Israel: We Are At War

[Abwx]

...........................

Just say an article on Google News, didn't yet read and have no idea if true, but says that the Israelis have already fired on busses of people they ordered to leave. Can't now at the time of this edit find where I saw it.

There s a vidéo on the palestinian authority representative in France page in X, but i wont post it since it s not blured but we can see vehicles on the road fulled with luggages as well as killed people laying in the ground end elsewhere.

She say 70 children/women killed and 200 wounded.

On another note an old video about Netanyahou talking of his strategy, obviously peace was never a project, just an instrumentalised tool to render any palestinian state an impossible thing :

https://twitter.com/x/status/1711750682733355146

 

[APU_Fusion]

Captain obvious enters the thread says something obvious.

I'm staying on the sidelines here because there's nothing anyone can say on either side that is not gonna piss somebody on the other side off.

Opinions be damned.

Yes, because posting obvious compassion for the innocents on both sides deserves a captain obvious from you. Grow up

 

[Moonbeam]

Just say an article on Google News, didn't yet read and have no idea if true, but says that the Israelis have already fired on busses of people they ordered to leave. Can't now at the time of this edit find where I saw it.

It was cars not busses: https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/10/13/world/israel-news-gaza-hamas-war

 

[Moonbeam]

...........................


There s a vidéo on the palestinian authority representative in France page in X, but i wont post it since it s not blured but we can see vehicles on the road fulled with luggages as well as killed people laying in the ground end elsewhere.

She say 70 children/women killed and 200 wounded.

On another note an old video about Netanyahou talking of his strategy, obviously peace was never a project, just an instrumentalised tool to render any palestinian state an impossible thing :

https://twitter.com/x/status/1711750682733355146

I found the one I saw but didn't read just now probably as you were posting

 

[kage69]

The Israelis have been killing civilians and journalists for years and years now. This is just more blatant and larger scale. I mean they created an apartheid state, That doesn't happen without serious violence and oppression.

We knew who the Israelis were already on the hard right that has taken over the government. There are two sides of the same coin with Hamas except they actually have first world problems while the Palestinians have third world problems.

I fully expected the Zionist apologist here to defend Israel leveling Gaza which is what they will do for a bit, civilians and everybody inside because where you going to move a million people?

This is all par for the course. And I still love how the zionists look at this in a vacuum as if creating an apartheid state over decades is not going to have any blowback.

I can't find your course of action in there, help me out. What's your answer for people like me who are anti apartheid and anti war crimes, yet also consider terrorists roaming the streets murdering and kidnapping civilians to be horrifically evil?

Reminder: inaction is not a choice

Herzog's suggestion of collective punishment is insane and completely unacceptable. I feel that we, as in the US, need to offer assistance in facilitating an actual evac of civilians from Gaza, land and sea, with realistic timetables and no bombing during the process. If Hamas wants to go say hi to the Tamil Tigers when their families are out, I'm ok with that.

 

[Abwx]

It was cars not busses: https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/10/13/world/israel-news-gaza-hamas-war

Cars and a truck whose open plateform at the rear was filled with people, guess that s why the bodies seems to be scattered in a large area.

I feel that we, as in the US, need to offer assistance in facilitating an actual evac of civilians from Gaza, land and sea, with realistic timetables and no bombing during the process. If Hamas wants to go say hi to the Tamil Tigers when their families are out, I'm ok with that.

There s nothing to evacuate, that would be legalizing deportations, wich is a crime under international laws, that s why Egypt refused to open her territory even if it was possible, to each his responsabilities.

 

[Jaskalas]

NBC: Hamas documents show that terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and a youth center​

Maps and documents recovered from the bodies of Hamas attackers reveal a coordinated plan to target children and take hostages inside an Israeli village near Gaza.​

:thinking:
So much for the Hamas excuse that some OTHER people got overly zealous and that their people were merely attacking Israeli defenders.

 

[HomerJS]

Israel feels righteous in the reason for the war crimes because in their view because you cannot fight back against a terrorist organization without harming innocent civilians.
It would be the same way that the US feels righteous in taking out terrorists using drones even when we know that some innocent civilians will be harmed.

View attachment 87084

Drone are as surgical strike as you can get. There isn’t any kind of offensive strike where unintended casualties are zero

 

[KMFJD]

NBC: Hamas documents show that terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and a youth center​

Maps and documents recovered from the bodies of Hamas attackers reveal a coordinated plan to target children and take hostages inside an Israeli village near Gaza.​

:thinking:
So much for the Hamas excuse that some OTHER people got overly zealous and that their people were merely attacking Israeli defenders.

seems rather convenient, i've become skeptical though these days

 

[akugami]

I can't find your course of action in there, help me out. What's your answer for people like me who are anti apartheid and anti war crimes, yet also consider terrorists roaming the streets murdering and kidnapping civilians to be horrifically evil?

Reminder: inaction is not a choice

Herzog's suggestion of collection punishment is insane and completely unacceptable. I feel that we, as in the US, need to offer assistance in facilitating an actual evac of civilians from Gaza, land and sea, with realistic timetables and no bombing during the process. If Hamas wants to go say hi to the Tamil Tigers when their families are out, I'm ok with that.

I honestly don't know what to do. That's why I'm glad I don't have to be in charge of serious stuff like this.

Hamas is a terrorist organization. It needs to be wiped off the face of the earth. There is no defending the horrible actions of Hamas. No defense.

On the other hand the Israeli government, while not directly responsible for the rise of Hamas, definitely contributed to ill will from Palestinians towards Israel. Israel's human rights violations in Gaza fueled hatred from Palestinians. Instead of Hamas being a fringe terrorist organization, I would bet the majority of Palestinians are sympathetic, or was sympathetic, to Hamas.

Instead of more weapons, I would hope the US gives more effort into evacuating civilians from Gaza. Not only that, but preserve the right of these civilians when they return. Do not allow further Israeli encroachment onto territory that does not belong to them. Do not allow Israel to continue their oppression of Palestinian citizens who are not part of terrorist organizations like Hamas.

EDIT: Fixed a couple of typos and punctuation for clarity.

 

[Abwx]

NBC: Hamas documents show that terrorists intentionally targeted elementary schools and a youth center​

Maps and documents recovered from the bodies of Hamas attackers reveal a coordinated plan to target children and take hostages inside an Israeli village near Gaza.​

:thinking:
So much for the Hamas excuse that some OTHER people got overly zealous and that their people were merely attacking Israeli defenders.

That s not credible, they attacked the day of shabbat, that is, the day when kids have not school...
Sometime a half hair of logic is enough to debunk such stupidities.

On the other hand the Israeli government, while not directly responsible for the rise of Hamas, definitely contributed to ill will from Palestinians towards Israel. Israel's human rights violations gave in Gaza fueled hatred from Palestinians. Instead of Hamas being a fringe terrorist organization, I would be the majority of Palestinians are sympathetic, or was sympathetic to Hamas.

It s documented that Netanyahou sent one of his dark eminence to Qatar telling the qataris to keep financing the Hamas, at some point one wonder what kind of machiavelic game is played in politics.

 

[MrSquished]

The Zionists and the Russian invaders are both using white phosphorus. Even though they are enemies, they are both as shitty as each other.

 

[itsmydamnation]

i thought this wasnt bad review , but that could be largely because i had those opinions before watching

 

[woolfe9998]

Who says you HAVE to respond? What if the response is just to put new defenses in place to prevent a similar attack in the future? What if the response is to apologize for harassing Palestinians out of areas that Israel wants to take for themselves and just not doing that anymore? That way, if/when Hamas attacks again in the future Israel might have more international support because they aren't acting like a douchbag state.

You do realize that whoever takes that course of action must stand for re-election, right?

 

[Jaskalas]

Who says you HAVE to respond?

1: Then why, ever, did we allow anyone to attack ISIS?
We helped Iraq and Kurds turn entire cities into ruins. Mosul and Raqqa especially. Should have just let them have their caliphate, eh?

The idea that you can only defend yourself in the midst of an active assault is insane.
The best defense is a good offense.
2: Not only because damage to an opponent's home disrupts / denies their offensive capability, but because psychologically it creates a deterrence.

The ONLY reason nuclear weapons are not widely used, is because of MAD. Because of deterrence as a concept.
This applies to the crucial NEED to strike back when struck. Otherwise you are just begging people to find ways to harm you and your people. Sooner or later, they will find an opening. You need to call bluffs with actual offensive action. Or you are just a target. A meal for a predator. Nations would NUKE anyone they think would not strike back. Think about that. In today's world, we only live because we are also a threat.

Another example would be Ukraine. Should they NEVER be allowed to harm Russia? Should Russia get a free pass to throw missiles, with no retaliation, no retribution? They must face blood for blood, or there is no deterrence and no defense can ever be good enough. There is no substitute for slamming Moscow and other Russian cities with missiles and drones. Because a deterrence MUST exist and be upheld.

Taking losses and not fighting back is NEVER an option.
You would be insane to argue such.

 

[senseamp]

It's time for Palestinians to leave to other Arab countries.

A hot take...

View attachment 86787

People posting these maps never tell you what happened in 1967, so you think it was Israel who initiated the occupation out of thin air. They also jump from 1948 to 1967 without telling you that someone else annexed Palestinian lands in between before trying to invade Israel and annex its lands too.

 

[Braznor]

Hamas showing kidnapped babies in videos.

Hamas deserve the Hell that is coming for them.

MSN Link

In response to the video, the IDF took to their social media platform 'X' to assert that the children were effectively captives within their own homes under the control of Hamas terrorists, with their parents tragically deceased in adjacent rooms. The post underscored the visible injuries, audible cries, and palpable fear these children experienced as they remained hostage to Hamas terrorists, reaffirming the commitment to defeating these individuals identified as terrorists.

 

[dank69]

You do realize that whoever takes that course of action must stand for re-election, right?

That doesn't fly with me. I think representatives should put the well being of their constituents above their ability to maintain power. Sure you can argue that the people may just elect someone who will do what they think should be done, but then the blame rests squarely on the voters and not the representatives. This is the main reason I'm not super emotional about the Hamas attack. It certainly seems that the majority of Israeli voters are shitbags, equivalent to our magats. Definitely sucks for the non-shitbags though.

 

[dank69]

1: Then why, ever, did we allow anyone to attack ISIS?
We helped Iraq and Kurds turn entire cities into ruins. Mosul and Raqqa especially. Should have just let them have their caliphate, eh?

The idea that you can only defend yourself in the midst of an active assault is insane.
The best defense is a good offense.
2: Not only because damage to an opponent's home disrupts / denies their offensive capability, but because psychologically it creates a deterrence.

The ONLY reason nuclear weapons are not widely used, is because of MAD. Because of deterrence as a concept.
This applies to the crucial NEED to strike back when struck. Otherwise you are just begging people to find ways to harm you and your people. Sooner or later, they will find an opening. You need to call bluffs with actual offensive action. Or you are just a target. A meal for a predator. Nations would NUKE anyone they think would not strike back. Think about that. In today's world, we only live because we are also a threat.

Another example would be Ukraine. Should they NEVER be allowed to harm Russia? Should Russia get a free pass to throw missiles, with no retaliation, no retribution? They must face blood for blood, or there is no deterrence and no defense can ever be good enough. There is no substitute for slamming Moscow and other Russian cities with missiles and drones. Because a deterrence MUST exist and be upheld.

Taking losses and not fighting back is NEVER an option.
You would be insane to argue such.

I am all for defending yourself. I am not for invasion. Every precaution possible should be made to prevent civilian casualties. As I said earlier, if Ukraine started slaughtering Russian civilians international support would evaporate. Why should Israel be different? Especially considering that Israel is more analogous to Russia the past few decades at least. Hamas responding by slaughtering civilians is why I don't support them either. It's clear both of them want to continue creating hell on earth for each other.

 

[Puffnstuff]

At least the IDF gave the civilians 24 hours to evacuate the areas they intend to punish. Then today they specified specific protected routes for additional time. Hamas just ran in and killed without warning.

Since the Hamas was elected to represent gaza let them all enjoy the fruits of their labors.

 

[Abwx]

Hamas showing kidnapped babies in videos.

Hamas deserve the Hell that is coming for them.

MSN Link

The guy who talk say :

"There s mercy in our hearts, we do not kill your babies like you do with ours"...

Seems that you are easy to fool, why would they act like this if they were to kill babies..?...

This video contradict the propaganda of the israelis, so they are saying that it is bluff against all visible evidence, their aim was to diabolize the palestinians so the gullible would side with the war crimes they are perpetrating in Gaza where 600+ children are already torned apart by massive bombings and a lot more to follow.

From your answer it look that you are just a palestinian hater that forge things that do not exist just to justify your hate to the point of reversing the visible truth...

Menwhile here what you are advocating for :

https://twitter.com/x/status/1713157927882674283

 

[amenx]

That s not credible, they attacked the day of shabbat, that is, the day when kids have not school...
Sometime a half hair of logic is enough to debunk such stupidities.



It s documented that Netanyahou sent one of his dark eminence to Qatar telling the qataris to keep financing the Hamas, at some point one wonder what kind of machiavelic game is played in politics.

Good catch. Incredible how gullible some ppl can be not to realize that disinformation and false propaganda are routinely used in conflict. And with probably no country doing it more so than the Israelis. These fake maps/terror plans are just the simple stuff for them.

Lavon Affair - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Braznor]

The guy who talk say :

"There s mercy in our hearts, we do not kill your babies like you do with ours"...

Seems that you are easy to fool, why would they act like this if they were to kill babies..?...

This video contradict the propaganda of the israelis, so they are saying that it is bluff against all visible evidence, their aim was to diabolize the palestinians so the gullible would side with the war crimes they are perpetrating in Gaza where 600+ children are already torned apart by massive bombings and a lot more to follow.

From your answer it look that you are just a palestinian hater that forge things that do not exist just to justify your hate to the point of reversing the visible truth...

Menwhile here what you are advocating for :

https://twitter.com/x/status/1713157927882674283

And you believe them?

 

[Leeea]

That s not credible, they attacked the day of shabbat, that is, the day when kids have not school...
Sometime a half hair of logic is enough to debunk such stupidities.

I don't see how that discredits it at all?

It seems probable the planners did not know the exact day the attack would take place.

It also seems probable if a festival is being held, people would gather at a community center. Having grown up in a smaller and excessively religious town we used the school auditorium for multiple purposes.

 

[KMFJD]

Israel/OPT: Identifying the Israeli army’s use of white phosphorus in Gaza

Amnesty International’s Crisis Response Programme gathered compelling evidence documenting the use of white phosphorus artillery shells by the Israeli army in densely populated civilian areas in Gaza, many of which may be considered unlawful indiscriminate attacks. Following the attacks on...

citizenevidence.org

Amnesty says they are using white phosphorous