Is Venezuela Next?

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MajinCry

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2015
2,495
571
136
Oh goody. We all know how this goes; US goes in "to save the people", and promptly murders millions, and hundreds of thousands raped.

Give it a decade after the war, and there will be a movie about how slaying and raping innocents made American soldiers feel sad.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
Thanks. Pointing out how you work is not all that hard really. I think most of us on the Left dont do it because so many have you blocked.

Do keep pretending you & the other conservatives don't parrot trump on this topic and every other you partake in.

Oh goody. We all know how this goes; US goes in "to save the people", and promptly murders millions, and hundreds of thousands raped.

Give it a decade after the war, and there will be a movie about how slaying and raping innocents made American soldiers feel sad.

Yes, but there are many sides to this as the conservatives will all let everyone know.
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,448
1,070
126
i remember when this place was good for impassioned discussion, now posts with any substance are simply ignored by you idiots.
 
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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
Do keep pretending you & the other conservatives don't parrot trump on this topic and every other you partake in.



Yes, but there are many sides to this as the conservatives will all let everyone know.

I'm sure you will let us know.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,651
50,912
136
I wonder how many people die from traffic accidents. Or lighting strikes.

My curiosity, like yours about deaths from malnutrition, is quite irrelevant to whether or not the US needs to sanction or invade venezuela.

While I certainly don't think invading Venezuela is the answer the amount of excess death a government is inflicting on its population is most certainly relevant.

It is quite absurd to blame Maduro for malnutrition in venezuela.

Are you joking? Malnutrition in Venezuela has skyrocketed in recent years, specifically because of failed government policy. Maduro (and Chavez before him) are absolutely the people to blame.
 

FIVR

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,753
911
106
You must be joking. . . The dictator of Venezuela is not responsible for the crisis levels of inflation and absurd black market of food and essential goods?
He is wholly responsible for the price fixing, the decline of oil income for the country, the lack of food and supplies for his people and the exit of nearly every international business that was still trying to make a go and provide what little employment was left. He murders his political enemy's and steals from his people, meanwhile his people can not buy food with the worthless currency.

I suppose you think its the clerk at home depot in Alabama that caused all this with his website?

https://www.pri.org/stories/2016-12...ue-depends-largely-one-guy-alabama-home-depot

I would love to hear from you why its not Maduro. also, if the people are responsible there, Then surly the people here are responsible for themselves as well?

Maduro just continued the policies of Chavez. He was not responsible for the drop in oil prices (that was due to falling demand and increasing supply from shale oil producers in the US).


If anybody is to blame for venezuela's economic issues, it's shale Oil producers in the US and Canada. Also, electric vehicles and the resulting lower demand for oil and gas. They should be sanctioned.
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,448
1,070
126
I want to know why another poster thinks Maduro is not part the problem in Venezuela. He may be a puppet of the Cubans, who nearly totally rely on Venezuela for cheap energy and economic support and Chavez royalty, even so, He is to blame for the continuation of the horrible conditions and corruption that is killing the people. I suppose if the population gets low enough, he can just claim all of the land in the country for his own fortune and sell the oil / burn the rain forests for fun. did you also see that he owns the mexican based company that the Ve government pays to 'distribute food to the needy"?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,651
50,912
136
This not why people join the military. There are basically only 2 reasons to join:

1. Their father/mother/brother/family is in the military.

2. They dumb. Need money, but too dumb. So sign up for the army, they pay good.

Stay classy. You have a deep knowledge of why people join the military, aided by your clearly superior brainpower.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
I'm sure you will let us know.

I do tend to point out when conservatives try to blame problems they cause on everyone else. Eg:

I want to know why another poster thinks Maduro is not part the problem in Venezuela. He may be a puppet of the Cubans, who nearly totally rely on Venezuela for cheap energy and economic support and Chavez royalty, even so, He is to blame for the continuation of the horrible conditions and corruption that is killing the people. I suppose if the population gets low enough, he can just claim all of the land in the country for his own fortune and sell the oil / burn the rain forests for fun. did you also see that he owns the mexican based company that the Ve government pays to 'distribute food to the needy"?

The absolute garbage conditions for their underclass caused by the Venezuelan right is what prompted them to vote for Chavez. You know this well as anyone, even if the party of personal responsibility can never take any.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,651
50,912
136
Maduro just continued the policies of Chavez. He was not responsible for the drop in oil prices (that was due to falling demand and increasing supply from shale oil producers in the US).

If anybody is to blame for venezuela's economic issues, it's shale Oil producers in the US and Canada. Also, electric vehicles and the resulting lower demand for oil and gas. They should be sanctioned.

Yes clearly the government of Venezuela is not to blame for wasting years of very high oil prices with almost zero investment. It's usually the sign of smart government policy when, after implementing your policies, the only thing standing between your country and starvation is the hope that abnormally high oil prices never revert to the mean.

Let's be smart and blame everyone except the people running the country during those times.
 
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
11,718
136
You may want to check your numbers. The situation is horrible for sure, but its not 10s of thousands killed. Its in the thousands for sure which is very sad, but not 10s.

Might not be in multiple 10s but it's probably close to or over 10,000 and that's in 1 year.

"Since the former mayor of Davao city became president last July, government figures show police have killed close to 3,500 “drug personalities”. More than 2,000 other people have been killed in drug-related crimes and thousands more murdered in unexplained circumstances, according to official data."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-philippines-drug-war-sparks-nationwide-anger

Human Rights Watch claims over 7000 dead as of March this year.

https://www.hrw.org/tag/philippines-war-drugs
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,448
1,070
126
Maduro just continued the policies of Chavez. He was not responsible for the drop in oil prices (that was due to falling demand and increasing supply from shale oil producers in the US).


If anybody is to blame for venezuela's economic issues, it's shale Oil producers in the US and Canada. They should be sanctioned.

actually not true at all. the industry was nationalized, the VE government took over many of the rigs drilling in the countries off shore fields, many of the smaller service companies and land drillers, the refiners, the pipelines etc. VE oil is much cheaper to produce than any drop found in a shale well in the US. They took over the refineries and rigs, hired loyalists to run them and kicked out all the engineers and people who know how to run things. Their production has fallen because they have no cash, no expertise, and no outside investment. In 2010 they took over 10 or 12 off shore rigs owned by H&P based in Oklahoma. Many of the fields there are ripe for the picking, if only they could figure out how to do it, or pay someone to do it.

even ISIS is smarter than that! they have created a very interesting black market system to produce oil and get paid for it by everyone with out everyone knowing where it came from.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,651
50,912
136
actually not true at all. the industry was nationalized, the VE government took over many of the rigs drilling in the countries off shore fields, many of the smaller service companies and land drillers, the refiners, the pipelines etc. VE oil is much cheaper to produce than any drop found in a shale well in the US. They took over the refineries and rigs, hired loyalists to run them and kicked out all the engineers and people who know how to run thing things. Their production has fallen because they have no cash, no expertise, and no outside investment. in 2010 they took over 10 or 12 off shore rigs owned by H&P based in Oklahoma. Many of the fields there are ripe for the picking, if only they could figure out how to do it, or pay someone to do it.

even ISIS is smarter than that! they have created a very interesting black market system to produce oil and get paid for it by everyone with out everyone knowing where it came from.

Yes, it is frankly baffling how anyone could view Venezuela's problems as anything other than overwhelmingly the government's fault. It mortgaged the country's future for short term political gains/corruption.

They were actually really lucky that super high oil prices papered over their failure for years. Without that the music would have stopped a good bit earlier.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
Might not be in multiple 10s but it's probably close to or over 10,000 and that's in 1 year.

"Since the former mayor of Davao city became president last July, government figures show police have killed close to 3,500 “drug personalities”. More than 2,000 other people have been killed in drug-related crimes and thousands more murdered in unexplained circumstances, according to official data."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-philippines-drug-war-sparks-nationwide-anger

Human Rights Watch claims over 7000 dead as of March this year.

https://www.hrw.org/tag/philippines-war-drugs

Well you see, dear leader likes Duerte and dislikes Venezuela. All you need to know to perfectly explain the behavior of pretty much every conservative.

actually not true at all. the industry was nationalized, the VE government took over many of the rigs drilling in the countries off shore fields, many of the smaller service companies and land drillers, the refiners, the pipelines etc. VE oil is much cheaper to produce than any drop found in a shale well in the US. They took over the refineries and rigs, hired loyalists to run them and kicked out all the engineers and people who know how to run thing things. Their production has fallen because they have no cash, no expertise, and no outside investment. in 2010 they took over 10 or 12 off shore rigs owned by H&P based in Oklahoma. Many of the fields there are ripe for the picking, if only they could figure out how to do it, or pay someone to do it.

even ISIS is smarter than that! they have created a very interesting black market system to produce oil and get paid for it by everyone with out everyone knowing where it came from.

Funny how all these guys didn't give a shit about VE when it was their guys starving out much of the population.
 
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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
Might not be in multiple 10s but it's probably close to or over 10,000 and that's in 1 year.

"Since the former mayor of Davao city became president last July, government figures show police have killed close to 3,500 “drug personalities”. More than 2,000 other people have been killed in drug-related crimes and thousands more murdered in unexplained circumstances, according to official data."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-philippines-drug-war-sparks-nationwide-anger

Human Rights Watch claims over 7000 dead as of March this year.

https://www.hrw.org/tag/philippines-war-drugs

Its horrible for sure, but saying 10s of thousands when its probably close to 7-8 only hurts the perception. Its bad, and its sad that internationally little to nothing is being done. But, if you want to compare the two countries Ven is likely had more deaths from the situation. So its true that murder by the state is nowhere near that of that in the Philippines, but total death count is likely higher in Ven.
 

FIVR

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,753
911
106
actually not true at all.


What I said:
Maduro just continued the policies of Chavez.

Literally the first sentence of the wikipedia article on the economic policies of Maduro:
When elected in 2013, Nicolás Maduro continued the majority of existing economic policies of his predecessor Hugo Chávez.

reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_policy_of_the_Nicolás_Maduro_administration


If you'd like to take it up with the wikipedia editors I'm sure they'd love to hear your theories on venezuelan economics.
 

FIVR

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,753
911
106
Yes clearly the government of Venezuela is not to blame for wasting years of very high oil prices with almost zero investment. It's usually the sign of smart government policy when, after implementing your policies, the only thing standing between your country and starvation is the hope that abnormally high oil prices never revert to the mean.

Let's be smart and blame everyone except the people running the country during those times.

Maduro is not the Venezuelan Government and from 2001 to 2013 when those prices were high and he was not the President. You can blame him for perhaps not reacting well to the economic downturn caused by Chavez policies, but you cannot blame him for oil prices or the malnutrition of venezuelans like you can blame Duterte for the extrajudicial killings he orders himself.
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,448
1,070
126
I must have missed the part where the leader, dictator by decree, of a failing society can not be held responsible for the failings of his party and people he has pledged loyalty to. Hold on a second, you are holding the current dumbass in power here to that... but poor misunderstood Muduro is just in a bad place and needs our sympathy.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Oh, this is you supporting your groups horrible ideas.

Here is the situation.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...hildren-survive-economic-crisis-a7479756.html

I get it those, these people are a little too brown for you to care. Just your true colors showing again right? Let the people starve to death is what Agent and his lot wants. Just another box of supporting Nazis I see.

Well that's enough for me. Time to bomb the shit out of their infrastructure, kill a few hundred thousand civilians, declare victory and leave the country fighting a civil war,

Either that or our only other option, invade the country and never fucking leave.

From what I can tell of our American foreign policy brain trust, these are the only two options they are capable of thinking up.
 
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Puffnstuff

Lifer
Mar 9, 2005
16,148
4,848
136
Trump can't be bothered with then as their first lady isn't hot enough to warrant his attention.
 

evident

Lifer
Apr 5, 2005
12,018
629
126
imagine joining the armed service because of how much you love your nation (too much) and then get sent to your death by a cheeto billionaire from nyc that hasnt done a day of real work in his life.

Sadly lots of brainwashed morons in the military who support this ass hole due to the R next to his name
 

FIVR

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,753
911
106
Stay classy. You have a deep knowledge of why people join the military, aided by your clearly superior brainpower.

Oh, I would never compare my brain power to yours.


I guess I forgot a third option. When I was in my senior year of high school several kids went into the military because they wanted to "kill some ***heads", ostensibly to "avenge 9/11". This was a couple years after 9/11 and they were, I guess, "patriots" in the eyes of many.


Do you consider them patriots?
 
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