Israeli Cabinet passes loyalty bill, Arabs angry

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manimal

Lifer
Mar 30, 2007
13,560
8
0
Its like making kids stand up and pledge their allegiance to a piece of cloth and chant monotone while holding their hands over their hearts...

Am I the only one who thinks the pledge of allegiance wrong? When we moved here to the US my little brother refused to say it at school and was punished for it. He stood his ground and refused and was sent to detention for a week.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
Yeah...here's the current US oath:

I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.


Israel's oath is pretty disgusting compared to modern standards, IMO.

And ours doesn't leave a lot of room for the non-violent/pacifists (conscientous objectors), for civil disobedience, or the non-religious.
 

lothar

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2000
6,674
7
76
This is no difference from the oath I took to become a US citizen.
Besides those who were born here, who here has actually taken an oath to be a US citizen?
I fail to see any uproar over this.

They want this for *ALL* citizens, not just Arabs.
 

lothar

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2000
6,674
7
76
If Jews and non-Jews enjoy equal rights, why do non-Jews have to swear an oath to a Jewish state, while Jews don't have to swear an oath to a non-Jewish state?
Jews have to swear an oath to the US if they want to become a citizen...
 

Freshgeardude

Diamond Member
Jul 31, 2006
4,510
0
76
JediY says I have no proof of this, but its a historical fact.

At this point I have not found the really correct google keyword to dig up the really proper proof, but this link is a start.

http://www.aljazeerah.info/Document...in All International Law By Ron Wilkinson.htm

Don't worry, Jedi I will find the link that proves it better if that is not good enough for you yet.


hahaha al jazeerah


thats worse than me posting jpost.

at least jpost gets stuff actually inside israel.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Excuse me, FGD, but does who says something have any bearing on the credibility of what is said?????

You are basically saying if someone you don't like who says 1+1=2, its must be therefore untrue just because YOOOU don't like the source.

FreshGearDude, you continually amaze me by your intellectual dishonesty.

Now are you going to honestly even make an cursory attempt to rebut what was said, demonstrate it to be false, or will you rest ALL your credibility on a pile of your own imagined bullshit?
 
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iGas

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2009
6,240
1
0
You are and the the rest of the right wing nut job Jews are becoming more and more like the Nazis that gases Jews, and the crazy Arabs that wanted to pushed Jews into the ocean.

Cabinet adopts controversial bill that requires non-Jewish immigrants to swear loyalty to "Jewish, democratic state".

"There is a whiff of fascism on the margins of Israeli society," Isaac Herzog, the social affairs minister, who belongs to Labour, told army radio on Sunday.

"There have been a tsunami of measures that limit rights ... I see it in the halls of the Knesset [parliament], in the commissions and departments responsible for legislation."

Similarly, Dan Meridor, a Likud party member, said the law would exclude 1.5 million Palestinians who are citizens of Israel and will create a rift between them and the state...

"The new citizenship law will make it impossible for Palestinian refugees and their descendants to return to their homeland," Marwan Bishara, Al Jazeera's senior political analyst, said.

"That's why such a law also pre-empts the final-status negotiations ... Palestinian refugees cannot vow allegiance to the legitimacy of a Jewish state - that would be de facto vowing allegiance to the Zionism that dispossessed them."
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Thankfully what igas points out is proof positive that all of Israel is not as bat shit crazy as Netanyuhu and his ilk.

And gives us all hope that a better mid-east compromise peace can be found.
 

iGas

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2009
6,240
1
0
hahaha al jazeerah


thats worse than me posting jpost.

at least jpost gets stuff actually inside israel.

Loyalty oath splits Israeli press

Nahum Barnea in Yediot Aharonot
The proposed loyalty law does not seem racist: it is really racist.

Ben-Dror Yemini in Ma'ariv
The word 'racism' is being heard in the media every 10 minutes. We defeated ourselves. It is permissible to criticize the proposed amendment in the matter of loyalty as condition for naturalization. There is no racism here. In principle, it does not apply to Israel's Arabs, and at this stage, also not Palestinians who seek permanent residency within the framework of family reunions.

Ze'ev Segal in Ha'aretz
The Neeman-Lieberman proposal lacks this emphasis on the state's obligation to ensure full equality for all its citizens.

[add]
Israel's Cabinet approves controversial loyalty oath -- LA Times

The proposed law would require Palestinians and other non-Jewish prospective citizens to swear allegiance to Israel. A critic says it 'pokes an unnecessary finger in the eye of the Arab minority.'...

"Every group in Israeli society interprets these two words — Jewish and democratic — differently," opposition leader Tzipi Livni told reporters Sunday. Requiring would-be citizens to make the pledge "doesn't strengthen Israel as such, and only creates fear and hostility between the various groups in Israeli society."

Even among Jews, the language is controversial. Secular Jews worry that a "Jewish" state might lead to the adoption of more religious laws.

"It is liable to turn the country into a theocracy like Saudi Arabia," wrote Haaretz newspaper columnist Gideon Levy in a piece titled "The Jewish Republic of Israel."

Some ultra-Orthodox groups also oppose the notion of a "Jewish state" because it might imply that man's laws are equal or superior to biblical law.

Because the proposed law would not apply to Jewish immigrants who come to Israel under the country's "law of return," constitutional expert Suzie Navot said the proposal may be regarded as discriminatory.

But opponents would be hard-pressed to overturn the measure in court because Israel does not have a constitution, and its basic law does not specifically guarantee equality.
I'm surprise that AT openly tolerates racism.
 
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JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,982
3,318
126
I'm surprise that AT openly tolerates racism.

I`m suprised AT tolerates you!

You see what you don`t get is that even Immigrants who become American have to take an oath of allegiance to the United States!!

yet I guess this means nothing to you...
There is a difference between the US declaration of independence and israel's

http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/peace%20pr... of israel


namely:


Quote:
The catastrophe which recently befell the Jewish people - the massacre of millions of Jews in Europe - was another clear demonstration of the urgency of solving the problem of its homelessness by re-establishing in Eretz-Israel the Jewish State, which would open the gates of the homeland wide to every Jew and confer upon the Jewish people the status of a fully privileged member of the comity of nations.



Quote:
On the 29th November, 1947, the United Nations General Assembly passed a resolution calling for the establishment of a Jewish State in Eretz-Israel; the General Assembly required the inhabitants of Eretz-Israel to take such steps as were necessary on their part for the implementation of that resolution. This recognition by the United Nations of the right of the Jewish people to establish their State is irrevocable.

Quote:
ACCORDINGLY WE, MEMBERS OF THE PEOPLE'S COUNCIL, REPRESENTATIVES OF THE JEWISH COMMUNITY OF ERETZ-ISRAEL AND OF THE ZIONIST MOVEMENT, ARE HERE ASSEMBLED ON THE DAY OF THE TERMINATION OF THE BRITISH MANDATE OVER ERETZ-ISRAEL AND, BY VIRTUE OF OUR NATURAL AND HISTORIC RIGHT AND ON THE STRENGTH OF THE RESOLUTION OF THE UNITED NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY, HEREBY DECLARE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A JEWISH STATE IN ERETZ-ISRAEL, TO BE KNOWN AS THE STATE OF ISRAEL.
 

iGas

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2009
6,240
1
0
I`m suprised AT tolerates you!

You see what you don`t get is that even Immigrants who become American have to take an oath of allegiance to the United States!!

yet I guess this means nothing to you...
There is a difference between the US declaration of independence and israel's

http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/peace%20pr... of israel


namely:


Quote:
The catastrophe which recently befell the Jewish people - the massacre of millions of Jews in Europe - was another clear demonstration of the urgency of solving the problem of its homelessness by re-establishing in Eretz-Israel the Jewish State, which would open the gates of the homeland wide to every Jew and confer upon the Jewish people the status of a fully privileged member of the comity of nations.



Quote:
On the 29th November, 1947, the United Nations General Assembly passed a resolution calling for the establishment of a Jewish State in Eretz-Israel; the General Assembly required the inhabitants of Eretz-Israel to take such steps as were necessary on their part for the implementation of that resolution. This recognition by the United Nations of the right of the Jewish people to establish their State is irrevocable.

Quote:
ACCORDINGLY WE, MEMBERS OF THE PEOPLE'S COUNCIL, REPRESENTATIVES OF THE JEWISH COMMUNITY OF ERETZ-ISRAEL AND OF THE ZIONIST MOVEMENT, ARE HERE ASSEMBLED ON THE DAY OF THE TERMINATION OF THE BRITISH MANDATE OVER ERETZ-ISRAEL AND, BY VIRTUE OF OUR NATURAL AND HISTORIC RIGHT AND ON THE STRENGTH OF THE RESOLUTION OF THE UNITED NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY, HEREBY DECLARE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A JEWISH STATE IN ERETZ-ISRAEL, TO BE KNOWN AS THE STATE OF ISRAEL.
Completely different.

One is taken an oath to the USA as the state/county, the other take the oath to Judaism as a religion.

<--- took an oath to become Canadian but didn't have to swear to become a Christian, Buddhist, Islam, or Jew.

The UN card doesn't hold any weight, because American, Brits, Australian, Poland, and Denmark have rendered it useless when they invaded Iraq.

If the UN is a righteous they should create a state for the Roma/Gypsies. And, should Jews play by the UN book, they should create a Palestinian state, stop stealing Palestinian land & water, stop illegal constructions, return the stolen land to the surrounding Arab states as some of the UN demands.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
 
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JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,982
3,318
126
Completely different.-- no it is not!!

One is taken an oath to the USA as the state/county, the other take the oath to Judaism as a religion.--- I am sorry but you obvioulsy did NOT read the article. No where in the article does it say that arabs have to take an oath to be Jewish....
It explicitly states -- The state of Israel is the national state of the Jewish people and is a democratic state in which all its citizens &#8212; Jews and non-Jews &#8212; enjoy full equal rights," he said. "Whoever wants to join us, has to recognize us."


All it is asking for is that the those who want to be come citizens of Israel they have to recognize Israel as the national state of the Jeweish people. It does not say they must convert to judaism....where do you read that in the article?
It talks about recognition...thats all! In fact it doesn`t ask anybody to denounce there beliefsa if they are not Jewish!!

<--- took an oath to become Canadian but didn't have to swear to become a Christian, Buddhist, Islam, or Jew.-- like wise you are not aking an oath to become Jewish.....the oath you take only states that you recognize Israel as the the National State of the Jews.....do you really enjoy getting schooled by me??

The UN card doesn't hold any weight, because American, Brits, Australian, Poland, and Denmark have rendered it useless when they invaded Iraq. -- the UN has always been a paper tiger...no teeth and contrary to what Lemon law would tell you -- the Un ain`t shit!!
Plus the UN charter specifically states how member states must treat each other. The charter makes no mention of how mmember states must treat non - member states!


If the UN is a righteous they should create a state for the Roma/Gypsies. And, should Jews play by the UN book, they should create a Palestinian state, stop stealing Palestinian land & water, stop illegal constructions, return the stolen land to the surrounding Arab states as some of the UN demands.-- the land was won while Israel was defending herself. According to the UN charter Israel does not have to give the land back!! Why?? Because the UN charter only deals with how member states treat each other!The palestinians are NOT a member of the UN...last time I cheked!!

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.



nope thats not true.....you have been listening to lemon law try to brain wash you into believing all his psychedelic fantasies caused by the shrooms he eats!!

If the Palesnians were a member of the UN...I would agree with you concerning returning legally acquired land..... shalom!
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
Let's clear this up, it's been said but is still being said wrong - this does not require non-Jews to swear support for Jews or to be Jewish.

It requires them to swear loyalty not just to Israel as it is now, but to Israel being a *Jewish State*, which is a desire of the right-wing Israelis.

Israel is having it both ways now - a Jewish state, but one claiming 'equal rights' for all, as if a situation where non-Jews became the majority, that'd be just fine.

This contradiction goes back to the 1948 Declaration of Independence it seems, mentioning both a 'Jewish state' and 'equal rights' for Jews and non-Jews.

What I notice is a real bias among most who discuss the issue, in favor of Israel.

That isn't to say they're wrong - Israel has a lot of valid points, but I don't see a very principled discussion generally, but one based on bias for Israel.

Things that would be attacked if another religion did them are defended in the case of Israel doing them; injustices are swept under the rug.

It does remind me a bit of when racism against blacks was accepted in the US, and prohibiting it and increasing equality was viewed with horror as radical and impractical.

It's not that easy bringing change, and there's far less to support it in the Israel-Palestinian conflict than there was in the US made up of all co-existing citizens.
 

woolfe9999

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2005
7,164
0
0
If Jews and non-Jews enjoy equal rights, why do non-Jews have to swear an oath to a Jewish state, while Jews don't have to swear an oath to a non-Jewish state?

Because in the State of Israel, they have blatant inequality in their oath swearing practices and certain other symbolic rituals. The equality only comes in for minor things like housing, jobs and education. But where it really matters - the symbolic stuff - they're terribly unequal.

Oh right, there is one tangible area where they do discriminate. They force Jews to serve in their armed forces, whereas for Arabs the service is optional.

- wolf
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
Because in the State of Israel, they have blatant inequality in their oath swearing practices and certain other symbolic rituals. The equality only comes in for minor things like housing, jobs and education. But where it really matters - the symbolic stuff - they're terribly unequal.

Oh right, there is one tangible area where they do discriminate. They force Jews to serve in their armed forces, whereas for Arabs the service is optional.

- wolf

Housing - isn't something like over 10% of the land in Israel owned by a fund set up specifically to only let Jews live on it, funded by donations around the world?

Apparently, the fund has had a setback in the Israeli courts finally, ordering it to be more fair, but still.

Apparently, there are many, many other types of discrimination documented that aren't just 'symbolic'. On the other hand, to be fair, it could be a lot worse.

I'm not that familiar with the policies of a lot of neighbors on Jews, but for example, doesn't Saudi Arabia not even allow them entry, for example?

I would not be surprised if Israel treats arabs a lot better than the other way around.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
If you have been to an Arab country (stamp in passport) you can't enter Israel. You must get a new passport to enter.

Wow, that's the first I heard of that. Are you sure?

A google said the opposite:

However, Israel doesn't impose restrictions on tourists entering who have already travelled to Arab countries.

However, it does say 'tourists', maybe it's different for non-tourists?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/travel/your_say/article4064457.ece
 

woolfe9999

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2005
7,164
0
0
Housing - isn't something like over 10&#37; of the land in Israel owned by a fund set up specifically to only let Jews live on it, funded by donations around the world?

Apparently, the fund has had a setback in the Israeli courts finally, ordering it to be more fair, but still.

Apparently, there are many, many other types of discrimination documented that aren't just 'symbolic'. On the other hand, to be fair, it could be a lot worse.

I'm not that familiar with the policies of a lot of neighbors on Jews, but for example, doesn't Saudi Arabia not even allow them entry, for example?

I would not be surprised if Israel treats arabs a lot better than the other way around.

You'll have to be specific. I know that Israel is not perfect. However, essentially Arabs in Israel are treated no worse than minorities are treated in the U.S. in 2010. In other words - it isn't perfect but it is a lot better than what goes on in Arab states or most of the developing world, or China, etc. I don't mind people criticizing it. In fact, I don't really like the oath law. I can see why it would piss off the Arab Israelis, and the timing of it is obviously terrible.

However, I think Israel's conduct with respect to its Arab citizens is kind of under a more intense microscope than the actions of other nations with respect to their own minorities. There is a heightened scrutiny going on there by people on the left, and it is a double standard that they almost never say anything about worse practices elsewhere.

- wolf
 
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mutz

Senior member
Jun 5, 2009
343
0
0
Take the public transportation, now many don't know this but if Rosa Parks were to ride a bus in Israel, she would be confined to the back of the bus and if she resisted, she would be arrested for it.
WTF?

MAYBE in certain heavily religious area's, and even so, she would not get herself arrested!
yeah, girls in Israel can wear pants, what did you make this country, Iran?!?

E:
If you have been to an Arab country (stamp in passport) you can't enter Israel. You must get a new passport to enter.
maybe arab countries which do not share "peace" with Israel,
man, some people go from here to Libya, wake up!

You'll have to be specific. I know that Israel is not perfect. However, essentially Arabs in Israel are treated no worse than minorities are treated in the U.S. in 2010. In other words - it isn't perfect but it is a lot better than what goes on in Arab states or most of the developing world, or China, etc. I don't mind people criticizing it. In fact, I don't really like the oath law. I can see why it would piss off the Arab Israelis, and the timing of it is obviously terrible.
you'r perfectly right,
they still treat Arab population here quite badly, most of the people here are right-wing, you should see the terrible posts on the local news sites, and that law is obviously freaking fascist, kind of reminds of post WWII environment!
 
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Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
You'll have to be specific. I know that Israel is not perfect. However, essentially Arabs in Israel are treated no worse than minorities are treated in the U.S. in 2010. In other words - it isn't perfect but it is a lot better than what goes on in Arab states or most of the developing world, or China, etc. I don't mind people criticizing it. In fact, I don't really like the oath law. I can see why it would piss off the Arab Israelis, and the timing of it is obviously terrible.

However, I think Israel's conduct with respect to its Arab citizens is kind of under a more intense microscope than the actions of other nations with respect to their own minorities. There is a heightened scrutiny going on there by people on the left, and it is a double standard that they almost never say anything about worse practices elsewhere.

- wolf

I think there's some truth to that. I'm not sure about 'no worse than minorities in the US', and let's not talk about the Palestinians outside Israel, but otherwise, ya.

I suspect there are a variety of reasons for 'heightened scrutiny', some more legitimate than others.

One might be simply that people relate more to Israel, and so have higher expectations.

But others include that Israel, not other nations, is the #1 recipient of arms aid - we in effect have ensured their presence and made them the most powerful military presence in the region. I think there's some sense that 'we - the west - put them there' and have some responsibility for the effects. That they have a *far* larger presence in the US as a part of our nation than the other countries.

There's only one nation in the world that both major US presidential candidates visited the interest groups of to pledge to protect its security as the American President - Israel.

And I think one big reason for the heightened scrutiny is simply that Israel has so much more presence here claiming its side on the issue, that they're being responded to.

It's hard to even find the views covered here of the 'other side' - I can barely recall hearing a word of Syria's side of the story, of Hezzbollah's, of Jordan's (except the charitable works of their American-born Queen), of Iran's (except for the coverage of 'that wacky president'), and really even the plight of the Palestinians gets very little coverage.

If someone *does* bring up the other side, I think it'd get more scrutiny and response, but you're right, it is heightened for Israel.

And I do think that a lot of problems/wrong/injustices in the other countries in the region don't get enough attention here.

That it's our mistake to just 'write off' the rest of the region - 'oh, they're just those crazy Muslims and they'll always have a terrible situation with dictators and such'.

We're sadly ignorant as a country - even including our leaders IMO - of the history of the region. Little seems to be looked at except the reliable flow of oil.

A book like 'The Devil's Game' goes a long way to informing readers of a surprising history.

We can both note the heightened scrutiny and look more at the often much worse issues with the other countries, and not make Israel just 'the victim' there and ignore theirs.

It's all too easy to fall into noting 'well, other countries are worse', and letting that wash away Israel's issues. The fix isn't ignore Israel's problems, but better note the others.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
You'll have to be specific.

- wolf

On that, there's some interesting reading in an article on Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel

Here's a section on the fund that I mentioned.

The Jewish National Fund is a private organization established in 1901 to buy and develop land in the Land of Israel for Jewish settlement; land purchases were funded by donations from world Jewry exclusively for that purpose.[164] The JNF currently owns 13% of land in Israel,[165][166] while 79.5% is owned by the government (this land is leased on a non-discriminatory basis)[citation needed], and the rest, around 6.5%, is evenly divided between private Arab and Jewish owners.[167] Thus, the ILA administers 93.5% of the land in Israel (Government Press Office, Israel, 22 May 1997). A significant portion of JNF lands were originally properties left behind by Palestinian "absentees" and as a result the legitimacy of some JNF land ownership has been a matter of dispute.[164][168][169][170] The JNF purchased these lands from the State of Israel between 1949 and 1953, after the state took control of them according to the Absentee Properties Law.[171][172] While the JNF charter specifies the land is for the use of the Jewish People, land has been leased to Bedouin herders.[173] Nevertheless, JNF land policy has been criticized as discrimination.[171] When the Israel Land Administration leased JNF land to Arabs, it took control of the land in question and compensated the JNF with an equivalent amount of land in areas not designated for development (generally in the Galilee and the Negev), thus ensuring that the total amount of land owned by the JNF remains the same.[172][174] This was a complicated and controversial mechanism, and in 2004 use of it was suspended. After Supreme Court discussions and a directive by the Attorney General instructing the ILA to lease JNF land to Arabs and Jews alike, in September 2007 the JNF suggested reinstating the land-exchange mechanism.[172][175]

While the JNF and the ILA view an exchange of lands as a long-term solution, opponents say that such maneuvers privatize municipal lands and preserve a situation in which significant lands in Israel are not available for use by all of its citizens.[166] As of 2007, the High Court delayed ruling on JNF policy regarding leasing lands to non-Jews,[166] and changes to the ILA-JNF relationship were up in the air.[172] Adalah and other organizations furthermore express concern that proposed severance of the relation between the ILA and JNF, as suggested by Ami Ayalon, would leave the JNF free to retain the same proportion of lands for Jewish uses as it seeks to settle hundreds of thousands of Jews in areas with a tenuous Jewish demographic majority (in particular, 100,000 Jews in existing Galilee communities[171] and 250,000 Jews in new Negev communities via the Blueprint Negev[176]).

The Israel Land Administration, which administers 93% of the land in Israel (including the land owned by the Jewish National Fund), refuses to lease land to non-Jewish foreign nationals, which includes Palestinian residents of Jerusalem who have identity cards but are not citizens of Israel. When ILA land is "bought" in Israel it is actually leased to the "owner" for a period of 49 years. According to Article 19 of the ILA lease, foreign nationals are excluded from leasing ILA land, and in practice foreigners may just show that they qualify as Jewish under the Law of Return.[177]

Israeli law also discriminates between Jews and Arabs regarding rights to recover property owned before the dislocations created by the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.[15][dead link] The 1950 Absentees Property Law stipulated that any property within post-war Israel which was owned by an Arab who had left the country between 29 November 1947 and 19 May 1948, or by a Palestinian who had merely been abroad or in area of Palestine held by hostile forces up to 1 September 1948, lost all rights to that property. Palestinians who fled or were expelled from their homes by Jewish or Israeli forces, before and during the 1948 Arab-Israeli war, but remained within the borders of what would become Israel, that is, those currently known as Arab citizens of Israel, are deemed present absentees by the legislation. Present absentees are regarded as absent by the Israeli government because they left their homes, even if they did not intend to leave them for more than a few days, and even if they did so involuntarily.[178]

Following the 1967 Six Day War in which Israel occupied the West Bank, from where it annexed East Jerusalem, Israel then passed in 1970 the Law and Administration Arrangements Law allowing for Jews who had lost property in East Jerusalem and the West Bank during the 1948 war to reclaim it.[16][dead link] Palestinian residents of Jerusalem (absentees) in the same positions, and Arab Israelis (present absentees), who owned property in West Jerusalem or other areas within the state of Israel, and lost it as a result of the 1948 war, cannot recover their properties. Israeli legislation, therefore, allows Jews to recover their land, but not Arabs.
 

dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
11,345
2,705
136
It's like our pledge of allegiance. You put "under god" in it, means atheists don't really mean it when we say the pledge. It's just empty words. It's just laughable to put the word "indivisible" right after you put a phrase that divides people into believers and non-believers.

Um, I refuse to say the pledge until 'under god' is removed. It should not be there.
 
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