Is the US slowly dying?

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blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
The student population chosen is usually very selective, depending on the country.

The problem isn't the schools, its the parents and the culture and it hasn't really declined at all. The idea that America was anywhere near the top in education is laughable. As is ripping on the federal education system when every single one of those countries has a federal education system.


Well, the goal of the people running the PISA test is to select a random group of children of appropriate age for the tests. Maybe some countries are circumventing that. However, that's not something that is desired by the people who run the tests.


Put 100% of those kids in a position that demands critical thinking, and watch 100% of those kids fail.

The people who designed the tests attempt to work in measures of critical thinking into the reading parts of the test. If you take their website at face value.
 

SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,928
142
106
The United States may be struggling right now, but China has significant, major challenges they need to address before they can continue to to grow.

For one, China's production of food is not sustainable given their massive population. There has already been widespread reports of overtaxing of aquifers, and there's undeniable evidence already of the rapid expansion of the Gobi Desert as a result of overgrazing, deforestation, and other human impact. That's not to say that the United States hasn't significantly impacted the environment of our own lands, but the simple fact remains that, as 1.3 billion people become more prosperous, so too does their energy expenditure increase.

For second, let's not beat around the bush here. China is hiding some major debt problems of their own. When the world economy hit the shitter in 2008, China, like the United States, bailed itself out. But imagine if we spent $4 trillion bailing ourselves out, and that's essentially what China did if you compare it to a percentage of their GDP. Unless China makes significant reduction in its overall debt levels, their economy will go the way Japan's did; level off.

For third, the United States had an overabundance of one specific resource that played an extremely strong contributing role to the overall economic prosperity of our nation during the 20th century; oil. China, unfortunately, will not have this [cheap] luxury during their rise in the 21st century (a luxury that isn't cheap for us anymore either).

And that leads me to this; to think that the United State is simply going to crash and burn only to be a page in the world history book, is kinda silly. Great Britain was once a world superpower. France was once a world superpower. Russia was just recently a world superpower. Sure, they may not enjoy that status like they once did, but that doesn't mean their land a smoking ruin of has-been's. The term "superpower" is simply a relative term. China, if they're able to work beyond their challenges, may supersede the United States as the world's leading economic superpower, and maybe if they steal enough of our shit, a military superpower as well, but that doesn't mean our nation is in decline.

The 21st century will be the defining moment for mankind as we begin to deplete our more easily accessible natural resources. No nation, not China, not the United States, not Russia, and not South Africa, will be free of the challenges we'll all eventually face. But the United States has weathered through far worse crises, and I'm sure our nation of intelligent people will be just fine once the "Carbon Era" of mankind is over.

Lastly, you can't directly compare test scores between nations with differing education policies. Asian nations typically employ more rote-based education systems, whereas European and American education focuses more critical thinking. Rote educated nations do typically test more favorably than those in the west, but they're still 100 years behind us to walk on the moon.

You forgot to add the most important aspect (like I said before), which is the disparity of intellectual vs manufacturing wealth generated. Intellectual wealth is simply more efficient dollar per dollar and it's why our service economy will always trump a manufacturing like China's. For example, if Facebook/mp3 album/web service generates 100,000 dollars in a day, how long would it take China to generate the same amount of profit? China will need to penetrate the intellectual market to really be considered a threat, and they can't do that while suppressing the peasants who are about to rebel due wage pressure.
 

Arkaign

Lifer
Oct 27, 2006
20,736
1,377
126
This is why we should just disband the damned socialized public school system instead of just mercifully slashing and slashing their budgets. Socialism is no good and making me pay just so someones kid can get an education is getting in the way of tax cuts. (Gov Christie knows this all too well but not even he can stand up to that godless muslim socialist guy) Poor kids like their poor parents lack our superior values, that is why they're poor. Why the hell should I have to pay just so they can get an education? They should just get working class jobs to support our country and leave us to our private school institutions.

At the very least, make everything a la carte so only those with the values/wealth to send their kids to school can have a proper education. Giving everybody schooling and knowledge just makes them more difficult to control and subvert. Worse, they could riot against us. Do you seriously want that to happen? Freakin' Socialists.

Hmm. Why are taxes too high now, compared to the 50s and 60s when they were much higher, but our country was certainly doing tremendously better then vs. now. Look at the tax rates under Eisenhower for example.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,572
66
91
www.bing.com
Hmm. Why are taxes too high now, compared to the 50s and 60s when they were much higher, but our country was certainly doing tremendously better then vs. now. Look at the tax rates under Eisenhower for example.

Back then every working male was a vet of at least one world war. They were raised by great depression people, who were raised by Civil War kids. Hell they even elected the Supreme Commander as the president.

Basically, there were no free loading pussies.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
106
Yes, we are slowly dying. Liberals and democrats have turned us into a welfare country where everyone expects things to be given to them and they don't expect to have to work for it.
It will only get worse after Obama wins his re-election.
Soon the founding fathers will be rolling in their graves if they aren't already.

I disagree. "The American Way" is not an entirely individualistic one, despite individualism being a large part of it. When it really counts, we come together to take care of the least among us, or to take care of a common foe. Obama has nothing to do with that.

China will rise, and we will still be their counterweight like we were to the Soviets before them. Our wounds currently are self-inflicted. It isn't one of 'entitlement', except from Wall St. We need to protect and grow both our industry and our workforce, by rejecting free-trade dogma and standing up for ourselves for the first time in thirty years. Our best years are in fact ahead of us...

/ATPN
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally Posted by Fritzo
I found a receipt from Kroger a couple of months back dated Oct 2005 (they're a national supermarket chain) and it had things like:

1 gallon milk: $1.69
bread: $.89
eggs: $.79
cheese: $2.00
14 oz. potato chips: $1.50
etc

Today, these same items are:

1 gallon milk: $3.69
bread: $2.89
eggs: $1.79
cheese: $4.00
12 oz. potato chips: $4.00

That's more than double the cost in just 6 years.

No one is forcing anyone to buy luxury items,

Luxury items not found except maybe the potato chips.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Originally Posted by Fritzo
I found a receipt from Kroger a couple of months back dated Oct 2005 (they're a national supermarket chain) and it had things like:

1 gallon milk: $1.69
bread: $.89
eggs: $.79
cheese: $2.00
14 oz. potato chips: $1.50
etc

Today, these same items are:

1 gallon milk: $3.69
bread: $2.89
eggs: $1.79
cheese: $4.00
12 oz. potato chips: $4.00

That's more than double the cost in just 6 years.



Luxury items not found except maybe the potato chips.

I love how you even edit quotes from posters here like you do for your 'news reporting'.

You left out this part from the OP you quoted:
I don't think the US has a rights problem. We have a "corporations making it seem like luxury items are an essential part of life, so take out massive lines of credit to and be indebted for the rest of your life" problem.

Would vinegar be a luxury item or necessity? Would the paperwork required to buy it be different depending on that first choice?
 

Fritzo

Lifer
Jan 3, 2001
41,912
2,146
126
I love how you even edit quotes from posters here like you do for your 'news reporting'.

You left out this part from the OP you quoted:


Would vinegar be a luxury item or necessity? Would the paperwork required to buy it be different depending on that first choice?

I was referring to things like iPads, new cars, and smartphones there, not food items.
 

SandEagle

Lifer
Aug 4, 2007
16,809
13
0
Originally Posted by Fritzo
I found a receipt from Kroger a couple of months back dated Oct 2005 (they're a national supermarket chain) and it had things like:

1 gallon milk: $1.69
bread: $.89
eggs: $.79
cheese: $2.00
14 oz. potato chips: $1.50
etc

Today, these same items are:

1 gallon milk: $3.69
bread: $2.89
eggs: $1.79
cheese: $4.00
12 oz. potato chips: $4.00

That's more than double the cost in just 6 years.



Luxury items not found except maybe the potato chips.

maybe because kroger sucks? or your shopping skills suck? i regularly buy those items from walmart for:

1 gallon milk: $2.40
bread: $1.50
eggs: $1.59
cheese: $1.99
12 oz. potato chips: $1.99
 

Fritzo

Lifer
Jan 3, 2001
41,912
2,146
126
maybe because kroger sucks? or your shopping skills suck? i regularly buy those items from walmart for:

1 gallon milk: $2.40
bread: $1.50
eggs: $1.59
cheese: $1.99
12 oz. potato chips: $1.99

Ohhhhhh...that's it. My shopping skills suck. America is in great shape. It was all me. Sorry everybody.
 

Sonikku

Lifer
Jun 23, 2005
15,745
4,563
136
To think a 30" CRT HDTV cost $1000 back in 2005 and would break your back to carry but today you can get a 32" flat panel HDTV for $250-300. Because everything that happens in costs and prices over the past decade can be directly attributed to Obama, can we then make the argument that Obama is the man giving the gift of high definition to the masses?
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
To think a 30" CRT HDTV cost $1000 back in 2005 and would break your back to carry but today you can get a 32" flat panel HDTV for $250-300. Because everything that happens in costs and prices over the past decade can be directly attributed to Obama, can we then make the argument that Obama is the man giving the gift of high definition to the masses?

not sure wher8=====0 you are going with this.

most shitty 32 HDTV panels are not equal to CRT.

CRT is going dinosaur though at the upper levels.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
no most 32" hdtv are more than equal to crt.

the only real hd 1080i approaching crt were the sony super fine pitch trinitron, and they cost even more than what he listed.
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
14,278
89
91
Ohhhhhh...that's it. My shopping skills suck. America is in great shape. It was all me. Sorry everybody.

Prices change by region. Hickville Pennsytucky: Frozen Pizza: $4.50

Washington DC, same store, walmart, frozen pizza: $6.00

His same region data is more accurate then just "oh yea well its cheaper here"

Places like Texas have lower costs of living. In NYC you are broke if you make 80k/yr because food, transportation, etc. is so expensive.

Thats why people who make 200k/yr and live in NYC were complaining about taxes that target the rich because 200k/yr in NYC isn't exactly rich but 200k in rural Texas is a different story.
 
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