Is this unreasonable?

[JujuFish]

My grandfather wants to purchase an SUV to replace his Chevy Blazer that's nickle-and-diming him to death. My mom has POA and handles all of his finances. She refuses to even consider any automaker that isn't American. In fact, she's only barely even considering Ford, preferring to stick with Chevrolet.

Her argument was that she's supporting American jobs. I pointed out to her that, for example, Toyota owns or contracts 8 manufacturing facilities in the US. After that, she changed her stance and said that she wants to keep the money in America. I didn't really say much about this, because I don't know how the financial structure works, but these are all multinational corporations anyway.

Am I just crazy or is she being somewhat unreasonable?


Update:
For those who are curious, she got him a used 2008 Chevrolet Trailblazer LT (8600 miles) for $19,200.

 

[zoiks]

She's being reasonable. Ultimately the profits go to Japan and the honchos in charge there.
Besides, the newer American vehicles are actually pretty good and in some cases better than their Japanese counterparts.

 

[ayabe]

A hell of a lot of American cars are made in Mexico.

That being said, they're generally on par with Japanese cars nowadays in terms of reliability.

 

[desy]

Buying American does keep more jobs in America
But if she can settle for an 'american built' car the Vin will start with 1, 2 for Canada, 3 for
Mexico and so on

"The first digit identifies the nation of origin. If the car was assembled from parts produced in different countries, this digit reflects the nation where the car was assembled. Some larger nations are split into regions. For example, cars built in Japan are assigned a J in the first digit. But cars made in the U.S. can have a 1, 4 or 5, depending on the region of its assembly.
The second digit identifies the manufacturer of the vehicle. In the United States, the Society for Automotive Engineers issues manufacturer codes.
The third digit identifies a division within the manufacturer or a general vehicle type. For example, the code for an American-made Ford is 1F, and depending on the type of vehicle, it may be a 1FA, 1FB and so on. A U.S. General Motors vehicle is a 1G. Chevrolet is a division of GM, so the first three digits for a Chevrolet are 1GC. "

http://www.vehicleidentificati...umbers_vin_detail.html

 

[MixMasterTang]

Originally posted by: desy
Buying American does keep more jobs in America
But if she can settle for an 'american built' car the Vin will start with 1, 2 for Canada, 3 for
Mexico and so on

"The first digit identifies the nation of origin. If the car was assembled from parts produced in different countries, this digit reflects the nation where the car was assembled. Some larger nations are split into regions. For example, cars built in Japan are assigned a J in the first digit. But cars made in the U.S. can have a 1, 4 or 5, depending on the region of its assembly.
The second digit identifies the manufacturer of the vehicle. In the United States, the Society for Automotive Engineers issues manufacturer codes.
The third digit identifies a division within the manufacturer or a general vehicle type. For example, the code for an American-made Ford is 1F, and depending on the type of vehicle, it may be a 1FA, 1FB and so on. A U.S. General Motors vehicle is a 1G. Chevrolet is a division of GM, so the first three digits for a Chevrolet are 1GC. "

http://www.vehicleidentificati...umbers_vin_detail.html

I would also like to point out that a car company employs more people than just those at the plant. Office workers, engineers, designers, accountants, IT, etc.

 

[Kadarin]

There's nothing wrong with her POV. If she wants to buy an American vehicle that fits your grandfather's and her needs, then great.

 

[cheesehead]

It's ridiculous.

General Motors is a global corporation - remember, they also own Opel, Vauxhall, Holden, and one or two other brands too. Anyone can buy stock, and while quite a bit of cash goes to the "head honchos" even more, it's miniscule compared to the amount going to the stockholders.

Furthermore, as a Wisconsin resident, I personally loathe GM - they've really shafted american workers. Just take a look at their cars - the Aveo is built in Korea, the G8 is built in Australia, and the Astra is built in Belgium. If you want to truly buy american, you're likely better off buying a Honda.

It's not like we've got a lot of engineering done here, either. With the possible exception of the LS series V8s, almost all GM production engines were mostly designed overseas. Ford's "duratec" engines are either just stripped-down versions of the Mazda MZR inline four, or the result of a Porsche V6 design product that Ford bought out and had Cosworth (british) finish for them.

As far as I can tell, the most American automaker by far is Chrysler. However, to actually buy a chrysler, you'd have to be mad.

Personally, I would recommend either a Subaru Forester or Honda CR-V, both of which are quite reasonably priced (especially if you get 'em used), very reliable, and very safe.

 

[MiataNC]

Buying a car built in America supports the Americans who work in the plants.

Any dealership you buy from and have your car serviced at supports the Americans working there.

The money they get in their paychecks is then spent within the US supporting other Americans.

In my opinion it ultimately does not matter where the "profits" go if a person really wants to support the American worker.

One you thing you better make sure she is aware of is that buying Ford/Chevy/Dodge does NOT mean the car is built in the US. Most are built in Canada or Mexico.

 

[MixMasterTang]

Originally posted by: MiataNC
Buying a car built in America supports the Americans who work in the plants.

Any dealership you buy from and have your car serviced at supports the Americans working there.

The money they get in their paychecks is then spent within the US supporting other Americans.

In my opinion it ultimately does not matter where the "profits" go if a person really wants to support the American worker.

One you thing you better make sure she is aware of is that buying Ford/Chevy/Dodge does NOT mean the car is built in the US. Most are built in Canada or Mexico.

Let's play a game them, to give you a chance to back up your statement. I will list Ford/GM/Chrysler cards made in America, and you list the ones that are not. If your list is bigger than mine you win and your statement holds true.

Buick LeSabre ? Orion Township, Michigan
Buick Lucerne ? Hamtramck, Michigan
Buick Park Avenue ? Orion Township, Michigan
Buick Rainier ? Moraine, Ohio
Buick Terraza ? Doraville, Georgia

Cadillac CTS ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac DeVille ? Hamtramck, Michigan
Cadillac DTS ? Hamtramck, Michigan
Cadillac Escalade ? Arlington, Texas
Cadillac SRX ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac STS ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac XLR ? Bowling Green, Kentucky

Chevrolet Cobalt ? Lordstown, Ohio
Chevrolet Colorado ? Shreveport, Louisiana
Chevrolet Corvette ? Bowling Green, Kentucky
Chevrolet Express ? Wentzville, Missouri
Chevrolet Malibu ? Kansas City, Missouri
Chevrolet Malibu Maxx ? Kansas City, Missouri
Chevrolet Silverado ? Flint, Michigan; Pontiac, Michigan; Ft. Wayne, Indiana
Chevrolet SSR ? Lansing, Michigan
Chevrolet Suburban ? Arlington, Texas and ; Janesville, Wisconsin
Chevrolet Tahoe ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin
Chevrolet TrailBlazer ? Moraine, Ohio
Chevrolet TrailBlazer EXT ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Chevrolet Uplander ? Doraville, Georgia

Chrysler Sebring Convertible ? Sterling Heights, Michigan
Chrysler Sebring Coupe ? Normal, Illinois
Chrysler Sebring Sedan ? Sterling Heights, Michigan
Chrysler Town & Country ? St. Louis, Missouri

Dodge Caravan ? St. Louis, Missouri
Dodge Dakota ? Warren, Michigan
Dodge Durango ? Newark, Delaware
Dodge Grand Caravan ? St. Louis, Missouri
Dodge Neon ? Belvidere, Illinois
Dodge Sprinter ? Gaffney, South Carolina
Dodge Stratus Coupe ? Normal, Illinois
Dodge Stratus Sedan ? Sterling Heights, Michigan
Dodge Ram ? St. Louis, Missouri and Warren, Michigan
Dodge Viper ? Detroit, Michigan

Ford E-Series ? Lorain, Ohio
Ford Escape ? Kansas City, Missouri and Avon Lake, Ohio
Ford Excursion ? Kansas City, Missouri
Ford Expedition ? Wayne, Michigan
Ford Explorer ? Louisville, Kentucky and Fenton, Missouri
Ford F-Series ? Dearborn, Michigan; Wayne, Michigan; Kansas City, Missouri; Norfolk,Virginia
Ford Five Hundred ? Chicago, Illinois
Ford Focus ? Wayne, Michigan
Ford Freestyle ? Chicago, Illinois
Ford GT ? Wixom, Michigan
Ford Mustang ? Flat Rock, Michigan
Ford Ranger ? Minneapolis, Minnesota
Ford Taurus ? Atlanta, Georgia
Ford Thunderbird ? Wixom, Michigan

GMC Canyon ? Shreveport, Louisiana
GMC Envoy ? Moraine, Ohio
GMC Envoy XL ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
GMC Envoy XUV ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
GMC Savana ? Wentzville, Missouri
GMC Sierra ? Flint, Michigan; Pontiac, Michigan; Ft. Wayne, Indiana
GMC Yukon ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin
GMC Yukon XL ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin

Hummer H1 ? Mishawaka, Indiana
Hummer H2 ? Mishawaka, Indiana
Hummer H3 ? Shreveport, Louisiana

Jeep Commander ? Detroit, Michigan
Jeep Grand Cherokee ? Detroit, Michigan
Jeep Liberty ? Toledo, Ohio
Jeep Wrangler ? Toledo, Ohio

Lincoln Aviator ? Fenton, Missouri
Lincoln LS ? Wixom, Michigan
Lincoln Mark LT ? Dearborn, Michigan
Lincoln Navigator ? Wayne, Michigan
Lincoln Town Car ? Wixom, Michigan

Mercury Mariner ? Avon Lake, Ohio
Mercury Montego ? Chicago, Illinois
Mercury Mountaineer ? Louisville, Kentucky and Fenton, Missouri
Mercury Sable ? Atlanta, Georgia

Pontiac G6 ? Orion Township, Michigan
Pontiac Grand Am ? Lansing, Michigan
Pontiac Montana SV6 ? Doraville, Georgia
Pontiac Solstice ? Wilmington, Delaware
Pontiac Sunfire ? Lordstown, Ohio
Pontiac Vibe ? Fremont, California
Saturn Ion ? Spring Hill, Tennessee
Saturn L-Series ? Wilmington, Delaware
Saturn Relay ? Doraville, Georgia
Saturn Vue ? Spring Hill, Tennessee

 

[JDub02]

For the past year or so, I've been doing the same thing. On any product I'm shopping for, I check to see if one is made in America by an American company. If so, that's the one I buy.

Got about 2/3 of that with my car. My Mazda6 was made in Michigan and Ford owns a piece of Mazda. Unfortunately, I don't think any American auto maker produce a sporty mid-size sedan with a manual transmission and that's what I was shopping for.

 

[MiataNC]

Impressive list.

I have to admit, I was not aware that so many were still built here.

 

[desy]

Ah so the cheeshead's bias finally is out for all to see and no wonder his opnions on all things auto are so fundamentally screwed.

They're just companies buddy get over it

 

[ViviTheMage]

Screw American cars, I hate em.

IMO, her reasoning is crazy.

 

[Tiamat]

That's not too unreasonable. For example, what is unreasonable is Chinese adults in USA that do not buy Japanese cars because of the oppression that their relatives suffered.

 

[StageLeft]

They don't understand anything would be my conclusion.

A lot of American cars are made elsewhere like Canada. I would bet that more money stays in the US by buying a Toyota made by a guy here with whatever profit ends up in Japan vs buying a domestic brand with the profit (lawls, these are domestics we're talking about, but stay with me) staying in the US but the guy who made it actually in Ontario.

 

[PricklyPete]

There is nothing unreasonable with her desire to stick with a specific brand or national origin of company. Her reason's may not be sound, but why does she need to answer to you. There are plenty of quality vehicles made by American manufacturers. You're grandfather will likely be more than happy. So why are you taking this to heart and feeling the need to sway her another way? How old are you?

 

[woodie1]

No matter what brand you buy it will not have 100% American built parts. There will be items that come from outside our borders regardless of where the final assembly is done. I bought a new CL-S and it was 93% US parts. The transmission was Japanese and it was a POS.

 

[mwmorph]

Originally posted by: MiataNC
Impressive list.

I have to admit, I was not aware that so many were still built here.

Some of the cars on the list no longer are built and it doesn't include many new cars like the GM Lambdas. All in all it's quite outdated and some cars have shifted around plants. I've tried to correct it but I'm sure some of it's still wrong since I don't have the time. Also, a few brands like Volvo, Saab, etc are missing.

If you're going to make an argument, at least make sure your information correct.

Still in production
Buick Enclave ? Delta Township, Michigan
Buick Lucerne ? Hamtramck, Michigan


Cadillac CTS ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac DTS ? Hamtramck, Michigan
Cadillac Escalade ? Arlington, Texas
Cadillac SRX ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac STS ? Lansing, Michigan
Cadillac XLR ? Bowling Green, Kentucky

Chevrolet Cobalt ? Lordstown, Ohio
Chevrolet Colorado ? Shreveport, Louisiana <--(Also, built in Thailand, check the window sticker)
Chevrolet Corvette ? Bowling Green, Kentucky
Chevrolet Express ? Wentzville, Missouri
Chevrolet Malibu ? Kansas City, Missouri
Chevrolet Silverado ? Flint, Michigan; Pontiac, Michigan; Ft. Wayne, Indiana
Chevrolet Suburban ? Arlington, Texas and ; Janesville, Wisconsin
Chevrolet Tahoe ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin
Chevrolet TrailBlazer ? Moraine, Ohio
Chevrolet TrailBlazer EXT ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma (Ohio plant closing Dec 23rd 2008, Trailblazer being discontinued)
Chevrolet Traverse ? Delta Township, Michigan

Chrysler Sebring Convertible ? Sterling Heights, Michigan
Chrysler Sebring Sedan ? Sterling Heights, Michigan
Chrysler Town & Country ? St. Louis, Missouri

Dodge Dakota ? Warren, Michigan
Dodge Durango ? Newark, Delaware
Dodge Grand Caravan ? St. Louis, Missouri
Dodge Ram ? St. Louis, Missouri and Warren, Michigan
Dodge Viper ? Detroit, Michigan

Ford E-Series ? Lorain, Ohio
Ford Escape ? Kansas City, Missouri and Avon Lake, Ohio
Ford Expedition ? Wayne, Michigan
Ford Explorer ? Louisville, Kentucky and Fenton, Missouri
Ford F-Series ? Dearborn, Michigan; Wayne, Michigan; Kansas City, Missouri; Norfolk,Virginia
Ford Focus ? Wayne, Michigan
Ford Mustang ? Flat Rock, Michigan
Ford Ranger ? Minneapolis, Minnesota
Ford Taurus ? Chicago, Illinois

GMC Acadia
GMC Canyon ? Shreveport, Louisiana(Check window sticker, also made in Thailand)
GMC Envoy ? Moraine, Ohio(Last year in production, plant to be shuttered in 2009)
GMC Savana ? Wentzville, Missouri
GMC Sierra ? Flint, Michigan; Pontiac, Michigan; Ft. Wayne, Indiana
GMC Yukon ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin
GMC Yukon XL ? Arlington, Texas and Janesville, Wisconsin

Hummer H2 ? Mishawaka, Indiana
Hummer H3 ? Shreveport, Louisiana

Jeep Commander ? Detroit, Michigan
Jeep Grand Cherokee ? Detroit, Michigan
Jeep Liberty ? Toledo, Ohio
Jeep Wrangler ? Toledo, Ohio

Lincoln Navigator ? Wayne, Michigan
Lincoln Town Car ? Wixom, Michigan
Lincoln MKX ? Chicago, Illinois

Mercury Mariner ? Avon Lake, Ohio
Mercury Mountaineer ? Louisville, Kentucky and Fenton, Missouri
Mercury Sable ? Chicago, Illinois

Pontiac G6 ? Orion Township, Michigan
Pontiac Solstice ? Wilmington, Delaware
Pontiac Vibe ? Fremont, California

Saturn Outlook ? Delta Township, Michigan

No longer in production


Buick LeSabre ? Orion Township, Michigan
Buick Park Avenue ? Orion Township, Michigan
Buick Rainier ? Moraine, Ohio
Buick Terraza ? Doraville, Georgia

Cadillac DeVille ? Hamtramck, Michigan

Chrysler Sebring Coupe ? Normal, Illinois

Chevrolet Malibu Maxx ? Kansas City, Missouri
Chevrolet SSR ? Lansing, Michigan
Chevrolet Uplander ? Doraville, Georgia

Dodge Caravan ? St. Louis, Missouri
Dodge Neon ? Belvidere, Illinois
Dodge Sprinter ? Gaffney, South Carolina
Dodge Stratus Coupe ? Normal, Illinois
Dodge Stratus Sedan ? Sterling Heights, Michigan

Ford Excursion ? Kansas City, Missouri
Ford Five Hundred ? Chicago, Illinois
Ford Freestyle ? Chicago, Illinois
Ford GT ? Wixom, Michigan
Ford Thunderbird ? Wixom, Michigan

GMC Envoy XL ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
GMC Envoy XUV ? Oklahoma City, Oklahoma

Hummer H1 ? Mishawaka, Indiana

Lincoln Aviator ? Fenton, Missouri
Lincoln LS ? Wixom, Michigan
Lincoln Mark LT ? Dearborn, Michigan

Mercury Montego ? Chicago, Illinois

Pontiac Grand Am ? Lansing, Michigan
Pontiac Montana SV6 ? Doraville, Georgia
Pontiac Sunfire ? Lordstown, Ohio

Saturn Ion ? Spring Hill, Tennessee
Saturn L-Series ? Wilmington, Delaware
Saturn Relay ? Doraville, Georgia
Saturn Vue ? Spring Hill, Tennessee (Now assembled in Mexico)



I don't believe Buying American helps America all that much. Even Ford Explorers have Transmissions from Germany and the Engines are from Canada. It's a world economy now. Deal with it.

 

[thedarkwolf]

How many people in here refuse to buy any cars made in America?

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: thedarkwolf
How many people in here refuse to buy any cars made in America?

That cuts off a LOT of cars. As already said Honda and toyota make a lot of their cars here. Heck even BMW has a plant in SC.



Me and my wife have bought what worked best at the time for what we wanted. Between us we have owned...

3 Chevys (Monza, C10 truck, Corvette)
1 Toyota (Rav4)
1 Pontiac (Firebird)
1 Mazda (B4000)
1 Buick (LeSabre)
1 Saab (900SE Turbo)
1 Cadillac (CTS)
1 Honda (Shadow VT700 motorcycle)

Best bang for the buck is what we get and have. Only one we did not pay cash for was the toyota and that was her first car.

 

[evident]

meh, big 3 brainwashing as far as im concerned. i'll buy american built hondas/toyotas. tell the employees that build those vehicles that profits are going back to japan and see what they say.

 

[JujuFish]

Originally posted by: PricklyPete
There is nothing unreasonable with her desire to stick with a specific brand or national origin of company. Her reason's may not be sound, but why does she need to answer to you. There are plenty of quality vehicles made by American manufacturers. You're grandfather will likely be more than happy. So why are you taking this to heart and feeling the need to sway her another way? How old are you?

You're welcome to jump to all the conclusions you want to, but you know what you say when you assume. She's not "answering" to me. Even if people completely agreed with me here, I wouldn't then go and take that information and throw it in her face. The discussion with her is done. I came to AT to find out about the opinions of people here, more as a check for myself. If I'm wrong, I'd like to know.

To answer your question, I'm not trying to sway her any way. I just don't agree with not even CONSIDERING the possibility of purchasing a foreign car, regardless of where it's actually made.

 

[SoundTheSurrender]

Foreign cars are still made in America and are apart of the American GDP.

Go ahead and buy a subpar American vehicle though. You'll keep the auto mechanics job's alive.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: SoundTheSurrender
Foreign cars are still made in America and are apart of the American GDP.

Go ahead and buy a subpar American vehicle though. You'll keep the auto mechanics job's alive.

:roll: Thanks for the post, I now know to ignore any post from you since you know little to nothing.

 

[f1r3s1d3]

Shut up and tell her to keep buying America. Don't argue with her.