shaq had skills or finesse, just brute strength. 300+ pounds of get the hell outta my way. It offended me.