Israel: We Are At War

[Leeea]

If you want to up the ante for US involvement, Iraqi militias vow to attack US bases / troops.
It may be time to GTFO of Syria and Iraq, completely. Unless we REALLY want to go in guns blazing.
We need to make sure there are ZERO US troops in the region for Iran / Iraq to target.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1711151114207571986

Thinking that is more Iran then Iraq with that.

I very much doubt the Iraqi government would attack US troops. They would just officially expel them.


As for Syria, I do not see them going anywhere. Iran is no friend of the SDF and never has pretended to be. Iran is allied with Assad, sometimes the SDF works with Assad, and sometimes they fight Assad. Iran backed Hezbollah militias into Syria, and they went after the YPG earlier in the war in Aleppo and Afrin. This is pre-US support and pre-SDF. It was pretty vicicious, chlorine gas was used on civilian apartment blocks. Not the sort of thing people forgive and forget. The YPG is one of the founding members of the SDF.

The AANES is the colition goverment of Kurdish and Arab peoples that the SDF is the official military of, where the US soldiers are based. Their latest news releases are all focused on Turkish escalation against them in northern Syria. I would remind you a US F16 just shot down a Turkish drone over AANES terroritory just a few days ago. I very much doubt they are going to say anything at all about the Isreali conflict.

 

[Amused]

Well the fun thing about 2023 is we can easily get a map with aerial views of the area to see what ‘we’ would be wiping off the map.

So starting with a square mile in Gaza as far from Egypt as possible

That would be roughly this view of the top corner of the Gaza Strip along the coast in the upper right quadrant of the above map.

View attachment 86836

Looks mostly agricultural. Google Earth doesn’t have much in the way of street level pictures other than one at a campground site with the back of some kids head.

So not much in the way of buildings to wipe off the map. But as we’ve seen in Ukraine when Putin attacks UK food production and distribution it does get a strong response.

So would you still want to start off by wiping out Palestinian food production in Gaza?

Um, yeah, look at google maps again. Gaza's population density is MUCH higher per square mile than most of Israel.

 

[MrSquished]

Yeah I totally get turning to psychopathic murderers to address their grievances. Totally got it when the PLO murdered those Israeli athletes at Munich, too. And all the rest of their anti-semitic fueled violence these past 100 years. Because these right wing religious fanatics, which describes the vast majority of Palestinians, never seem to have any choice but to turn to terrorism. Funny how they always seem to have no choice in the matter. It's always the evil Jews who made them do it.

It's pretty frightening how easy you dismiss the terrorism of the Israelis running an apartheid state for decades, punishing and killing journalists and civilians left and right.

I'm not justifying Hamas attacking civilians, but to ignore the reality of the ground and the horrific campaigns of the Israelis is just as disgusting.

 

[RnR_au]

260 dancers at the music festival was killed. They were overwhelmingly left wing peaceniks who supported a better deal for the Palestinians. I don't think there is any doubt that the HAMAS/Iran faction wants the Israeli/Arab struggle to continue for as long as possible. Peace in the Middle east is not in the best interest for the Iranian hardliners.

 

[kage69]

Just once I'd like to see this country say "Not my problem" and stay out of shit.

We did try that once, it was called WWI. Isolationism doesn't work for a global economy and super power. Certainly not for the country who established a rules based world order after WWII, such as it is.

I'd like to point out that Israel helped the US immensely after both the bombing of our embassy in Kenya and after 9/11. Many people won't like hearing this, but we kinda owe them right now.

 

[MrSquished]

We did try that once, it was called WWI. Isolationism doesn't work for a global economy and super power. Certainly not for the country who established a rules based world order after WWII, such as it is.

I'd like to point out that Israel helped the US immensely after both the bombing of our embassy in Kenya and after 9/11. Many people won't like hearing this, but we kinda owe them right now.

Absolutely incorrect about who owes who a debt. Israel has spied on the US and Israel has relied on the US to back up its apartheid state. If Israel was a little more reasonable there would have been a peace plan.

Israel has kept that powder keg lit because they never wanted peace they just wanted to destroy the Palestinians. And that has fucked up the Middle East a lot and that is fucked up the US a lot.

If anything Israel is so so indebted to the US for the shit they have created for us

 

[akugami]

Yeah I totally get turning to psychopathic murderers to address their grievances. Totally got it when the PLO murdered those Israeli athletes at Munich, too. And all the rest of their anti-semitic fueled violence these past 100 years. Because these right wing religious fanatics, which describes the vast majority of Palestinians, never seem to have any choice but to turn to terrorism. Funny how they always seem to have no choice in the matter. It's always the evil Jews who made them do it.

First and foremost, in absolutely no fashion will I ever support or excuse the behavior of a terrorist organization like Hamas. What they did is inexcusable.

But do not excuse Israel for their authoritarian rule over Palestinians for decades. Israel's occupation of the Gaza strips and the acts they have committed are oppressive in nature.

I'm massively simplifying it, but how would you like it if someone came and took your land, ruled over you, then divided up your land and gave half to someone else? That's Palestine.

Having been gifted half of Palestine in 1948, Israel was beset on all sides by its Arab neighbors. No one is saying they didn't have a right to defend themselves, even if the home never belonged to them in the first place, it's theirs now. No use crying over spilled milk. Nice doesn't mean weak and doesn't mean not standing up for yourself, so bravo for Israel.

In 1949, Israel signed peace agreements with its neighbors, and as part of the agreements, Egypt controlled the Gaza strip.

In 1956, Israel invaded the Gaza strip. Regardless of their reasoning (which was mostly economical), don't forget that Israel are the invaders.

Decades of bickering later, we have the recent actions of Hamas.

 

[RnR_au]

Somewhat offtopic, but pertaining to modern day Israel. The video was made before the HAMAS attack.

I found the comments on youtube interesting as well.

 

[Thunder 57]

We did try that once, it was called WWI. Isolationism doesn't work for a global economy and super power. Certainly not for the country who established a rules based world order after WWII, such as it is.

I'd like to point out that Israel helped the US immensely after both the bombing of our embassy in Kenya and after 9/11. Many people won't like hearing this, but we kinda owe them right now.

We weren't a superpower back then. And we got dragged in anyway. Believe it or not, the US doesn't need to be the "world police". Also, we don't owe Israel shit. Netanyahu was fine with 9/11 since it was "good for Israel". Props for being honest but fuck him anyway.

Ramaswamy dared to say that we should stop giving Israel billions but then had to backtrack. I'm tired of this "Israel is our greatest ally" speil. They have been nothing but trouble for us.

That being said, I do not condone violence and what they did will only make things worse in the middle east.

 

[kage69]

Absolutely incorrect about who owes who a debt.

It's ok that you don't understand, the point is our Executive and Pentagon do. This is what you do for allies in need during a serious crisis. I don't care for Israel's espionage either, but it's immaterial here unfortunately, sorry.

I'll skip answering the rest as it's just ranting about issues I've already sounded off about. Like I said, some people won't like to hear it...

 

[kage69]

We weren't a superpower back then. And we got dragged in anyway. Believe it or not, the US doesn't need to be the "world police". Also, we don't owe Israel shit. Netanyahu was fine with 9/11 since it was "good for Israel". Props for being honest but fuck him anyway.

Ramaswamy dared to say that we should stop giving Israel billions but then had to backtrack. I'm tired of this "Israel is our greatest ally" speil. They have been nothing but trouble for us.

I used it as an example of why isolation isn't really viable for us, it's only gotten more evident since then.

Believe it or not, you sound like you skipped all of your history classes and don't have the foggiest idea what allowed the post WWII global recovery to happen. I'm going to pass on providing you that cursory background knowledge, sorry. I just get impression it would be a complete waste of time, you understand.

But what a coincidence, I'm tired too... of people like you resorting to false attribution because you're too fucking lazy to read. I never said or implied Israel was our greatest ally, so might want to read all of my posts in the thread before you attempt to interpret and abbreviate them. Thanks.

I really don't give a fuck what Ramaswamy thinks or says, and neither should you.

 

[rommelrommel]

ROFL acting like Israel hasn't seeded a lot of this hatred for the last 100+ years in Palestine

Pretty amazing of Israel to have done this for decades before it existed.

 

[rommelrommel]

It's ok that you don't understand, the point is our Executive and Pentagon do. This is what you do for allies in need during a serious crisis. I don't care for Israel's espionage either, but it's immaterial here unfortunately, sorry.

I'll skip the answering the rest as it's just ranting about issues I've already sounded off about.

Everyone spies on everyone, getting selectively upset about Israel doing that is nonsense.

 

[PlanetJosh]

Having been gifted half of Palestine in 1948, Israel was beset on all sides by its Arab neighbors. No one is saying they didn't have a right to defend themselves, even if the home never belonged to them in the first place, it's theirs now. No use crying over spilled milk. Nice doesn't mean weak and doesn't mean not standing up for yourself, so bravo for Israel.

In 1949, Israel signed peace agreements with its neighbors, and as part of the agreements, Egypt controlled the Gaza strip.

In 1956, Israel invaded the Gaza strip. Regardless of their reasoning (which was mostly economical), don't forget that Israel are the invaders.

Decades of bickering later, we have the recent actions of Hamas.

Maybe if Hitler was defeated earlier or later then it would have led to the prevention of Hamas Invading Israel. It's not like I'm going way back to WW1 or even more way back to Biblical times. The time frame of WW2 is fine at least for now to show how the Nazis or some other regimes or respected governments could be blamed. By respected I mean whoever one thinks the good guys are. Like the US, France, India, China, Russia or other. And we'll continue to pick one over the other leading to it being political, peer pressure and aspects like that.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Pretty amazing of Israel to have done this for decades before it existed.

LOL acting like Zionists only started their takeover of Palestine in 1948

 

[Thunder 57]

I used it as an example of why isolation isn't really viable for us, it's only gotten more evident since then.

Believe it or not, you sound like you skipped all of your history classes and don't have the foggiest idea what allowed the post WWII global recovery to happen. I'm going to pass on providing you that cursory background knowledge, sorry. I just get impression it would be a complete waste of time, you understand.

But what a coincidence, I'm tired too... of people like you resorting to false attribution because you're too fucking lazy to read. I never said or implied Israel was our greatest ally, so might want to read my posts before you decide to abbreviate them. Thanks.

I really don't give a fuck what Ramaswamy thinks or says, and neither should you.

I would say it is people with your mindset that is the problem. Had did getting involved in Korea or Vietnam work out? How about nation building in the middle east? Oh, and let's not forget Iran. Good stuff there. But what do I know since I clearly skipped history in school.

 

[kage69]

Everyone spies on everyone, getting selectively upset about Israel doing that is nonsense.

<------- choir

 

[kage69]

But what do I know since I clearly skipped history in school.

I don't know, but I think it's worth your time to try being honest about representing other people's positions. That might stop you from trying to disagree over topics you know little about, with people who aren't saying what you think they are.

You really don't like Israel. We get it. There's no need to go all frothy with the straw. My takes on those conflicts can actually be found in my post history here, and I'm guessing by your attitude you'd be pretty surprised were you to read them. Hints: I'm very pro Korea, love the place. I also think Vietnam was entitled to the same deal the Philippines got after WWII. Vietnam was a waste, a lot like Cheney's Adventure. Do a search for me posting about 'nation building' or Iraq. I dare you. Go ahead, help yourself to that good stuff there.

Yep, huge American imperialist here. You got me.

Commenting on the relationship between the defense structures of the US and Israel, that reciprocity exists between allies during times of crisis. Man, I got some nerve huh?

 

[Zor Prime]

I don't think anybody is disputing that Israel is a shithead that does shithead things. If someone is I must have missed it.

 

[Zor Prime]

Israel has amassed approx. 100,000 reservists along Gaza. Fuse is lit.

 

[dank69]

This is going to get ugly. Israel is going to re-occupy Gaza for awhile, and will very likely be air striking Iran within days. It's quite possible the US will end up getting involved as well. And it could widen much farther than that.

Why would Israel strike Iran?

 

[Thunder 57]

Yes, as you keep demonstrating.

You really don't like Israel. We get it. There's no need to go all frothy with the straw. Literally every single issue you just tried to divert with can be found in my post history here, and I'm guessing by your attitude you'd be pretty surprised were you to read them.

Yep, huge American imperialist here. You got me.

Letting people know about the relationship between the defense structures of the US and Israel, that reciprocity exists between allies during times of crisis. Man, I got some nerve huh?

Just because I think it's their problem doesn't mean I don't like them. I see no point in sending all of that money to Ukraine either. At least not time and time again. Maybe I would be surprised by what you have posted regarding other issue, but I don't exactly have time to go through people's post history.

Share intelligence with them? Sure. Send a carrier group over there and risk another "Gulf of Tonkin"? No thanks.

 

[PlanetJosh]

Why would Israel strike Iran?

Well going by one of the winding theories, not that I disagree with it, Iran is supporting Shia Muslims and sending money and technical plans for Hamas technicians to build drone missiles in Gaza. And those are a fairly big part of the recent invasion.

By the way Biden is resisting that theory as does various liberal news networks. I'm no conservative but it's a sticky thing for progressives and liberals to deal with. Because people are accusing them of helping the Hamas side with the humanitarian aid the US credited to Iran. Some of which is probably being used to fund the Hamas invasion.

 

[kage69]

Just because I think it's their problem doesn't mean I don't like them. I see no point in sending all of that money to Ukraine either. At least not time and time again. Maybe I would be surprised by what you have posted regarding other issue, but I don't exactly have time to go through people's post history.

Share intelligence with them? Sure. Send a carrier group over there and risk another "Gulf of Tonkin"? No thanks.

Yikes.

Yeah the Med isn't exactly low traffic and this isn't 1964. Your grasp on military capabilities seems tenuous at best, more of gripe about paying for things sounds like. I guess it shouldn't surprise me that you don't understand that if Ukraine doesn't win, the next Russian war involves us. As in, NATO. As someone who doesn't want war, you should appreciate and welcome being able to avoid a big one on the cheap I should think. Defeating an evil empire bent on war with zero American KIA, for the second time? Are you kidding me? You should be celebrating democracy and freedom winning, not advocating isolationism when people are being exterminated. Seems there was another war that featured that kinda of thing, something maybe you should reflect upon given it's relation to Israel the country that you don't not like. Sounds like a fun cause-and-effect tunnel no?

I digress. The reason you don't understand all that is the reason I won't be bothering with you on this subject anymore, sorry.

 

[Thunder 57]

Yikes.

Yeah the Med isn't a remote Pacific area with low traffic and this isn't 1964. Your grasp on military capabilities seems tenuous at best, more of gripe about paying for things sounds like. I guess it shouldn't surprise me that you don't understand that if Ukraine doesn't win, the next Russian war involves us. As in, NATO. As someone who doesn't want war, you should appreciate and welcome being able to avoid a big one on the cheap I should think. Defeating an evil empire bent on war with zero American KIA, for the second time? You should be celebrating democracy and freedom serving up defeat for a terrorist state bent on conquest and genocide. It's a shame you aren't.

The reason you don't understand that is the reason I won't be bothering with you on this subject anymore, sorry.

Russia has its hands full with Ukraine and those against the war at home. You really think if they did win they'd go after NATO? Well, maybe. Putin is batshit crazy and wants to rebuild the USSR. I think you would find that article 5 would fall apart quickly though as no one wants to get involved unless they were attacked. Article 5 is a relic of the Cold War.